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Difference of zen and the yin-yang principle

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Jinse, Jan 23, 2012.

  1. Jinse

    Jinse Lawrence's other half

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    I know that zen= non dualistic
    yin-yang= dualistic
    zen= nothingness
    yin-yang= harmony

    Someone elaborate more? I found something not reconcilable when I talk with zen followers. Thank you ^_^
     
  2. Willamena

    Willamena Just me
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    I see in yin-yang duality contained in unity, which is essentially an image of nonduality. Light and dark in balance are form and emptiness in equal measure. A one and an other; take away one, and the other becomes the one and creates an other. Nondual means "not two." Take away the conception of divide between one and other, and you have nonduality (unity as a whole).
     
  3. Jinse

    Jinse Lawrence's other half

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    I think I see the opposite. Yin and yang for me is dualistic. It presents opposite things. Light and darkness, sun and moon, good and bad. Though different things both harmonizes each other. Different things that is part of the whole.Different but if one is taken away the balance shifts.^_^
     
  4. religion99

    religion99 Active Member

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  5. Jinse

    Jinse Lawrence's other half

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  6. idav

    idav Being
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    Zen is more like that Tao and the yin yang is sort of an explanation of the Tao. The tao is everything as a one single thing even though the philosophy looks at both sides of the coin. So anyhow Zen is Buddhisms version of Tao or possibly wu wei or "effortless action".
     
  7. Jinse

    Jinse Lawrence's other half

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    A follower of Tao if you are going to ask him what is Buddha they will answer that he is half light half darkness while a zen master would actually answer *nothing*. Do I get it right?
     
  8. Student of X

    Student of X Paradigm Shifter

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    And, both become the other. Sooner or later, yin becomes yang. Yang becomes yin.

    Everything BECOMES its opposite. Yin FLOWS into yang and becomes yang. Yang FLOWS into yin and becomes yin. It's hard to imagine yin and yang as dualistic when each is in the other and each becomes the other.
     
    #8 Student of X, Feb 28, 2012
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2012
  9. Jinse

    Jinse Lawrence's other half

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    Therefore it is a chain. I say its dualistic because it sees both. The yin and the yang. Not just the yin or the yang but both. As you said -Yin FLOWS into yang and becomes yang. Yang FLOWS into yin and becomes yin.- even if it shifts the other half does not disappear. When there is yin there is also yang. That is why I see it dualistic.
     
  10. DreadFish

    DreadFish Cosmic Vagabond

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    Well, I think the semantics of the situation are of no help really; you know, a rose by any other name, that sort of thing.

    The "dualities" of taoism are more like sides of a coin than opposing, yet balancing, forces. In zen, this "nothing" is more like nothing in particular. The Tao Te Ching also talks about this "nothing" in certain verses were it talks about a pot: it is round and shaped out of clay and painted etc., but it is the empty space inside that makes it useful; and the wheel has spokes etc., but it is the empty space in the middle that allows it to be used.

    So, nothing is more of "no-thing," a thing being something with a concrete independent reality of its own. Non-duality isnt monism, or oneness, rather it is not-two-ness. Each thing is definable only in relation to other things, the various "dualities" shape each other and depend on each other for their own existence. What is "light" if there is no "dark"? And how would we even define one without having experienced what appears to be the opposite of it? So all definitions and aspects have their base in interconnectedness. There are no-things as all are interdependent.


    While as a formal tradition, zen was probably influenced by taoism, I tend to look at it more as a matter that Lao Tzu understood the nature of things just as any other enlightened person would, and as a result, what he wrote down also matches what is described in other experiences.
     
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  11. DreadFish

    DreadFish Cosmic Vagabond

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    Yes, I particularly like that teaching :)


    EDIT: I think it goes and-in-hand with non-duality which is not "one," as in monism, but rather not-two. REality beyond conceptual confines, just as your link also mentions.
     
    #11 DreadFish, Feb 28, 2012
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2012
  12. Jinse

    Jinse Lawrence's other half

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    This I completely agree with. Thank you. ^_^
     
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