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Did Jesus LIE, or is the Bible in error?

Niblo

Active Member
Premium Member
Grandpa was ASTOUNDING, and you are amazing!

Thanks for sharing

Hello Patrick.

You're very kind, and yes, my grandfather was something else. As for me, well..not at all 'amazing', just someone blessed with a grandpa like him. My one regret is that I was too immature, too self-centred, as a youth to fully appreciate him while he lived. I have no doubt at all that he is with God, and that God is well pleased with him. 'Well done, thou good and faithful servant.'

You have a great day now, and may God bless both you and your family. And thank you again for your kind words.

By the way, I note the State in which you live. My wife is a member of a British Barbershop champion chorus. Some years ago they were invited to sing in the US. When I asked whereabouts she replied: 'Columbus, Ohoho'...and then realised her mistake. I have yet to let her forget it! :D
 
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Patrick Miron

Patrick4Jesus
Hello Patrick.

You're very kind, and yes, my grandfather was something else. As for me, well..not at all 'amazing', just someone blessed with a grandpa like him. My one regret is that I was too immature, too self-centred, as a youth to fully appreciate him while he lived. I have no doubt at all that he is with God, and that God is well pleased with him. 'Well done, thou good and faithful servant.'

You have a great day now, and may God bless both you and your family. And thank you again for your kind words.

By the way, I note the State in which you live. My wife is a member of a British Barbershop champion chorus. Some years ago they were invited to sing in the US. When I asked whereabouts she replied: 'Columbus, Ohoho'...and then realised her mistake. I have yet to let her forget it! :D

Thank you,
May the God that loves us so very much continue to guide our life's paths,

Patrick
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Did Jesus LIE, or is the Bible in error?

This seems to ME, to be a reasonable question given the ever growing multiplicity of faiths and churches
You haven't given the example that you want us to evaluate. Chapter and verse?

In general, Jesus never wrote down his own words. We have the memories of people, reputed to be Matthew Mark, Luke, and John, but that is highly debatable. That kind of story tends to mix history with legend.
 

Patrick Miron

Patrick4Jesus
You haven't given the example that you want us to evaluate. Chapter and verse?

In general, Jesus never wrote down his own words. We have the memories of people, reputed to be Matthew Mark, Luke, and John, but that is highly debatable. That kind of story tends to mix history with legend.

BUT the Apostles were led by GOD the Holy Spirit:
John 14:26

26] "But the Paraclete, the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things, and bring all things to your mind, whatsoever I shall have said to you

As for specifics; how about
Matt 16:15-19
John 17: 17-20
Matt 28:18-20 for starters

God Bless you,
Patrick
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
BUT the Apostles were led by GOD the Holy Spirit:
John 14:26

26] "But the Paraclete, the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things, and bring all things to your mind, whatsoever I shall have said to you

As for specifics; how about
Matt 16:15-19
I John 17: 17-20
Matt 28:18-20 for starters

God Bless you,
Patrick
Well, I'm sure you realize that for Jews, the only part of the Sacred Scriptures that was dictated by God himself is the Torah (Genesis to Deuteronomy). The prophets were spoken to indirectly through visions and dreams. The Writings are written by written by men but are inspiring to us. The Talmud -- well it depends on which denomination you ask.

I don't believe the gospels are accurate. There are contradictions (was Jesus crucified on Passover, or the Day of Preparation?), and esoteric interpretations of verses in the Tanakh (making them prophecies when in fact they are not).

Matt 16:15-19 I think Jesus really came to believe he was the messiah, and so as not lying.

John 17: 17-20 Why do you believe Jesus didn't actually send his disciples out as missionaries? It was quite common for the Pharisees to missionize to Jews abroad, as well as to Righteous Gentiles.

Matt 28:18-20 Remember that these are just memories of what Jesus said, embellished. I don't think he claimed any more authority than any other Rabbi would have.
 

Patrick Miron

Patrick4Jesus
Well, I'm sure you realize that for Jews, the only part of the Sacred Scriptures that was dictated by God himself is the Torah (Genesis to Deuteronomy). The prophets were spoken to indirectly through visions and dreams. The Writings are written by written by men but are inspiring to us. The Talmud -- well it depends on which denomination you ask.

I don't believe the gospels are accurate. There are contradictions (was Jesus crucified on Passover, or the Day of Preparation?), and esoteric interpretations of verses in the Tanakh (making them prophecies when in fact they are not).

Matt 16:15-19 I think Jesus really came to believe he was the messiah, and so as not lying

John 17: 17-20 Why do you believe Jesus didn't actually send his disciples out as missionaries? It was quite common for the Pharisees to missionize to Jews abroad, as well as to Righteous Gentiles.

Matt 28:18-20 Remember that these are just memories of what Jesus said, embellished. I don't think he claimed any more authority than any other Rabbi would have.

Well, I'm sure you realize that for Jews, the only part of the Sacred Scriptures that was dictated by God himself is the Torah (Genesis to Deuteronomy). The prophets were spoken to indirectly through visions and dreams. The Writings are written by mean but are inspiring to us. The Talmud -- well it depends on which denomination you ask

But the NT Gospels was written as directed by Jesus {Matt 28: 18-20}.

