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Featured Did Jesus Christ actually die?

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Eddi, Dec 15, 2020.

  1. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    Jesus reconciling us shows that our sins separate us from God.
     
  2. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    Hell is eternal separation from God. OBJECTION TO CHRISTIANITY: A Loving God Would Never Torture People in Hell

     
  3. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    Once again, that is just one interpretation of the Bible. They have to ignore the verses that contradict that claim, just as you do.

    If you understood the Bible you could see that it constantly contradicts itself. I have no problem admitting that there are verses that support your claim, yet even after I copied and pasted the verses that refute you you have to pretend that they do not exist.
     
  4. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    These verses do not contradict hell being eternal separation from God.

    Matthew 25:31-46

    When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit on his glorious throne. Before him will be gathered all the nations, and he will separate people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. And he will place the sheep on his right, but the goats on the left. Then the King will say to those on his right, “Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.” . . . Then he will say to those on his left, “Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. . . . And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

    Mark 9:42-48

    Whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him if a great millstone were hung around his neck and he were thrown into the sea. And if your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life crippled than with two hands to go to hell, to the unquenchable fire. And if your foot causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life lame than with two feet to be thrown into hell. And if your eye causes you to sin, tear it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than with two eyes to be thrown into hell, “where their worm does not die and the fire is not quenched.”



    Revelation 20:10, 14-15

    And the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever. . . . Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.


    Yes, there are other verses that contradict this, but then we all know that the Bible contradicts itself countless times. It is one of the greatest flaws of the Bible.
     
  5. IndigoChild5559

    IndigoChild5559 Loving God and my neighbor as myself.

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    Although there is little direct evidence that Jesus existed, we have plenty of evidence that his brother James existed, and so we can safely conclude that Jesus existed, and James was certainly a witness to the death of Jesus.
     
  6. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    There is historical evidence that Jesus existed. A Fictional Messiah? - BreakPoint

     
  7. sojourner

    sojourner Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006

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    So salvation IS up to us. Nice to know.
     
  8. sojourner

    sojourner Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006

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    Immaterial. Was Hitler saved?
     
  9. sojourner

    sojourner Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006

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    It also illustrates that there is some right relationship that is our natural state. This negates your stance that we are “born into sin.”
     
  10. sojourner

    sojourner Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006

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    Look at the passage you quote. The Bible says that we are all one — just as Jesus and the Father are One. Together, we are the body of Christ. If hell is eternal separation from others, the the body of Christ is broken, and Christ’s sacrifice is not efficacious. John says of Jesus: “Behold the lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world.” Not just of righteous individuals, not just of the faithful, but of all the world. The Bible also says that God does not want even one of us to perish. Don’t you think God is powerful enough that God’s will shall be done on earth, as in heaven, as Jesus declares?

    The Bible contradicts itself on the matter of punishment, salvation, and our eternal disposition. If relationship is the most important thing, and if God is love, how is eternal separation just in the perspective of right relationship?
     
  11. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    Many people believe it is unfair for God to send individuals to hell for eternity. God is being entirely fair, based on their rejection of Him. If people don't want anything to do with Him here on earth, why would we think they would want anything to do with Him on other side? If they hate the thought of God in this life, they will hate being with Him in the next.
     
  12. sojourner

    sojourner Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006

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    This doesn’t have anything to do with “fair.” And it really has nothing to do with whether you think people “want to have anything to do with [God].” In the end result, it has to do what the texts say about the matter, and how that is reconciled with issues such as justice, love, compassion, mercy, forbearance, with the reality of our relationship with God and what we are, and the power of God to fulfill God’s will.
     
  13. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    Author Frank Harber stated:

    For God to force people to go to heaven against their wishes wouldn't be heaven-it would be hell. Atheist author Jean-Paul Sarte noted that the gates of hell are locked from the inside by the free choice of men and women.
     
  14. sojourner

    sojourner Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006

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    Haven’t you ever thought about the possibility that the judgment we face is ultimate self-judgment when faced with who we really are vs. who we thought we were, as illustrated against the perfect love that God is? And when standing face to face with that perfect love, realizing that we are, after all, perfectly loved and lovable, we shall come to realize that ultimate reality and embrace it wholeheartedly, when we discover that the vision we have seen dimly cannot stand against the clear vision of God? Methinks you give both God and the human spirit too little credit.
     
  15. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    There are laws in society that people face consequences and judges if they break. Why wouldn't the same be true with God? God does all things decently and in order. God is not the author of confusion. 1 Corinthians 14:40

    1st Corinthians 14:33

     
  16. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    God doesn't choose who will be saved. God chose everyone, not everyone chose God.
     
  17. sojourner

    sojourner Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006

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    Not even in human penal systems is punishment eternal. Much too draconian for a God of love.
     
  18. sojourner

    sojourner Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006

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    God: “I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy.” (Ex. 33)
     
  19. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    That's between him and God. `
     
  20. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    Because of the fall nature isn't how it's supposed to be. Genesis 3:18

     
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