Did Jesus die and rise from the dead?

[Riders]

When you claim there isn't "proof any group saw jesus rise from the dead," are you denying 1) "that Peter and the disciples had experiences after Jesus’s death in which Jesus appeared to them as the risen Christ" (What Really Happened to Jesus, Gerd Lüdemann, pg. 80), or 2) that Jesus was really there to be seen? If you're just denying the latter, we can have a discussion about Jesus while staying in the mainstream sphere, the historical bedrock virtually everyone grants. If you're denying the former, however, you're pitting yourself against even atheists like Gerd Lüdemann.

13“Woman, why are you weeping?” they asked. “Because they have taken my Lord away,” she said, “and I do not know where they have put Him.” 14When she had said this, she turned around andsaw Jesus standing there; but she did not recognizethat it was Jesus. 15“Woman, why are you weeping?” Jesus asked. “Whom are you seeking?” Thinking He was the gardener, she said, “Sir, if you have carried Him off, tell me where you have put Him, and I will get Him.”…

The fact that she thought it was the gardner means it probably was becuase that doesn't make sense.She just wanted to see him Don't use Jesus used many forms in different circumstances, Jesus doing a little magic trick on purpose to make himself look like a gardner makes no sense.

 

[paarsurrey]

13“Woman, why are you weeping?” they asked. “Because they have taken my Lord away,” she said, “and I do not know where they have put Him.” 14When she had said this, she turned around andsaw Jesus standing there; but she did not recognizethat it was Jesus. 15“Woman, why are you weeping?” Jesus asked. “Whom are you seeking?” Thinking He was the gardener, she said, “Sir, if you have carried Him off, tell me where you have put Him, and I will get Him.”…

The fact that she thought it was the gardner means it probably was becuase that doesn't make sense.She just wanted to see him Don't use Jesus used many forms in different circumstances, Jesus doing a little magic trick on purpose to make himself look like a gardner makes no sense.

'Cause Jesus was only a human being. He survived a cursed death on the Cross against all odds, so he did not want to be caught again and get killed. He was therefore secretive and disguised as a gardener. Nothing unusual at all. He had already given hints that he shall have to migrate from the Roman domain. Right, please?

Regards

 

[Riders]

'Cause Jesus was only a human being. He survived a cursed death on the Cross against all odds, so he did not want to be caught again and get killed. He was therefore secretive and disguised as a gardener. Nothing unusual at all. He had already given hints that he shall have to migrate from the Roman domain. Right, please?

Regards

No that makes no sense.

 

[samtonga43]

13“Woman, why are you weeping?” they asked. “Because they have taken my Lord away,” she said, “and I do not know where they have put Him.” 14When she had said this, she turned around andsaw Jesus standing there; but she did not recognizethat it was Jesus. 15“Woman, why are you weeping?” Jesus asked. “Whom are you seeking?” Thinking He was the gardener, she said, “Sir, if you have carried Him off, tell me where you have put Him, and I will get Him.”…

The fact that she thought it was the gardner means it probably was becuase that doesn't make sense.She just wanted to see him Don't use Jesus used many forms in different circumstances, Jesus doing a little magic trick on purpose to make himself look like a gardner makes no sense.

When did she realize that it really was Jesus?

 

[samtonga43]

Josh Mcdowel is an uber conservative Evangelical I know about these authors they are not reliable.

When you use the word 'reliable', what standard are you using?

 

[Riders]

When did she realize that it really was Jesus?

WHen he told heraccording tot he bible. But to me if hes made up to look like the gardner thats just a weird thing to me why?

 

[Spartan]

Josh Mcdowel is an uber conservative Evangelical I know about these authors they are not reliable.

<facepalm>

These lame excuses are why you're in the dark about the historical Jesus.

 

[Spartan]

I think they thought they saw him. There are other scriptures saying there were others who thought they saw him but it turned out to be the gardner. If you grieve hard enough youll end up seeing what you want.

You don't have that story right. From John chapter 20:

Jesus said, 'Mary!' She turned round then and said to him in Hebrew, 'Rabbuni!' -- which means Master.

God and your God.'

Mary of Magdala told the disciples, 'I have seen the Lord,' and that he had said these things to her."

So she did recognize Jesus after all, and then she went to tell the disciples that she had seen him.

 

[Riders]

You don't have that story right. From John chapter 20:

Jesus said, 'Mary!' She turned round then and said to him in Hebrew, 'Rabbuni!' -- which means Master.

God and your God.'

Mary of Magdala told the disciples, 'I have seen the Lord,' and that he had said these things to her."

So she did recognize Jesus after all, and then she went to tell the disciples that she had seen him.

Well this is till using biblical passages to prove the bible, which IMO does not work.

 

[samtonga43]

Well this is till using biblical passages to prove the bible, which IMO does not work.

What are you using to prove your version?

 

[Riders]

What are you using to prove your version?

There is archaelogical proof the story of Jesus is not real including the fact that the story of Jesus is a copy of many Gods and Godesses before right down the virgin birth and his Birthday.The story of Hare Krishna is similar to Jesus why should I not accept Hare Krishna or Buddha or Allah instead of Jesus?I don't see any differences between those, just choose one.

 

[Riders]

But hey it does not mean I reject any one of these, I accept all to a degree that I'm a Universalist. But all of those religions ar ejust as good as Christianity.

 

[Spartan]

Well this is till using biblical passages to prove the bible, which IMO does not work.

