Difference between Sanatan Dharam & Arya Samaji?

[Gaura Priya]

ok firstly, i am a born hindu still have an Islamic take on Hinduism coz i am studying Christianity, Islam and Hinduism together.... and the most sensible I find out of these is Islam. Christianity is the continuation of Islam. Whereas Hinduism is a lot like Islam but ppl made it something else. When i say people made it something else, i mean that what people follow is not at all what Hinduism (Vedic Dharma) preaches. Coz even though im born in a Sanatan Dharmic family, i think Vedic Dharma is what actual Hinduism is. So people have started worshipping idols, so many Gods... thats why i used the term polytheism coz today's hindus believe and practice polytheism, which is a problem coz as even u said... according to the scriptures Hinduism as a whole is monotheistic.

Oh prabhu!

Just to remind you, this is a DIR (Discuss Individual Religions) forum... so it is only to be respectful about Hinduism... so if you want to extol about Islam, you can go there, or you can make your questions on the Debate or the Comparative forums.

The Baha'i Faith is the continuation of Islam, Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism, Zoroastrianism, Judaism, and all the other religions of the past. So I follow it, because it makes sense to me that the major religions of the world are divine, from God, and have appeared according to time, place and circumstance. In Hinduism, this is called kala-desha-patra.

That being said, I would exhort you to read Satyarth Prakash yourself and see what Dayanand Saraswati says... after all, Vedic Dharma disbelieves in the idea of prophethood or messengerhood, as well as avataras, and that we do not need Messengers or Prophets to guide us to Ishvara. You can read it in English or Hindi.

Most educated Hindus know and believe in one God. Literal polytheism only exists among the villages and other temples, and most Sanatanis are either by minority monotheistic (or Vaishnavas), or by majority monistic (Shaivas, Shaktas, Smartas, or Shankarites).

Apart form that, u mentioned that Baha'u'llah is the spirit of truth that Jesus mentioned. But isnt Muhammad the Spirit of Truth? or rather Angel Gabriel? coz most Muslims believe that Muhammad is the final messenger and a seal of Prophets... then how can Baha'u'llah be a messenger or manifestation of God?

This is an aside from the topic.

Yes, Muhammad is the seal of the Nabi (Prophets), but God never ever indicated that He is the Seal of the Rasul (Messengers). The nabi are the warners, who are like John the Baptist, or Elijah or Isaiah. The rasul are the Ones who give a Message from God, renew the Religion of God for humanity, and give the Scriptures. If you study the Qur'an, in every age, God sends a Messenger who will always be rejected by the peoples. Look how Krishna was rejected by the high-caste brahmanas in the religion of Brahmanism, or how the Buddha was rejected by His peoples who heckled Him and were jealous of Him.

Also, Baha'u'llah fulfills the idea of Al-Mahdi. Baha'u'llah's teachings is the Unity of God, the Unity of Religion, and the Unity of Humankind.

We know that Islam is spread by Muhammad and that the messenger who brought the message of Quran is Muhammad. And Quran says that Muhammad is the final messenger... and after this only Jesus is gonna come again, but not as a messenger. So if u believe Quran to be the word of God... how can u not believe that Mohammad is the final messenger and how can Baha'u'llah be the messenger of the same God? (i know im bing repetitive here... sorry for that)

And yes, Mohammad is mentions by name in the Bhavishya Purana, but the Kalki avatar is said to be Mohammad and not Baha'u'llah.... by many renouned muslim scholars... wat do u have to say abt this?.

Baha'u'llah is the Spirit of Christ. I'm sure you've studied how in the Bible, Jesus told His disciples that the people have not recognised that He is Elijah. He did not mean that He was literally Elijah, but the essence, teachings and spirit of Elijah was fulfilled in Christ.

Baha'u'llah says to consort with the followers of all religions in the spirit of fellowship and amity. He says that every religion is from God. And that Baha'u'llah says that this is the Age of the Most Great Peace, which is prophesied as the inevitable Satya-yuga.

Other than my personal belief in Baha'u'llah, I do not follow prophecy.

Honestly, prabhu, I could care less in the end what you believe. Just follow God, and follow the Manifestation of God, and try to do sadhana. That's it.

Now, unless you have any more questions about Hindu Dharma, or Arya Samaj and Vedic Dharma, you might want to start a new thread in the Debate or Comparative Religion section...

So no more talking about Islam, or Qur'an, or Muhammad, unless done within the context of Hindu Dharma.

