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Debate over Pentecost and the Holy Ghost anyone?
- Thread starter Riders
- Start date
Redemptionsong
Well-Known Member
I think you're touching on something very important here.
The Holy Spirit is central to the New Testament message, but it is rarely the uppermost consideration in discussions with [Torah] Jews.
Discussions between Christians and Jews usually focus on the credentials of the Messiah. Yet, Jews know that Jeremiah 31:33,34 talks of a future time when 'I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it on their hearts; I will be their God, and they shall be my people. And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.'
Likewise Joel 2:28 says, 'And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions: And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit.'
What makes these passages so crucial to an understanding of our place in God, whether Jew or Gentile, is the relationship between the Spirit of God, the Holy Spirit, and man's spirit. It's the indwelling Holy Spirit that provides us with our knowledge of God. If religion is man's attempt to get close to God, and the Holy Spirit is God's outpouring on those who please Him, then it should be apparent that the goal of all religion and revelation is TO KNOW GOD.
Knowing God, it appears to me, is all about the Spirit of love. Love is God's Spirit, and it is also the heart of man in his need and nakedness. God, through his Holy Spirit, is able to break through to the heart of man, and he does so by means of a two-edged sword, the Word of God. One might say, the Word of God is Spirit. I believe we come to know the Spirit of God, the Holy Spirit, as we come to know the Word of God in Christ. Christ first reveals Himself as the fulfilment of the law, and after taking away sin, he sends His Spirit as the cementing of the new relationship. Our part is to demonstrate trust, or faith, in Jesus Christ.
I don't know many people who come to Christ through an intellectual argument. But I know many who have been touched by the love of God in Christ. This suggests to me that there is a reality to love that surpasses all intellectual knowledge.
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe I am game. What flavor of Pentecostal were you? I remember a Pentecostal person marveling that even a Baptist could receive the gift of tongues.
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe that would be due to what Jesus said about it in John 14. Jesus isn't dead but His Spirit is with us anyway but He was dead at one time.
Muffled
Jesus in me
Are you saying there are only two members of the Trinity?
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
Why, in your opinion, would the term ghost be used instead of spirit when they both express the same message?
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
I severely doubt it insofar that holy spirit comes from christ (as in the apostles), and they don't believe in christ. So any holy spirit associated with christ and god portrayed in the new testament would be, in their point of view, mute.
Brian2
Veteran Member
No, why do you say that? It is probably the language I used. I could have said it in different ways.