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Deadbeat Dads

Mr. Skittles

Active Member
I am not sure if you guys listen to talk radio but I typically listen to a guy named Tom Lyekis who is popular in Southern California and he is by far in my opinion the mouthpiece for many guys who have ever thought about some of the encounters with women. Majority of his female callers consider him misogynistic even though he considers himself a feminist, some simply hate him.

In this particular section of the show he was discussing deadbeat dads and the subject was sparked by gymnist Gabby Douglas who in an interview stated that her dad was a "deadbeat. So Tom Lyekis went in and pointed out that there are so many women that drag men into child rearing situations (and what he meant by dragging in his view was to not take personal responsibility of taking birth control). In this segment he continued in saying that there are women who choose men with no goals, no education, and no desire to want to have children. He adds the controversial fact that there are many women out there upon having kids and are estranged from the child's father, tend to use the child as a "barganing chip" towards the man.

To solve this problem Tom Lyekis says: "Women if you dont want a deadbest dad stop f****** deadbeats!"

Now what's interesting is many of his male callers that call in tell Tom:

"Tom my baby momma treats me like crap and threatens child support when she doesn't get her way and sometimes I feel like giving up because she is causing too much stress."

Another caller said:

"Me and my ex broke up because I didn't pay enough attention to her and after we broke up my ex threaten child support because I got another girlfriend."

I will admit some of his views are controversial and it does make a lot of women mad but he is funny.

What I do know of Lyekis is that he is a multi-millionare, divorced four times, no kids, and is old.....
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
What the heck does "threaten child support" mean? If a parent is doiing their share to support their child in the first place (as they should be), where's the "threat"?
 

Mr. Skittles

Active Member
What the heck does "threaten child support" mean? If a parent is doiing their share to support their child in the first place (as they should be), where's the "threat"?

Well as I listened to one of the callers, this one guy's ex-girlfriend threatened him despite his active participation. In other words he is going to court for child support. There are unfortunately many women who have problems with their child's father and out of the emotional anger threaten child support despite the guy being in the child's life.
 
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9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
Well as I listened to one of the callers, this one guy's ex-girlfriend threatened him despite his active participation. In other words he is going to court for child support

Is he not paying child support now?

"Active participation" is all fine and good, but kids also need food, clothes, shelter, etc., etc. These things cost actual money.
 

Mr. Skittles

Active Member
Is he not paying child support now?

"Active participation" is all fine and good, but kids also need food, clothes, shelter, etc., etc. These things cost actual money.

I don't know the guy. The guy was calling in. If I could speculate it seemed that they shared custody. I would assume active participation would include all of what you mentioned. But even if that cost money as it does, if a man is actively participating, there is no need to involve the courts.

As far as whether he is paying support now I doubt it which is why he mentioned that his ex was threatening child support.
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
I don't know the guy. The guy was calling in. If I could speculate it seemed that they shared custody. I would assume active participation would include all of what you mentioned.
Why would you assume that? I would think that when someone says "active participation" it could mean anything from doing half (or more) of the actual child-rearing and shouldering the costs, to spending a few hours with the kid every other weekend and making sure that he gets a present on his birthday and at Christmas.

But even if that cost money as it does, if a man is actively participating, there is no need to involve the courts.
I don't know what this means.

As far as whether he is paying support now I doubt it which is why he mentioned that his ex was threatening child support.
I don't know. Someone giving their own side of a story can usually be expected to make themselves out to bias the story to make themselves look bad, and I'm only getting a second-hand version of it from you. I don't really have anything to use to judge the situation.
 

Mr. Skittles

Active Member
You have to understand there was several men (by several I mean 20 different callers) saying pretty much the same thing. Callers saying "hey I bought my kids clothes" or "I am watching my kid on weekends" or "hey buying my kid pampers, milk" or some other type of sustenance. Let's not over analyze the point here. In what these men are saying is that many of these women are using the courts as a bargaining chip if they get into an argument, or if they find out the guy moves on and gets another girlfriend or in Gabby Douglas' fathers case wants to share custody. That was the whole point in the segment was that when these women talk about deadbeat dads and Lyekis' point of view is why do you sleep with him?