Jn. 14:26: "But the Paraclete, the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things, and bring all things to your mind, whatsoever I shall have said to you"

Your mention of possible differences between denominations; that cannot take place in the CC on matters of Faith and or moral Defined Doctrines.

Your Torah, which we to hold in high regard, is about 4,000 years old. The NT is about 2,000 years young.

While the Bible in its entirety is TRUE, it is not necessarily ALL factual. 2 Tim. 3: 16-17… Either the entire Bible is TRUE or NONE of it is reliable to learn or teach Christ One True Faith.

I don't believe the gospels are accurate. There are contradictions (was Jesus crucified on Passover, or the Day of Preparation?), and esoteric interpretations of verses in the Tanakh (making them prophecies when in fact they are not)

Matt 16:15-19 I think Jesus really came to believe he was the messiah, and so as not lying

May I suggest you read all of Luke chapter 1

[26]And in the sixth month, the angel Gabriel was sent from God into a city of Galilee, called Nazareth, [27] To a virgin espoused to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin's name was Mary. [28] And the angel being come in, said unto her: Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women. …

[35] And the angel answering, said to her: The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the most High shall overshadow thee. And therefore also the Holy which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God”

John 17: 17-20 Why do you believe Jesus didn't actually send his disciples out as missionaries? It was quite common for the Pharisees to missionize to Jews abroad, as well as to Righteous Gentiles

He did!
Mt 10: 1-8 “1] And having called his twelve disciples together, he gave them power over unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal all manner of diseases, and all manner of infirmities. [2] And the names of the twelve apostles are these: The first, Simon who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother, [3] James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother, Philip and Bartholomew, Thomas and Matthew the publican, and James the son of Alpheus, and Thaddeus, [4] Simon the Cananean, and Judas Iscariot, who also betrayed him. [5] These twelve Jesus sent: commanding them, saying: Go ye not into the way of the Gentiles, and into the city of the Samaritans enter ye not. [6] But go ye rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. [7] And going, preach, saying: The kingdom of heaven is at hand. [8] Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse the lepers, cast out devils: freely have you received, freely give”

He did; his message and messengers were refused.

Matt 28:18-20 Remember that these are just memories of what Jesus said, embellished. I don't think he claimed any more authority than any other Rabbi would have.

Really: John.10: 30 “I and the Father are one."

Shalom my friend, sincere thanks for POSTING
Patrick
 

Patrick Miron

Patrick4Jesus
I don't believe for one minute that Jesus lied. The Bible is a collection of books, authored by many different people over a few thousand years, compiled by other people, translated by still other people and preserved by still other people and interpreted to day by as many as 30,000 different groups of people. Does it contain truth? Absolutely. Is it inerrant? Hardly. Any time people are involved in something, there are going to be errors.

So then in your opinion this IS an "error?"
2 Tim 3: 16-17 "
[16] All scripture, inspired of God, is profitable to teach, to reprove, to correct, to instruct in justice, [17] That the man of God may be perfect, furnished to every good work.

DOUAY EXPLANATION[16] "All scripture,": Every part of divine scripture is certainly profitable for all these ends. But, if we would have the whole rule of Christian faith and practice, we must not be content with those Scriptures, which Timothy knew from his infancy, that is, with the Old Testament alone: nor yet with the New Testament, without taking along with it the traditions of the apostles, and the interpretation of the church, to which the apostles delivered both the book, and the true meaning of it.

God Bless you,
Patrick
 

Katzpur

Not your average Mormon
So then in your opinion this IS an "error?"
2 Tim 3: 16-17 "
[16] All scripture, inspired of God, is profitable to teach, to reprove, to correct, to instruct in justice, [17] That the man of God may be perfect, furnished to every good work.

DOUAY EXPLANATION[16] "All scripture,": Every part of divine scripture is certainly profitable for all these ends. But, if we would have the whole rule of Christian faith and practice, we must not be content with those Scriptures, which Timothy knew from his infancy, that is, with the Old Testament alone: nor yet with the New Testament, without taking along with it the traditions of the apostles, and the interpretation of the church, to which the apostles delivered both the book, and the true meaning of it.

God Bless you,
Patrick
All scripture is profitable to teach, to reprove, to correct, and to instruct -- provided there are no transcription errors and no translation errors. If you believe that every last word in the Bible has come down to us exactly as God gave it, then I must disagree with you. Still, I hold the Bible in great esteem and value the things I've learned from it.
 

oldbadger

Skanky Old Mongrel!
You'll agree, I would imagine, that Jesus may have said something that was misquoted. I don't think that means He lied.
Exactly so, Katzpur.
For me, actions and words can both support the truth of a person, and where these show a change in mind or heart then I become suspicious.
 

TransmutingSoul

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Did Jesus LIE, or is the Bible in error?

This seems to ME, to be a reasonable question given the ever growing multiplicity of faiths and churches

The better question.is how blind have we come to the Truth spoken by Jesus the Christ.

The answer would be very blind.

Regards Tony
 
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