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Featured "Do not swear" (Alah)

Discussion in 'Interfaith Discussion' started by Teritos, Apr 2, 2021.

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  1. Clara Tea

    Clara Tea Active Member

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    Ehhhhhhh......maybe.
     
  2. Teritos

    Teritos Active Member

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    Matthew 5:33-37
    I say to you, do not swear at all, but make sure your statement is, ‘Yes, yes’ or ‘No, no’; anything beyond these is of evil origin.

    This passage is clear enough. If Jesus says, do not swear at all, we are not allowed to swear anymore. A Yes and a No is enough, also in a court.
     
  3. Teritos

    Teritos Active Member

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    The Law of Moses says that whoever swears and lies must be stoned to death, so why take that risk? Why should you risk your soul, your eternity? It is best not to do it. Jesus wants to protect man with this new commandment and not to annoy him. A yes or no is enough; no one should be forced to take this risk.
     
  4. Rival

    Rival Ankh, Wedja, Seneb
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    Where does the Torah mention anything about eternity and one's soul here?
     
  5. Mestemia

    Mestemia Advocatus Diaboli
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    As I already stated in the very post you quoted:

    It appears, based upon the referenced list of verses above, that the majority of the Bible flat out disagrees with you.
    But that is often times the case when you cherry pick a verse in support of a nefarious agenda.
    You believe what ever it is you like.
    But you are only fooling yourself.
     
  6. Teritos

    Teritos Active Member

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    Who sins must die, for the wage of sin is death. If someone dies, without having a sin offering he stays forever dead. A dead being is no longer a soul.
     
  7. Rival

    Rival Ankh, Wedja, Seneb
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    You have just interpolated all of this into the text. The text says none of this at all.

    - Not all sins come with the death penalty. Many commandments have no penalty attached.

    - Not all sins require sin offerings.

    - A dead person means the body has died. The soul continues after death and will be treated accordingly.
     
  8. sun rise

    sun rise "This is the Hour of God"
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    Why are you having trouble with the word 'swear' having two meanings which it does
    1. call as one's witness
      • take (an oath).
        "he forced them to swear an oath of loyalty to him"
      • take a solemn oath as to the truth of (a statement).
        "I asked him if he would swear a statement to this effect"

    2. use offensive language, especially as an expression of anger.
      "Peter swore under his breath"
     
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  9. Aupmanyav

    Aupmanyav Be your own guru

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    Indian courts do not require you to swear by any scripture. You have the choice.

    "As per the provisions of the Oaths Act-1969, a person can either swear in the name of God or solemnly affirm to state the truth while either deposing in a court or filing an affidavit or any other application before a court."
     
  10. Musing Bassist

    Musing Bassist Mihi Quaestio Factus Sum

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    Contriving bogus etymologies is the same method with which some Hindu nationalists claim Christianity as a distorted form of Krishna worship known as Krishna-Neeti. Or that the Vatican is really a Shiva temple. ('Cause if you squint hard enough...). With enough imagination you can use the X vaguely sounds like Y method to 'prove' nearly anything.

    In brief. Two words sounding similar does not prove an etymological connection.
     
    #50 Musing Bassist, Apr 3, 2021
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2021
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  11. Teritos

    Teritos Active Member

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    Every sin leads to death, we see this from the very beginning when God said to Adam, "If you do not obey my voice you will die". We see the hardness of the law also in Israel, when Moses stoned a man just for carrying wood on a Sabbath. Paul, a scholar taught by Gamaliel who is considered to be the most important rabbi in Judaism, also says that the wages of sin is death and only blood sacrifice can save man from this eternal punishment, as it is also written in the OT.
    I don't think so, because the Hebrew word for soul means "living being", everything that lives is called soul in the Bible. But when a being is dead, he is no longer a living being, but a dead being.
    Ezekiel 18:20
    The soul who sins will die.
     
  12. Mestemia

    Mestemia Advocatus Diaboli
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    So does this mean that all "sins" that God deemed is not worthy of death are not sins?

    You know, like:

    (1) Blinding or putting out of eyes in the case of captives (Judges 16:21 1 Samuel 11:2 2 Kings 25:7).

    (2) Chaining by means of manacles or fetters of copper or iron, similar to our handcuffs fastened on the wrists and ankles and attached to each other by a chain (Judges 16:21 2 Samuel 3:34 2 Kings 25:7); also alluded to in the life of Paul (Acts 28:20 Ephesians 6:20 2 Timothy 1:16); and in the case of Peter (Acts 12:6).

    (3) Confiscation of property that had fallen under the ban, i.e. had been singled out for destruction by the special decree of Yahweh, as in Numbers 21:2 Joshua 6:17; or had been reserved for the use of the army (Deuteronomy 2:35; Deuteronomy 20:14 Joshua 22:8); or given over to the priesthood (Joshua 6:19). The term may be extended to include all things vowed or sanctified and those irrevocably devoted or consecrated to God (Leviticus 27:21, 28). The idea is applied with special emphasis to those things which, because of their uncleanness, must not be used by the Israelites, though, through their warfare with the heathen, they might have come into possession of them (Deuteronomy 7:26 1 Samuel 15:16-23).