Lyekis has a point.

Lyekis is saying that women in these relationships shouldn't call men deadbeat dads if especially if a woman has four to five kids by one as Gabby Douglas' mother did. Her father (Douglas) was a staff Sergeant who was deployed to Afghanistan and served four tours. Prior to Douglas being in the olympics, Douglas apparently used her dads military benefits. Even during the course of her trial of the Olympics her dad was involved. Apparently she was quoted in saying "I can't wait to see my dad" then after she won her gold medals she did an interview and said her dad was a deadbeat.

Now there are many variables in between to consider. But I think its odd to switch your opinion of wanting to see the father, to saying the father is a deadbeat.
 
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9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
You have to understand there was several men (by several I mean 20 different callers) saying pretty much the same thing. Callers saying "hey I bought my kids clothes" or "I am watching my kid on weekends" or "hey buying my kid pampers, milk" or some other type of sustenance. Let's not over analyze the point here. In what these men are saying is that many of these women are using the courts as a bargaining chip if they get into an argument, or if they find out the guy moves on and gets another girlfriend or in Gabby Douglas' fathers case wants to share custody.
But it doesn't add up. The only way that this could happen in a way that makes sense is if the mothers were legally entitled to money from the fathers, but chose not to exercise that right until the fathers did something to **** the mothers off.

The fathers still don't come out looking good in this. What it means is that up to that point, the child hasn't been getting the resources he's been entitled to because the father hasn't volunteered his share and the mother hasn't pushed the issue.
 

Rakhel

Well-Known Member
I spent 12 years not asking my oldest's father for money. I needed it, but he didn't want to be a father. He said as much when he accused me of cheating on him(even though we were more or less joined at the hip). He wanted an out and accusing me of cheating was it. So why ask him to do something he didn't want to do.

But down the road, after hearing him brag about how he loved not getting caught in the child support web, I decided **** it, he's gotten away with it long enough. He paid, grudgingly, a total sum of $50 a month. Not $50 a week. $50 a month. For 5 years, he paid $50 dollars a month.
Then, about 2 years ago, on her 18th birthday, he called and told her "Happy 18th birthday, now I don't have to send you anymore money." Then hung up on her.

She called him back and said, "If you didn't want to have kids, why did you get someone pregnant. You think $50 a month was enough for my mother to provide me with what I needed? You think that proves you were a good father? Good thing she find a real man to provide the proper father figure I needed survive in this world."

NO woman intentionally dates or screws deadbeats. Deadbeats don't come off as deadbeats when they are searching for the next screw. They come off as charming and caring. It's only after the kids come into the picture that Hyde shows his beautiful face.
 

MoonWater

Warrior Bard
Premium Member
so what exactly is it you were wanting to discuss skittles? That deadbeat dads don't really exist? That women purposely sleep with deadbeats just so they can get pregnant off of them to manipulate them into paying child support later? That just because a father "bought his kids clothes" or "watches the kid on weekends" or "buys the kid pampers, milk or some other type of sustenance" that doing those little things alone suddenly exonerates him from being a deadbeat? Are you arguing that the only reason a woman would have for pursuing child support would be to use it as a bargaining chip to manipulate a man? What exactly is your point here?

Is it to ask why a woman would sleep with a deadbeat? Most likely she didn't know he was a deadbeat until after she got pregnant or she knew and wasn't looking to get pregnant to begin with. Women don't run out and pick up a deadbeat just so they can get pregnant and use the courts as a bargaining chip to lead him around by the nose for the next 18 years.
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
Is it to ask why a woman would sleep with a deadbeat? Most likely she didn't know he was a deadbeat until after she got pregnant or she knew and wasn't looking to get pregnant to begin with. Women don't run out and pick up a deadbeat just so they can get pregnant and use the courts as a bargaining chip to lead him around by the nose for the next 18 years.

