Do We Really Need This Kind of Bigotry?

[Levite]

It's nice that she wasn't born into a socioreligious ethnicity that would disown her if she found that the religion she was born into wasn't the one for her.

Who knows, maybe she found it easier to decide to leave a huge tradition that was willing to shrug off individuals when they feel dissatisfied with that tradition, so that she could join a small tradition that isn't blasè about losing even a single member.

 

[Levite]

.....not for long. Shall we bring it to the point?

The OP:

Can we agree that these protesters were Jews?

You posted that:


I posted that:

.... what was it worth to you?

Much later you posted:


And recently you initiated a conversion:


And you also pointed out:


See? No hypotheticals now.
Look at that for carelessness, then. You care for a community. You have joy at conversions, care not for their apostasies, do not take interest any previous socioreligious connections, yet voice firm opposition when a Jew leaves your community or any Jewish one to marry into another faith or religion!
Further to this, somewhere in Israel there are Rabbis who a Father to those thugs at that Israeli wedding, and if that Rabbi showed 'firm opposition' in any way at all then that Rabbi is acted disgracefully, being in a position of high responsibility in a country beset by severe conflicts!
I put it to you that this kind of gross carelessness for other communities needs to be addressed and corrected immediately, everywhere and forever.

I accept that somewhere in Israel is an Imam (probably Sunni?) who has had a most fruitful day with a convert from Judaism. That Imam needs to consider the same points, of course.

I do not support your firm opposition to that situation!

That's where I came in........ over to you, if you wish.?

I made it clear that I disagreed strongly with the protesters and any who would embrace violent confrontation and threats in response to intermarriage. So it is meaningless to equate my opposition to intermarriage and theirs: it is more or less the same as equating a progressive Episcopal minister with the Westboro Baptist Church, because they are both Christian.

Jewish law says that a non-Jew is not bound by the commandments we are; it also says non-Jewish religion is for non-Jews, as Judaism is for Jews, and makes clear that a person need not be Jewish to be righteous or cherished by God; and it says that a Jew is Jewish, permanently and irrevocably (whether they became Jewish by birth or through conversion). So it is unreasonable to expect us to care about how a convert's prior community might react to their conversion, or what rules govern practices of those religions: those things are not our business. Once a person converts, they are Jewish, and they are bound to live by our laws.

I'm fairly certain that neither Islam nor Christianity turn away converts due to concerns for how their original communities might feel or what the rules of their previous culture or religion feel about conversion/apostasy. I see no reason why we should be any different. I'm sure that woman's imam probably didn't care at all about how Judaism and the Jewish community might feel about her apostasy, and nobody should expect him to care. It's not his concern, and doesn't affect his Muslim community. It was her choice to do what is forbidden to a Jew to do: presumably, considering herself a Muslim now, she is able to live with that, or even not care about it.

As for your opposition to my position, it means nothing to me. Your views on the matter are erroneous and misguided, but fortunately, you are not Jewish, and thus the nature and structure of Jewish society do not affect you and are easily avoidable for you, and I am not obligated to worry about your thoughts on the matter, since you are not part of my community. Seems like a win-win situation.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I made it clear that I disagreed strongly with the protesters and any who would embrace violent confrontation and threats in response to intermarriage. So it is meaningless to equate my opposition to intermarriage and theirs: it is more or less the same as equating a progressive Episcopal minister with the Westboro Baptist Church, because they are both Christian.

Precisely.

 

[TashaN]

**MOD POST**

Thread is closed for staff review​