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difference between atonement and salvation?

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by davidthegreek, Dec 28, 2012.

  1. davidthegreek

    davidthegreek Active Member

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    can someone explain to me the difference between the 2?
    Thanks.
     
  2. F0uad

    F0uad Well-Known Member

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    Do you mean compare unjust salvation with just salvation?
     
  3. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

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    Attonement: I believe one does not have to pay for one's sins because they have been paid by a sacrifice.

    Salvation from sin: I believe one does not sin.

    Salvation from wrath: I believe one does not get punished for one's sins.
     
  4. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

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    I don't believe God is ever unjust but I recognize that sometimes people think otherwise.
     
    #4 Muffled, Dec 29, 2012
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2012
  5. F0uad

    F0uad Well-Known Member

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    Do you belief that the atonement is just?
     
  6. Falvlun

    Falvlun Earthbending Lemur
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    Christians believe they are saved through atonement. Atonement theology is that Jesus payed the price for sin.

    There are 3 main views as to how Jesus did this:
    The ransom theory/Christus Victor: According the ransom theory, Jesus traded his perfect life for all of our imperfect ones, thereby freeing us from Satan. The Christus Victor theory claims that, rather than a simple trade, Christ defeats Satan in a spiritual battle, thereby releasing his claim to us.

    The moral influence theory: The purpose of Jesus' life was to give us a template of how to live and to inspire us with his miracles and resurrection. He was the example for "moral change". Interestingly enough, this "liberal" sort of theory was actually the original understanding of atonement

    The satisfaction theory: This, and its variation, is the one I was most familiar with. Basically, sin comes with a huge price tag, due to the offense it gives to God. A perfect sacrifice is the only way to pay off this debt, and Jesus was that sacrifice. The slight variation, favored by Protestants, is the penal substitution theory, which claims that Jesus appeases God's wrath at mankind by offering himself as the substitute, to bear all punishment.

    All of this was adapted from the wikipedia article: Atonement in Christianity

    Now, this all describes how Jesus atones mankind. Salvation is acceptance of this atonement, and thereby, becoming acceptable to and accepted by, God.
     
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  7. Sumit

    Sumit Sanatana Dharma

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    I don't know the meaning of atonement but salvation means the freedom from the cycle of birth and death for the certain interval of time.
     
  8. Quintessence

    Quintessence Tale Weaver
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    Depends on your background. "Salvation" is a non-concept to me that has no meaning in my religion, but "atonement" is a meaningful concept that basically involves taking responsible, corrective action when you've erred. It goes beyond an empty "I'm sorry" and is proactively behavioral. Truthfully, I don't use the word particularly much.
     
  9. punkdbass

    punkdbass I will be what I will be

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    Atonement is our desire for oneness with God despite our faults.

    Salvation is the fulfillment of one's potential as a human being, the maximizing of one's humanity.
     
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  10. davidthegreek

    davidthegreek Active Member

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    any christian around?
     
  11. timmywarner

    timmywarner New Member

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    Put simply Atonement means at-one-ment. IE: Being brought back into unity with God. It is really reconciliation. (Word Origin Anglo-Saxon).

    Salvation, on the other hand is literally being saved from something. In biblical terms that is from sin. Our own sin.

    Whether we like it or not we are born in to sin and the only we to be reconciled to God is to find salvation through the work of Jesus though His life (ministry), death and resurrection. So that one act buys us salvation and atonement.

    Hope that helps
     
  12. timmywarner

    timmywarner New Member

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    I do agree with your first statement. Of course that is subject, in biblical terms to acceptance of that Sacrifice and God as your King.

    2nd statement: If you believe in Christ, and you state Christianity as your religion, then you must take Him at His word. That word for us: Romans 3:23 Romans 3:23... all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.

    3rd Statement: I'll let scripture say it all.... Romans 6:23
    23*For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

    So much more to be said on all of these but if you genuinely believe that the historical Jesus of Nazareth is God incarnate and the King and Creator then I think you may need to re-analyse your perspective.
     
  13. Ross Marshall

    Ross Marshall New Member

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    The difference between atonement and salvation:
    Atonement - sole work of Christ, as High Priest, atones for "propitiates" for whole House of Israel (now all mankind).
    Salvation - enevitable and ultimate realization "awareness" of this application to all humans.
    Some first-fruits elect wake up in this life time, while others hear the gospel preached to the dead; others tonques confess after the Lake of Pur eon(Age) is over.
    Historically, all are atoned for - full efective application to all SIN of all humans; thus, ultimately, future, all aquire salvation.
    Any other view is that "destructuive heresy" known as limited atonement, and limited salvation.
    Proof to this effect, that limited atonement is the machine behind the presnt apostacy and lukewarmness, is its divisive nature - in its partialistic attutude towards others and its re-make of God's nature as partialistic, or His stupidity, in allowing man's free will to supervein over His in determining ultimate destiny. Both tradional views (limited salvation) deny the total universal extent of God "in us [all], reconciling us, while we were yet sinners."
    More to this at our godsavesall site.
     
  14. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

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    I believe it is. All that justice requires is that the sin be paid for. It does not dictate who has to pay for it.
     
  15. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

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    I believe that saves a person from God's wrath but it does not save a person from sin.
     
  16. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

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    I believe I like that one also but there are other salvations as well.
     
  17. sudakar

    sudakar God's faithful

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    So you don't believe in penal substitution anymore?
     
  18. PearlSeeker

    PearlSeeker Well-Known Member

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    Atonement has always been a strange concept to me. Who owes sacrifice to who?
     
  19. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

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    I believe that it is. I believe it is a quid pro quo. Stop sinning and past sins will be forgiven. It is a great deal. I give up sin so I don't have to be punished.
     
  20. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

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    What has He sacrificed? I believe, nothing. He was the sacrifice for our sins. It is not a debt. It is a gift from God. The gift is for those who need their sins removed.
     
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