 

[adi_149]

surely u cleared most of my doubts and i gained loads of new knowledge. Thanks for everything. I will do some research on Baha'u'llah (with all respect) and if i have any doubts will post it. Take care and thanks once again

 

[Gaura Priya]

Here is the Satyarth Prakash in Hindi, English, or Malayalam, since I do not know what language you speak. n__n

I hope this helps! Hari Om!

 

[Gaura Priya]

surely u cleared most of my doubts and i gained loads of new knowledge. Thanks for everything. I will do some research on Baha'u'llah (with all respect) and if i have any doubts will post it. Take care and thanks once again

No problem, Adi prabhu... It is my pleasure, and the pleasure of God that we should be able to peaceably talk!

May you be blessed by God!

 

[adi_149]

Thanks

 

[adi_149]

Friend adi 149,


Arya Samaj - Swami Dayanand - Vedas - Vedic - Haryana Online - India


Love & rgds

No problem, Adi prabhu... It is my pleasure, and the pleasure of God that we should be able to peaceably talk!

May you be blessed by God!

hehe yea catch ya later

 

[Breathe]

Falcon's summed it up nicely. There's nothing I can add to it, really.

I'm not an Arya Samaji, but I think they have some decent ideas. If you're still eager for more, you could always check out: Mission Agniveer - Vision Vedas

They have some decent intellectual stuff, but I'm a bit wary of them because of how much proselytism AGAINST other religions they do. I try and be a live and let live person, so I just ignore such things.

 

[nameless]

Whereas Hinduism is a lot like Islam but ppl made it something else. When i say people made it something else, i mean that what people follow is not at all what Hinduism (Vedic Dharma) preaches.

Actually vedic dharma gives freedom to practice religion in a way which suits for them, this freedom made it possible for many sages to achieve noble spiritual state.

thats why i used the term polytheism coz today's hindus believe and practice polytheism, which is a problem coz as even u said... according to the scriptures Hinduism as a whole is monotheistic.

actually polytheism, idol worship is not bad like it seems, it really works for those who needs it, there is nothing which is perfect always. Kindly dont underestimate these without making an attempt to understand its underlying principle.


And i dont believe hinduism is monotheistic, imo Hinduism in its early days was atheistic later it adopted all possible paths to truth. Hinduism is athiestic, mono-theistic, monistic, polytheistic simulaneoulsy, thats why it is said to be a way of life.

 

[Vinayaka]

Whereas Hinduism is a lot like Islam but ppl made it something else.

Hinduism is about as far away from Islam philosophically as you can get. I see very very little in common.

 

[adi_149]

Falcon's summed it up nicely. There's nothing I can add to it, really.

I'm not an Arya Samaji, but I think they have some decent ideas. If you're still eager for more, you could always check out: Mission Agniveer - Vision Vedas

They have some decent intellectual stuff, but I'm a bit wary of them because of how much proselytism AGAINST other religions they do. I try and be a live and let live person, so I just ignore such things.

wow thats a good website, i like a few things abt it. in case i have more questions, i will post em. for now...i need to look into a few things and do some research thanks so much..!!

 

[Satsangi]

true, but isnt that what hindus are suppose to do? where does it say we need to worship idols? (i am not an arya samaji) but now when i am reading the scriptures, i.e., the Vedas, i dont see anywhere that it asks us to worship the idols or Devtas? And im stressing on Vedas coz thats what all Hindus used to follow earlier and thats where Hinduism started. It would be great if u could help me understand abt it. thanks so much

There are many places where Lord Vishnu and Lord Shiva are mentioned in the Vedas and also their worships. Even the Upanishads gives basis to the Brahman with form (sah ikshataha- a Sruti for example). All the accomplished Saints of Sanatana Dharma have endorsed Murthi (not idol) worship- some of the contemporaray are Shri Adi Shankara, Shri RamaKrishna Paramhansa, Shri Ramana Maharshi. I strongly believe that these great Saints had the TRUE insight of the Vedas and the Brahman.

Regards,

 

[adi_149]

Actually vedic dharma gives freedom to practice religion in a way which suits for them, this freedom made it possible for many sages to achieve noble spiritual state.


actually polytheism, idol worship is not bad like it seems, it really works for those who needs it, there is nothing which is perfect always. Kindly dont underestimate these without making an attempt to understand its underlying principle.