    (4) Dashing in Pieces (Psalms 2:9; Isaiah 13:18).

    (5) Divine Visitation. See VISITATION.

    (6) Exposure to Wild Beasts (Leviticus 26:22; 1 Samuel 17:46; Daniel 6).

    (7) Flaying(Rawlinson, Ancient Monarchy, I, 478; Nineveh and Babylon; mentioned figuratively in Micah 3:3).

    (8) Forfeiture (Ezra 10:8).

    (9) Gallows in the modern sense probably were unknown to the ancients. Where the word occurs in Esther 5:14; Esther 6:4; Esther 7:9, 10; 9:13, 15, it probably refers to a beam or pole on which the body was impaled and then elevated to a height of 50 cubits as an object of warning to the people (see "Hanging").

    (10) Imprisonment is frequently referred to in both the Old Testament and the New Testament, indicating that this was a common mode of punishment among both the Israelites and other nations (Genesis 40:3; Genesis 42:17 Leviticus 24:12 Numbers 15:34 1 Kings 22:27 Jeremiah 37:15, 21 Luke 3:20 Acts 4:3, 10; Acts 23:10; and the Epistles of Paul).

    (11) Indignities.
    In this term may be included all those outbursts of vengeance or other evil dispositions that were practiced in times or under circumstances when liberties with the prisoner were permitted on the part of bystanders or those who had charge beyond the execution of the judicial decree. Instances are found in the life of Christ (Matthew 26:59, 67 Luke 22:63 John 18:22); also in the life of Paul (Acts 23:2).

    (12) Mutilation (Judges 1:6, 7; Ezekiel 23:25; 2 Maccabees 7).

    (13) Plucking off the hair is alluded to as a mode of punishment in Nehemiah 13:25 Isaiah 50:6.

    (14) Prison garments were in vogue to mark the convicts (Jeremiah 52:33).

    (15) Restitution has been alluded to in the general introduction to this topic.

    (16) Retaliation was recognized by Moses as a principle, but the application of it was left to the judge (Leviticus 24:19-22). A fine example of it is found in the law of Deuteronomy 19:19.

    (17) Scorpions, Chastising with.
    Probably the use of thongs armed with pointed pieces of lead or other metal (1 Kings 12:11 2 Chronicles 10:14).

    (18) Scourging. See separate article.

    (19) Slavery. See separate article.

    (20) Stocks. See PRISON.
    Topical Bible: Punishments

    Interesting your claim that none of the above are "sins".
    Perhaps you can present the verse(s) you use to convince yourself of that?
     
  13. Teritos

    Teritos Active Member

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    God is Perfect and does not tolerate a single sin in His glory; He is absolutely Holy. But if someone commits a sin, he is separated from God, and to be separated from God means death, because God is life. The person who has sinned begins to grow old and sick until he finally dies because of the sin that has taken root in his flesh. The Bible clearly states that the wages of sin is death. And this means all sins. (Romans 6:23, Ezekiel 18:20)
     
  14. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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    Does not that means that no human being can come back to God? because there is not a single human in history that have never done a sin....that does not sound right..God is mercifull and God forgive.. or?
     
  15. Teritos

    Teritos Active Member

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    God showed His mercy by sacrificing His only son. Everyone who believes in this sacrifice is saved, and will be raised from the dead in the end with a new and perfect body that will not grow old and die.
     
  16. Mestemia

    Mestemia Advocatus Diaboli
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    So then a sinner who believes is saved from the death that all sinners receive for sinning?
     
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  17. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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    So in your understanding, a Christian can not sin today? they can do what ever they want?
     
  18. Aupmanyav

    Aupmanyav Be your own guru

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    Ah, those are Hare-Krishnas, that that is for consumption of Americans. Mainline Hinduism does not think about Abrahamic religions or their prophets / sons / messengers / manifestations / mahdis.
    I do not think that was very nice of Moses. But one can expect such savagery in Abrahamic religions.
     
    #58 Aupmanyav, Apr 3, 2021
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2021
  19. Teritos

    Teritos Active Member

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    The NT says that the sacrifice becomes valid by loving. Whoever says he believes in the offering but does not love God and his neighbor is deceiving himself. A true Christian who believes in the offering loves. John 13:34-35
     
  20. dybmh

    dybmh Terminal Optimist
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    My opinion as a Jew is that you're being hypocritical.

    Jesus in the bible swears an oath over 200 times. Anytime he says, "Amen", that's an oath. If those statements are not literally true, then, according to your assessment, he is liable for the death penalty.
    Matthew 21:21. He "answers" with "amen", not "nai".

    Screenshot_20210403_081915.jpg

    Has anyone been able to curse a fig tree, or move a mountain because of their faith? If not then, JC is guilty of bearing false witness, because he preceede the statement with "Amen". And according to the verses brought in the OP, the words following "amen" have evil origin.
     
    #60 dybmh, Apr 3, 2021
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2021
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