One of my friends met a guy and got married. They jointly decided to have kids, tried, and she got pregnant. When she was 5 months along, he took off. Sometimes it's hard to spot the ********.
 

Mr. Skittles

Active Member
Thr discussion is about deadbeat dads specifically in the case of Gabby Douglas. We all have an idea of deadbeat dads which are men who get women pregnant and abandon their child and their responsibility to them.

Now in Gabby Douglas' case apparently her dad being in the national guard, was deployed and served three terms with them. This man four kids. Gabby's mother apparently wanted to fund Gabby's gymnastics training and needed money so she did what she had to do to fund Gabby's dreams. I am speculating that the mother wanted the father to fund her training. From what Lyekis said on the show, Gabby's father divorced her mother in 2007, he wanted joint custody of his kids but her.mother wanted spousal support. Now this man (Gabby's father), while serving in Kandahar, used.dial up to watch youtube videos of his daughter. Her father even flew to London to see her compete. According to news reports, Gabby Douglas was quoted as saying as she saw her father in the stands after some years of not seeing him, wanted to cry.

Now, two medals later, she was on the media saying her father was a deadbeat.....Now WTF how is her fsther a deadbeat when he is making an effort to see you? How is her dad a deadbeat when he wanted joint custody? How is he a deadbeat when she received military support via military scholarship? This is my point. Which is what most of the callers on this show was alluding to. Anything drama betwern the parents nine times out of ten the mother being a primary influence can also influence their kids to hate their father. This man is serving my country and asked for joint custody and he is a deadbeat?

That is my point. Now Lyekis' point is how can women call the men they have children by desdbeats when these women chose these deadbeats? Gabby's father was in the service. Not some drunk or some uneducated fool. What deadbeat asks for joint custody?
 

Mr. Skittles

Active Member
so what exactly is it you were wanting to discuss skittles? That deadbeat dads don't really exist? That women purposely sleep with deadbeats just so they can get pregnant off of them to manipulate them into paying child support later? That just because a father "bought his kids clothes" or "watches the kid on weekends" or "buys the kid pampers, milk or some other type of sustenance" that doing those little things alone suddenly exonerates him from being a deadbeat? Are you arguing that the only reason a woman would have for pursuing child support would be to use it as a bargaining chip to manipulate a man? What exactly is your point here?

Is it to ask why a woman would sleep with a deadbeat? Most likely she didn't know he was a deadbeat until after she got pregnant or she knew and wasn't looking to get pregnant to begin with. Women don't run out and pick up a deadbeat just so they can get pregnant and use the courts as a bargaining chip to lead him around by the nose for the next 18 years.

What world are you living in? Sure they do. Women do this all the time. I see this at the hospital all the time. Parents fight and if the children live with the mother the disgruntled mother can influence their children to hate their father out of spite it happens. How do women know they are going to be deadbeat? There are signs:

1) Is he doing something with his life?
2) Does he want to have a family? If so at what point does he want a family?
3) Does he want a long term relationship?
4) Is he a responsible person?

I don't know too many men who fit the above are deadbeats? Most responsible men who suddenly have an unexpected pregnancy don't bail. I know many men who tell a woman they don't want kids and have kids and bail. There are tale tale signs.
 

Mr. Skittles

Active Member
But it doesn't add up. The only way that this could happen in a way that makes sense is if the mothers were legally entitled to money from the fathers, but chose not to exercise that right until the fathers did something to **** the mothers off.

The fathers still don't come out looking good in this. What it means is that up to that point, the child hasn't been getting the resources he's been entitled to because the father hasn't volunteered his share and the mother hasn't pushed the issue.

You'd have to listen to the show to have a better understanding. Your getting second hand info from me.
 