And i dont believe hinduism is monotheistic, imo Hinduism in its early days was atheistic later it adopted all possible paths to truth. Hinduism is athiestic, mono-theistic, monistic, polytheistic simulaneoulsy, thats why it is said to be a way of life.

I like few of ur points that Hinduism is simultaneously a lot of things and that it respects each individual's choice and allows them to live the wat tht suits them. But the point is... we should not live the way we want to, we need to live the way God wants to. No offence here, i am not at all taking against Hinduism coz im myself a hindu, but i would like to point out that one should submit his will to God and live life the way God wants us to and not the other way around. In all major scriptures God mentions and asks ppl to submit their will... including Hinduism; Bhagavad Gita, Chapter-18, Verse-66.

As far as i know, hinduism has changed over time and if u analyse, the earlier time was called Satya-yuga which is the period of truth. Whereas now we are getting close to Kal-yuga... which is not considered to be a good period and therefore all the good things have turning against us. So now if u compare as to whats the reason behind this... it is coz ppl have changed the religion and have started following the way they like and things that are easier. For example, there was no idol worshipping even in Hinduism in ancient times, later we started idol worshipping. On asking priests and scholarly religious people, i got an answer saying, I agree there was no Idol worshipping in ancient times and now we do it, this is because things around us are changing and meditating without any idol is harder therefore we created idols so that its easy for people to concentrate on God. I think thats not a good idea coz God doesnt change with time nor wat he expects form us change... therefore we must atleast try to please God (i dont mean that in literal sense) the way He wants us to... how much ever we humans try to use our intelligence, we are no where close to God and Im sure we all agree on that. Therefore i believe that God's word should never be changed according to what suits us or whats convenient to us humans. And we should follow the path that was revealed.

 

[Gaura Priya]

I like few of ur points that Hinduism is simultaneously a lot of things and that it respects each individual's choice and allows them to live the wat tht suits them. But the point is... we should not live the way we want to, we need to live the way God wants to. No offence here, i am not at all taking against Hinduism coz im myself a hindu, but i would like to point out that one should submit his will to God and live life the way God wants us to and not the other way around. In all major scriptures God mentions and asks ppl to submit their will... including Hinduism; Bhagavad Gita, Chapter-18, Verse-66.

As far as i know, hinduism has changed over time and if u analyse, the earlier time was called Satya-yuga which is the period of truth. Whereas now we are getting close to Kal-yuga... which is not considered to be a good period and therefore all the good things have turning against us. So now if u compare as to whats the reason behind this... it is coz ppl have changed the religion and have started following the way they like and things that are easier. For example, there was no idol worshipping even in Hinduism in ancient times, later we started idol worshipping. On asking priests and scholarly religious people, i got an answer saying, I agree there was no Idol worshipping in ancient times and now we do it, this is because things around us are changing and meditating without any idol is harder therefore we created idols so that its easy for people to concentrate on God. I think thats not a good idea coz God doesnt change with time nor wat he expects form us change... therefore we must atleast try to please God (i dont mean that in literal sense) the way He wants us to... how much ever we humans try to use our intelligence, we are no where close to God and Im sure we all agree on that. Therefore i believe that God's word should never be changed according to what suits us or whats convenient to us humans. And we should follow the path that was revealed.

Adi prabhu, I think Arya Samaj might be for you. ^__~

Here is their sangha in Melbourne, Australia: Arya Samaj Of Melbourne (APSASM) They seem to have a function every second Sunday of each month.

God bless!

 

[nameless]

But the point is... we should not live the way we want to, we need to live the way God wants to.

imo adi, its personal choice to live spiriual or not, no one(even god) has right to decide how our life should be, because whatever the outcome is we alone should face it.

No offence here, i am not at all taking against Hinduism coz im myself a hindu, but i would like to point out that one should submit his will to God and live life the way God wants us to and not the other way around. In all major scriptures God mentions and asks ppl to submit their will... including Hinduism; Bhagavad Gita, Chapter-18, Verse-66.

i think this is not true for hinduism, Submitting will to god is just another way to drop desires or attachment, for some people this path is easier, there are other ways too, basically it can be said as karma yoga, jnana yoga, bhakti yoga and raja yoga(or dhyana yoga). The term 'raja' means king, so hinduism regards Dhyana yoga(meditation) as the king out of all yogas. The path of meditation not involves belief in god, but optionally you can believe in him.