Listen, that's lame. There's some 42 different authors who wrote about Jesus within 150 years of his life.

In addition, a police detective (J. Warner Wallace) subjected the Gospels to ten different forensic tests of eyewitness testimony and reported they were legitimate.

You need to get off your Bible bias and do some legitimate investigations.

And by the way, the New Testament was not "the Bible" in the first century. What there was in the first century were over two dozen manuscripts written by a variety of authors floating around different communities. And you know what that is? THAT'S INDEPENDENT CONFIRMATION.

 

[SugarOcean]

Did Jesus die and rise from the dead?

No.
He took a nap.
Then, using his teeth, he removed the nails from the palm of his hands and his feet and did a somersault off the cross.
After he tucked and rolled down Golgotha hill he walked across the waters and went to Disneyland.

 

[samtonga43]

There is archaelogical proof the story of Jesus is not real including the fact that the story of Jesus is a copy of many Gods and Godesses before right down the virgin birth and his Birthday.The story of Hare Krishna is similar to Jesus why should I not accept Hare Krishna or Buddha or Allah instead of Jesus?I don't see any differences between those, just choose one.

Do you have proof that there is archeological proof?

 

[Riders]

Listen, that's lame. There's some 42 different authors who wrote about Jesus within 150 years of his life.

In addition, a police detective (J. Warner Wallace) subjected the Gospels to ten different forensic tests of eyewitness testimony and reported they were legitimate.

You need to get off your Bible bias and do some legitimate investigations.

And by the way, the New Testament was not "the Bible" in the first century. What there was in the first century were over two dozen manuscripts written by a variety of authors floating around different communities. And you know what that is? THAT'S INDEPENDENT CONFIRMATION.

no what your saying is lame because its nott rue, there are not over 40 authors that wrote about Jesus at the time. The wiki says the only one that Historians agree with is one or two sentences written by Josephus, many historians agree a guy named Jesus existed was baptized by John and crucified but mostly they don't believe theres any proof for the crucifixion.

 

[Riders]

Do you have proof that there is archeological proof?

There was a dried up foot of one of the Messiags from that time found still nailed on a cross because they left bodies of Messiahs up on the cross, He could not have been burried in a tomb, that was reserved for politicians and royalty.

 

[Spartan]

no what your saying is lame because its nott rue, there are not over 40 authors that wrote about Jesus at the time. The wiki says the only one that Historians agree with is one or two sentences written by Josephus, many historians agree a guy named Jesus existed was baptized by John and crucified but mostly they don't believe theres any proof for the crucifixion.

Flush. Do your homework.

We do know of at least forty-two authors, nine of whom were secular, who mentioned Jesus within 150 years of his death. Scholar Gary Habermas, in his Book "The Case for the Resurrection of Jesus" (p.233), listed the following: 9 authors from the New Testament - Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Paul, Author of of Hebrews, James, Peter, and Jude. 21 early Christian writers outside the NT - Clement of Rome, Ignatius, Polycarp, Martyrdom of Polycarp, Didache, Barnabus, Shepherd of Hermas, Fragments of Papias, Justin Martyr, Aristides, Athenagoras, Theophious of Antioch, Quadratus, Aristo of Pella, Melito of Sardis, Diognetus, Gospel of Peter, Apocalypse of Peter, and Epistula Apostolorum. 4 heretical writings - Gospel of Thomas, Gospel of Truth, Apocryphon of John, Treatise on Resurrection. And 9 secular non-Christian sources, including Josephus, Tacticus, Pliny the Younger, Phlegon, Lucian, Celcus, Mara Bar-Serapion, Seutonius, and Thallus.

 

[Spartan]

There is archaelogical proof the story of Jesus is not real including the fact that the story of Jesus is a copy of many Gods and Godesses before right down the virgin birth and his Birthday.The story of Hare Krishna is similar to Jesus why should I not accept Hare Krishna or Buddha or Allah instead of Jesus?I don't see any differences between those, just choose one.

Sorry, those are not similar. For instance,

A virgin birth is never attributed to Krishna as his parents bore seven previous children. Critics claim Krishna was born to the virgin Maia but according to Hindu texts, he was the eighth son of Princess Devaki and her husband Vasudeva: "You have been born of the divine Devaki and Vasudeva for the protection of Brahma on earth." Mahabharata Bk 12, XLVIII

And Krishna? He wasn't crucified. He was shot by an arrow in a hunting accident. Wikipedia confirms that. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krishna

Nor is there any confirmation that Krishna was PHYSICALLY resurrected, as the Gospels point out about Jesus.

You should also read this: 23 Reasons Why Scholars Know Jesus Is Not A Copy Of Pagan Religions.

As scholars Nash, McKenzie, etc., have pointed out, the vast majority of so-called pagan myth similarities to Christ are not found until AFTER the life of Jesus. Pagans copied Jesus.

 

[paarsurrey]

WHen he told heraccording tot he bible. But to me if hes made up to look like the gardner thats just a weird thing to me why?

You are right.
If Jesus was god and he got resurrected from the dead, then Jesus needed not to disguise himself as gardener. Why was he secretive? He should have openly gone into a crowd of Judaism people and told them that he had performed the miracle he promised to the Jews.
Jesus did not do anything like that. Did he, please?
This is enough proof that he survived a cursed death on the Cross and was just a human being, neither god nor son of god. Right, please?

Regards