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Do religious people get it backwards?

Nimos

Well-Known Member
When we take on beliefs, we usually do so, because something convince of it being true and for pretty much all people this comes down to the amount and quality of evidence.

We don't normally prefer to take on beliefs, if we don't thing there is anything to back them up. So for instance, most people will have a very difficult time believing that unicorns exists, because we see no evidence for it being the case.

But to me at least, it seems like when you talk with religious people about their faith in a God or the supernatural, that they take an opposite approach.

Meaning....

God exist... therefore I have to find evidence for it

Rather than doing what they would normally do....

I have evidence for this..... therefore I believe it

Now I doubt a lot of religious people will agree with this, so I would like to hear, how that is not the case for your particular belief?

(When I say evidence, I mean something that can be verified as being true one way or another.)
 

Gargovic Malkav

Well-Known Member
Do you believe I exist as a separate human entity? Or am I an A.I.? Or maybe I am just a projection of your own subconscious... How do you know what is real? Do you believe you have any choice in the matter?
 

Estro Felino

Believer in free will
Premium Member
Faith is related to the Latin verb fideo which means "to trust".
Theists trust in God's existence without having a tangible evidence. They feel it in their heart.
It is more like a sensation.
 

Gargovic Malkav

Well-Known Member
Faith is related to the Latin verb fideo which means "to trust".
Theists trust in God's existence without having a tangible evidence. They feel it in their heart.
It is more like a sensation.

The evidence is everywhere when one puts the right glasses on. It always feels words cannot properly describe it, like trying to explain a vague dream.
 

TransmutingSoul

Veteran Member
Premium Member
When we take on beliefs, we usually do so, because something convince of it being true and for pretty much all people this comes down to the amount and quality of evidence.

We don't normally prefer to take on beliefs, if we don't thing there is anything to back them up. So for instance, most people will have a very difficult time believing that unicorns exists, because we see no evidence for it being the case.

But to me at least, it seems like when you talk with religious people about their faith in a God or the supernatural, that they take an opposite approach.

Meaning....

God exist... therefore I have to find evidence for it

Rather than doing what they would normally do....

I have evidence for this..... therefore I believe it

Now I doubt a lot of religious people will agree with this, so I would like to hear, how that is not the case for your particular belief?

(When I say evidence, I mean something that can be verified as being true one way or another.)

Evidence is required in Faith.

In fact I would have no Faith if there was no evidence.

Spiritual Evidence, is not necessarily Scientific evidence, but in the end when we become more clever, they will not clash.

Regards Tony
 

Gargovic Malkav

Well-Known Member
Then the odds are that it is not really evidence at all but merely personal prejudice. I like objective evidence. No rose colored glasses needed.

Can personal prejudice and individual subjectivity be fully put aside? I remember reading about photons that they can behave as waves as well as particles, but that it depends on how people look at it.
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Then the odds are that it is not really evidence at all but merely personal prejudice. I like objective evidence. No rose colored glasses needed.
Same here. Whats more truthful than direct observation and experience?


One has to address the motivation behind things like talking snakes, donkeys, magical fruit, unicorns, walking on water and what not, is certainly not forward thinking.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Can personal prejudice and individual subjectivity be fully put aside? I remember reading about photons that they can behave as waves as well as particles, but that it depends on how people look at it.
It can be very difficult to do so.

One thing to remember, evidence is supposed to be able to cut both ways. In the sciences one cannot even begin to have "evidence" until one has a testable concept. In other words to claim that one has evidence for their God one should have a reasonable test that would refute their God. That is anathema to most believers.
 

thomas t

non-denominational Christian
When we take on beliefs, we usually do so, because something convince of it being true and for pretty much all people this comes down to the amount and quality of evidence.
please provide evidence for the assertion highlighted in red. Present a scientific study that shows that, for pretty much all people, yours is the method used when they arrive at a belief.
Thomas
 

mikkel_the_dane

My own religion
It can be very difficult to do so.

One thing to remember, evidence is supposed to be able to cut both ways. In the sciences one cannot even begin to have "evidence" until one has a testable concept. In other words to claim that one has evidence for their God one should have a reasonable test that would refute their God. That is anathema to most believers.

Can science be used in a positive sense on all aspects of the everyday world?
 

TagliatelliMonster

Veteran Member
Do you believe I exist as a separate human entity? Or am I an A.I.? Or maybe I am just a projection of your own subconscious... How do you know what is real? Do you believe you have any choice in the matter?

We know how forums work.

Advanced AI's are not that easy to make and cost quite some resources. There would be very little point to let one loose on religiousforums.com
And a forum-posting AI so advanced to the point of third parties not even noticing the difference between the AI and an actual human, would only be even more unlikely to encounter on religiousforums.com


Therefor the evidence of you being a human is extremely strong. So strong, that it would be nothing short of perverse to believe otherwise.

If god would be supported by evidence even only half that strong, I'ld be a theist.
 

TagliatelliMonster

Veteran Member
The evidence is everywhere when one puts the right glasses on. It always feels words cannot properly describe it, like trying to explain a vague dream.

I think you just confirmed the OP in a certain way.

In order to see "evidence" for god, one needs different glasses.
ie, you have "special rules" or standards when it comes to evidence for gods, as opposed to evidence for anything else.

So, you seem to be confirming the OP that theists have a "special" approach when it comes to their god beliefs as opposed to any other belief.
 
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