Mr. Skittles

Active Member
I spent 12 years not asking my oldest's father for money. I needed it, but he didn't want to be a father. He said as much when he accused me of cheating on him(even though we were more or less joined at the hip). He wanted an out and accusing me of cheating was it. So why ask him to do something he didn't want to do.

But down the road, after hearing him brag about how he loved not getting caught in the child support web, I decided **** it, he's gotten away with it long enough. He paid, grudgingly, a total sum of $50 a month. Not $50 a week. $50 a month. For 5 years, he paid $50 dollars a month.
Then, about 2 years ago, on her 18th birthday, he called and told her "Happy 18th birthday, now I don't have to send you anymore money." Then hung up on her.

She called him back and said, "If you didn't want to have kids, why did you get someone pregnant. You think $50 a month was enough for my mother to provide me with what I needed? You think that proves you were a good father? Good thing she find a real man to provide the proper father figure I needed survive in this world."

NO woman intentionally dates or screws deadbeats. Deadbeats don't come off as deadbeats when they are searching for the next screw. They come off as charming and caring. It's only after the kids come into the picture that Hyde shows his beautiful face.

I'm sorry that you went through that and that dude was a jerk. But I agree with Lyekis on the show in that there are tale tale signs. Now yeah, there are some signals you may not see but Lyekis' point was that in getting to know someone one must see whether the man you choose wants kids and at what point does he want kids. Some men will say "sure I want kids" but you gotta be careful cause some men say that to get in the good graces of a woman only to deceive her. However, as Lyekis said on the show which is quite crude but I agree is that if a woman doesn't want a deadbeat don't have sex.

I will use myself as an example. I am not ready for a kid, I love being single but if I get a child it will be the best thing in my life because now I have a little spawn. However my goal is to be married and have kids but crap happens but I would step up to the plate. But there are a lot of men that aren't that honest as I am.
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
Who said this?

I think that's the implicit message in what you're saying. As an illustrative example, consider a plausible woman's side to one of your examples:

Another caller said:

"Me and my ex broke up because I didn't pay enough attention to her and after we broke up my ex threaten child support because I got another girlfriend."

"That guy hasn't paid a dime for his child since he left, but I took pity on him because I knew money was tight for him. Now I find out that he's living rent-free at his new girlfriend's place and they're out at the bar every night? I can't remember the last time I went out, and the kid needs new shoes and school clothes for September. It's time for him to pay his fair share."

Do you see how the picture you're painting is rather... skewed?
 

Mathematician

Reason, and reason again
It's no secret that in general custodial issues typically favor women; the research indicates "deadbeat moms/housewives" are far less likely to be prosecuted for delinquent child care and alimony payments, assuming the initial court even applied the law in such a way.

I believe that unless arranged through marriage (where all costs are theoretically shared matters) or consent, a man is not morally responsible for payments that exceed the cost of an abortion (technically half) regardless of what the law states. In the United States women have nearly complete control over the future of the infant and should shoulder the same responsibility if she elects to retain the child under her care. There are women who both purposely deceive partners about their birth control usage/fertility and alternate from pro-choice to pro-life upon conception. I have no sympathy for these women in their attempt to make their decisions absolute.

As aforementioned, family courts dis-proportionally favor women in both the U.S. and U.K - from my understanding, the situation is worse across the "pond." Shared custody should always be the first means of resolve, and any claims of abuse or indiscretion that appear at the end of a marriage should be viewed with the utmost scrutiny. There are truly deadbeat fathers, yes. There are also fathers who lost custody of their children (or only retained the dreadful "visitation rights" which aren't always enforced) and who refuse to pay child care because it's only being used by their former spouse to inflict pain. Courts really need to amend procedures to stop this abuse. The rate of depression after divorce for men is alarming compared to that of women. I believe the law is mostly at fault.

We can drag out all the anecdotes, but all I'm saying is that shared custody isn't pushed hard enough, and unless the man was married or consented to a child, he is only responsible for abortion costs. The current system is bloated, ineffective, and results in the only existing form of debt slavery (imprisonment) for delinquent parents.
 
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