Do people often turn discussions that you’re in into debates about your religion?

[firedragon]

Do people often turn discussions that you’re in into debates about your religion, no matter what topic you’re discussing? I see that happening to Baha’is a lot, and I’m wondering if it happens to other people too.

It is actually not a very courteous thing to say this so i do eternally refrain from it but its absolutely true. Absolutely. With no doubt. With all due respect.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Exactly. And just before I saw this post, I reported both of you, stvdv for off-topic debating about a poster’s religion, and Tony for off-topic preaching. That was hard for me to do, because I like both of you, and I didn’t think that either one of you meant any harm.

Ha ha Jim

Regards Tony

 

[Jim]

Here’s an example of what I mean by off topic jabbing and stabbing at some group or category of people:

Of course scientism is a religion. ... In that case it probably has more to do with atheists and scientism adherents don't realize they are 'waking by faith'

In this case, there was no defensive reaction from the target group, so there was no flood of off topic debating.

 

[Dawnofhope]

Do people often turn discussions that you’re in into debates about your religion, no matter what topic you’re discussing? I see that happening to Baha’is a lot, and I’m wondering if it happens to other people too.

I think it tends to happen mostly to Islam and Christianity but it does happen to Baha’is too. I occasionally experience deliberate trolling with off topic posts. I usually ignore it and don’t respond. Other times I will respond if I feel my faith is being misrepresented and the facts need to be clarified. If I believe the rules are being broken I will report the offending post.

 

[Jim]

Before I discuss any more examples, I’ll explain what I’ve been learning to do when I see off-topic posts jabbing and stabbing at my religion. If it looks to me like misunderstandings and misinformation, then I respond to that in a separate thread, not in the thread where it’s happening. If I wanted people who see the misrepresentations to see my response, I might post a link to it. If it looks to me like a reportable offense, I report it. Apart from that I just ignore it and don’t respond to it at all, not even to object to it or say that I’ve reported it.

 

[Dawnofhope]

I came to RF to find out about Bahai, because I read 1 book of Bahaullah I liked, but the Bahai followers in Holland were very belittling to other Religions (they said all Religions are good, but you need finally accept Bahai as the latest and most accurate to "make it"), which I found strange after reading Bahaullah's Book. So I wanted to check out if it was just the Dutch Bahai. I asked Adrian very specific about this and Tony also. And they assured me, that they do not think this way. For me that is enough, as I trust them. But I have seen others who don't have that trust towards Bahai.

Hi @stvdv
It is against the rules of this forum (rule 8) for a member of one faith to convince or entice another member to join their religion. If you want to know something about the Baha’i Faith I will happily respond. If you ask my opinion or thoughts about some aspect of Christianity, Islam, Hinduism or Buddhism I’ll share my thoughts if I have something to offer. I’m very positive about these four faiths. I’m not interested in subtlety steering you away from Hinduism to become a Baha’i You seem happy with you current faith.

 

[oldbadger]

Do people often turn discussions that you’re in into debates about your religion, no matter what topic you’re discussing? I see that happening to Baha’is a lot, and I’m wondering if it happens to other people too.

I think it happens to your threads, Jim, probably because you keep posting them as Debates. OK?

 

[oldbadger]

Before I discuss any more examples, I’ll explain what I’ve been learning to do when I see off-topic posts jabbing and stabbing at my religion....................

When a follower of a religion throws up so many doubts and criticisms of their own faith, that's more damaging for it than a whole bunch of critics talking about it.

Carry on..............

 

[Jim]

My topic in this thread is discussions being flooded with off topic debating about some group or category of people, calling attention to someone posting in the thread as one of them. So far I see 21 out of 68 posts in this thread as examples of that.

 

[Jim]

I’ll discuss an example of what I’m discussing in this thread, discussions being flooded with off-topic debating about some group or category of people. First I’ll repeat what I said about how I’m learning to respond to it. If I’m concerned about possible misunderstandings and misinformation, I might respond to that in a separate thread, not in the one where it’s happening. If I wanted to call attention to that response, I might post a link to it. If I think that it’s a reportable offense, I might report it. Apart from that, I just ignore it and don’t respond to it at all, not even to object to it or to say that I reported it.

Now for an example of how a thread gets flooded with off-topic debating about a group or category of people. Sometimes, not always but sometimes it starts with jabs and stabs against some group or category of people:

The moment you think "My way is the highway", you are cooked. ... the Bahai followers in Holland were very belittling to other Religions ...

... Such 'Religious' person has ZERO respect towards others' feeling ... before I speak to people who believe in evangelizing to be good, or who evangelize. ... are not worth any of my attention ...

Someone responds defensively, and goes beyond defense into preaching, including a quotation from scriptures:

I do not want to give you a wrong impression ... What I have been saying is that no one is compelled to accept that. I am not here to convince anyone that they have to accept that. ... how do we heal all the wrong in the world without a Unity based on a set of common goals? This can only be achieved by a divine physician.

