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Featured Do We Need Faith?

Discussion in 'Science and Religion' started by nPeace, Aug 14, 2022.

  1. SalixIncendium

    SalixIncendium Veteran Member
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    Why?
     
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  2. Rival

    Rival Divine Adoratrice of Amun
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    Even then, it depends how they do it. The Witnesses here have stands and wait for you to come to them. Many Christians hand out small flyers that you're not forced to take and can ignore. Sometimes, rarely, there are street preachers here but you're not forced to listen to them. Some Muslim groups give out free Qur'ans, which again you can just walk right past and they don't heckle you or anything. Imo as long as you can ignore them, I say let them go about their business.
     
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  3. 9-10ths_Penguin

    9-10ths_Penguin 1/10 Subway Stalinist
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    Original Sin.

    Kind of critical to Catholic theology, and it depends on the notion that every human being who ever lived is descended from one original pair of humans who committed the "original sin."

    The problem is that this just isn't how speciation works.

    Here too.

    But homeopathy is very much anti-science.

    Please be sure to lift with your legs as you move those goalposts.
     
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  4. Rival

    Rival Divine Adoratrice of Amun
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    No, you're misunderstanding the point of the Genesis myths. Many Catholics here have believed in evolution for decades now and found it no problem to reconcile with their belief in Original Sin.

    I never thought of it as that, more as an alternate means some people prefer. Let them to it.

    How am I moving goalposts? My original assertion to you was that this is not a European phenomenon; that most Christians and others here don't see a conflict between religion and science. These people aren't here to cause problems in the first place.
     
  5. Link

    Link Veteran Member
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    We need to be guided. The best guidance comes from God. Then religions and sects vary how they are guided by guidance from God and guidance by humans. Some more astray then others.

    In my view, if we cut the middle-men between God's guidance and us, things will simplify very fast. Quran and Ahlulbayt (a) words are meant to be read.

    That said, I have more sympathy with atheists, in that, there's no point of religion if we all going to just pick false ones. Guidance from God is not necessary if it's okay to pick false religions.
     
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  6. Audie

    Audie Veteran Member

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    Seriously?
     
  7. Audie

    Audie Veteran Member

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    What is seen and what is there are not
    necessarily the same thing.
     
  8. 9-10ths_Penguin

    9-10ths_Penguin 1/10 Subway Stalinist
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    Well, based on their size, Christianity and Islam together represent most "religion" worldwide, and they both proselytize.

    I'm not sure I'd agree that non-proselytizing religions aren't a problem, though.
     
  9. Alien826

    Alien826 Older than dirt

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    But how would you find your way to church? ;)
     
  10. 9-10ths_Penguin

    9-10ths_Penguin 1/10 Subway Stalinist
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    No, your original assertion was that the conflict between science and religion was "phony."

    "Phony" and "real, but happens in places where I don't live" are different things.
     
  11. Audie

    Audie Veteran Member

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    As if I need a treatise on the role of myths.

    Physicalist. So I was right.
    Them physicists don't exist.

    Can you identify things that cannot be
    in any way be detected?
    Faith in such is pretty irrational, a much
    prized state of mind, tho, in all religions.

    I fail to see value in it.
     
  12. Rival

    Rival Divine Adoratrice of Amun
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    No, you misunderstand me.

    I believe there is no conflict between religion and science.

    I agree there are people who think that there is and go about their lives as though there is. I believe those people are mistaken and, as I said, misunderstand the points of both religion and science. Most of the folks are not in Europe.

    :handpointdown:
     
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  13. sun rise

    sun rise Śvāna Dharma
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    "Blind Men and the Elephant"

    This absolutist comment is typical of some atheists lumping the ideas of some religious people into a denunciation of all religions. It is neither logical nor correct and in fact at least one logical fallacy applies.

    Good question. They are different.
     
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  14. gnostic

    gnostic The Lost One

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    I think most of the major problems with some religions are when they get involved in politics.

    When they gain political powers they have the tendencies to impose their religions upon others. Inequality then become a problem, socially, legally, politically.

    They tried to get involve in your culture, social life, and tried to undermine education, especially in sciences.

    Here, you see some of them trying to use or plant false information about science (misinformation), using propaganda.

    Powers corrupt. So mixing religions and politics is a terrible combination, because it is a recipe for oppression.
     
    #34 gnostic, Aug 14, 2022
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2022
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  15. Nimos

    Nimos Well-Known Member

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    From what you have written here, I'm not convinced that you have really examined what science is or at least not understood it. Because it is almost complete nonsense.

    I'm sure that Atheist would argue, "...but we need science. We don't need religion."

    That is not an argument for science, we don't inherently need science for anything, besides achieving and expanding personal goals. Before science saw the light of day people still managed. When we were living in caves, people still managed.

    We need food and water to survive or we die, we don't need science or religion.

    An argument for science is related to achieving other things and not science itself, knowledge being the primary goal and to make life improvements in most cases. The reason we need science to achieve these things is due to the method it uses, which helps to give us an objective answer.
    Religion doesn't make use of any methods for sharing "knowledge", which means whether the information comes from an old scripture or I wrote something related to the supernatural in this very post and claimed it to be true. There is no way for you or anyone else to prove me wrong.

    Science doesn't do bad things, the knowledge gained from it can be used to do bad things, no different than you taking a stick from the ground and slamming it into something so it breaks, which you couldn't do with your bare hands. Using that knowledge you can go hit someone in the head with it and cause severe damage. The knowledge of you have figured that out is not bad, you making use of it to hurt others makes you bad.

    So there is no such thing as good or bad science, except if we are talking in relation to the method. If you use it and manipulate your results or ignore others etc. then that is bad science.

    Comparing religion and science in the generalized way you do, makes no sense. One is science the other is religion. They work within completely different areas. Faith has no place in science.
     
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  16. firedragon

    firedragon Veteran Member

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    Yes. We need faith. Atheists have a lot of faith in a lot of things, like theists do. It's just a despise they have for the word faith that's making them deny. It's because the prophets of atheism on the internet use it derogatorily.

    I am not endorsing blind faith.
     
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  17. QuestioningMind

    QuestioningMind Well-Known Member

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    People require faith if they are desperate to hold onto a belief but have no good evidence to do so or even when faced with good evidence of the contrary. People who have good evidence for their beliefs require no faith. .
     
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  18. Audie

    Audie Veteran Member

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    As if I remotely said they are all the same.

    If you have to stretch that far to paint
    yourself as one of Superior understanding
    you achcieve the opposite.
    Just a tip, for future attempts.
     
  19. Audie

    Audie Veteran Member

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    Everyone sez they understand genesis
     
  20. vulcanlogician

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    Because when science figures out it has the wrong idea, it changes its claims. Isn't that neato?

    For the record, I think "getting rid of religion" is a terrible idea. Sure, there are interpersonally destructive aspects to religion. But there are some positives too. Some people find it indispensable. It would be wrong to take it away from them. Removing religion's power privileges that it's enjoyed for centuries has been done and is still being done, and that's good enough for me.

    Besides, religion is fascinating. The world would be more boring if we got rid of it altogether.
     
    #40 vulcanlogician, Aug 14, 2022
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2022
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