Hinduism is of the opinion that believing or obeying god is not necessary to reach the truth. refer Atheism in Hinduism

and one question adi, have you been approached by people from any islamic group such as IRF?

 

[adi_149]

and one question adi, have you been approached by people from any islamic group such as IRF?

I have not been approached by IRF, however i have approached IRF myself, but i have only seen some of their video lectures. why did u ask this but?

 

[Gaura Priya]

i think this is not true for hinduism, Submitting will to god is just another way to drop desires or attachment, for some people this path is easier, there are other ways too, basically it can be said as karma yoga, jnana yoga, bhakti yoga and raja yoga(or dhyana yoga). The term 'raja' means king, so hinduism regards Dhyana yoga(meditation) as the king out of all yogas. The path of meditation not involves belief in god, but optionally you can believe in him.

As a former Hindu, I'm going to go against the idea that submitting is not part of Hinduism...

It is a very big part of Bhakti Yoga to let go and let God. Or at least in Vaishnavism, prapatti, or surrender to the Lord is the essence of the Scriptures. One of the greatest saints and Vaishnavas, Prahlada Maharaja speaks of it in the Bhagavatam, through the Nine Processes:

"Hearing [shravanam] and chanting [kirtanam] about the transcendental holy name, form, qualities, paraphernalia and pastimes of Lord Vishnu, remembering them [smaranam], serving the lotus feet of the Lord [pada-sevanam], offering the Lord respectful worship [archanam] with sixteen types of paraphernalia, offering prayers to the Lord [vandanam], becoming His servant [dasyam], considering the Lord one's best friend [sakhyam], and surrendering everything unto Him (in other words, serving Him with the body, mind and words) [atma-nivedanam] — these nine processes are accepted as pure devotional service [bhakti-yoga]. One who has dedicated his life to the service of Vishnu through these nine methods should be understood to be the most learned person, for he has acquired complete knowledge."

-- Srimad-Bhagavatam 7.5.23-24

 

[nameless]

I have not been approached by IRF, however i have approached IRF myself, but i have only seen some of their video lectures. why did u ask this but?

few of my friends was very active for IRF, they have exactly the same opinion on hinduism as you have.

 

[adi_149]

Adi prabhu, I think Arya Samaj might be for you. ^__~

Thanks for that Falcon, but I dont "feel" that Arya Samaj is the best way of living... but I have got a clear picture about it though. So i would continue my search for the truth... coz i think one has to "feel..." the truth, than just to think logically, coz both are important. Anyway, I have one last question at this moment, if anyone can answer... How old is Arya Samaj? for instance... the Vedas were scientifically proven to be revealed approx 3000 years ago. Did Arya Samaj or the teachings or beliefs of Arya Samaj existed even then, as they are now? OR is is that people used to live their life in a different way than what Arya Samaj suggests today? hope I made my question clear...

 

[nameless]

As a former Hindu, I'm going to go against the idea that submitting is not part of Hinduism...

where i have said that, oh beloved Royal?

 

[Gaura Priya]

Thanks for that Falcon, but I dont "feel" that Arya Samaj is the best way of living... but I have got a clear picture about it though. So i would continue my search for the truth... coz i think one has to "feel..." the truth, than just to think logically, coz both are important. Anyway, I have one last question at this moment, if anyone can answer... How old is Arya Samaj? for instance... the Vedas were scientifically proven to be revealed approx 3000 years ago. Did Arya Samaj or the teachings or beliefs of Arya Samaj existed even then, as they are now? OR is is that people used to live their life in a different way than what Arya Samaj suggests today? hope I made my question clear...

Personally to me, Arya Samaj practices the original Vedic religion of agnihotra and sandhya, which is the fire sacrifice, and meditation. Actually, these were the original Vedic practices on how to commune with God, but these ideas have been gone through the ages and other practices have been added to Vedic Dharma.

Even if you do not agree with Arya Samaj, the very fact that they restored the simplicity of the Vedic teachings to the idea that God is One, that there is no need for gurus, prophets, messengers, imams, sheikhs, priests, pandits, etc. and that every human being can be an Arya, or noble Vedic follower is pretty admirable.

Although the British tried to show that Varuna, Agni, Vayu, etc. were different gods, actually they are all the different Names of the One Unmanifested God, Shri Ishvara.

The Vedic religion is the oldest religion in the world, and begun by God Himself. It is timeless... although the Veda was written only about 5,000 years old, it was transmitted for thousands and thousands and thousands of years, from the beginning of time.