"The All-Knowing Physician hath His finger on the pulse of mankind. ...”

The off-topic debating continues:

Oh, so I got it wrong then, it seems to me. ... Just to get it clear now. ...

Got it clear now.

You corrected my specific reply ...

Later on, another off topic defensive reaction to the jabbing and stabbing:

If you want to know something about the Baha’i Faith I will happily respond. ... I’m not interested in subtlety steering you away from Hinduism to become a Baha’i You seem happy with you current faith.

 

[stvdv]

Hi @stvdv
It is against the rules of this forum (rule 8) for a member of one faith to convince or entice another member to join their religion. If you want to know something about the Baha’i Faith I will happily respond. If you ask my opinion or thoughts about some aspect of Christianity, Islam, Hinduism or Buddhism I’ll share my thoughts if I have something to offer. I’m very positive about these four faiths. I’m not interested in subtlety steering you away from Hinduism to become a Baha’i You seem happy with you current faith.

Thank you (I already knew, because you explained this before). I am happy with my faith. I am also happy with others being happy with theirs.

 

[stvdv]

You went off topic to stab at some other people’s religious beliefs, and I reported that. I also reported Tony for responding to that with off-topic preaching.

I think you don't understand what I said. You put this in debate forum, asking about "why people negatively react to certain Religions. I gave my opinion as to why this happens: "If someone stabs me, my Religion, telling my Religion leads to Hell", then I will tell them "I don't like to be stabbed". I defend being offended in the first place

If you put it in "Discussion Forum" and not in "Debate Forum" then such things don't happen anyway

I believe this is the major reason why Religious problems keep on going. And thanks to Adrian, I still have a positive feeling about Bahai.

 

[Jim]

Here’s another example of a thread being flooded with off-topic debating about a group or category, this time a category of religions. Again in this example it starts with jabbing and stabbing:

this happens more with religions whose adherents tell others what they should believe or do, or religions whose views stand in opposition to or conflict with science.

That post was on topic, but with a little bit of jabbing and stabbing. Then from a direction that that I never would have expected, this defensive reaction:

Eastern philosophy is largely based on ...

That starts an off-topic debate flooding the thread:

Wanna try again, this time without the straw man?

Pacifism is metaphysics, which is synonymous to the dharma.

I see words, but I'm not sure what you are trying to communicate here. ...

Maybe you need a refreshment of the definition of ...

Ahimsa is not pacifism. ...

Passive is a onmonapia for peace ...

I'll take this as a "no." Thanks.

In my religion we are founded upon the dharma ...

The only way that I see for that debate to be on topic in this thread is as an illustration of what I’m talking about.

 

[Jim]

You put this in debate forum, asking about "why people negatively react to certain Religions.”

You’re misquoting the topic of the thread, in a way which gives me a new insight into how those off-topic debates happen. Thank you.

 

[stvdv]

Do people often turn discussions that you’re in into debates about your religion, no matter what topic you’re discussing? I see that happening to Baha’is a lot, and I’m wondering if it happens to other people too.

No.

In my experience, this happens more with religions whose adherents tell others what they should believe or do, or religions whose views stand in opposition to or conflict with science.

I’m also reporting off-topic debating about eastern religions, which came totally out of nowhere, and has nothing whatsoever to do with the OP.

IMO: I thought Eastern religion (+Atheism) has everything to do with, they usually are the victims of being stabbed at. And they only defend their faith

But I respect your OP, how you defined it now; no more Eastern views. Thanks for clarifying this. I will take this thread as "Discussion only", not as "Debate forum"

 

[Jim]

I see now that sometimes when people go off topic to jab and stab at some other people’s religions, they might actually think that they’re posting on topic.

 

[Jim]

IMO: I thought Eastern religion (+Atheism) has everything to do with, they usually are the victims of being stabbed at. And they only defend their faith

But I respect your OP, how you defined it now; no more Eastern views. Thanks for clarifying this. I will take this thread as "Discussion only", not as "Debate forum"

Maybe I’ve misunderstood the rules for debating forums. I didn’t think that it meant that anyone can debate about any topic, in any thread.

 

[stvdv]

You’re misquoting the topic of the thread, in a way which gives me a new insight into how those off-topic debates happen.

I quoted my opinion what I thought the topic of the thread was about. I 'misunderstood' the OP. I was not quoting the OP, just trying to figure it out

But I do think that talking about it will give new insights about how we all react to each other ... mostly misreading, reading too much into things
I think most people mean well on RF. Most people do the best they can, to share their experiences as good as they can

 

[Jim]

IMO: I thought Eastern religion (+Atheism) has everything to do with, they usually are the victims of being stabbed at.

Saying that they are usually the victims, is on topic. Debating about their beliefs, is not.

 

[stvdv]

Maybe I’ve misunderstood the rules for debating forums. I didn’t think that it meant that anyone can debate about any topic, in any thread.

Debate Forum, as I understood it, is most "safe" to post, and not getting reported
Discussion Forum you can define quite well what you do/don't want people to talk about