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Cypriot crisis

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
What make this interesting is the very large Russian deposits in Cypriot banks. now under threat.

Like virtually all banks in the world cypriot banks are effectively insolvent. All have been kept alive by their various national governments.

If Cyprus does not get euro support, their economy will be bankrupt and banks will be unable to pay their depositors anything. This in turn will cause ALL banks to come under increasing pressure and many will fail.

I was reminded by my bank yesterday that my combined funds in their bank are only protected in law up to the value of £85,000.00 It seemed strange that they would remind me of this at this time.
 

sandandfoam

Veteran Member
What make this interesting is the very large Russian deposits in Cypriot banks. now under threat.

Government politicians here in Ireland seem to be taking the approach that it's fine to dip into individuals bank accounts if the individuals are Russian. That seems very odd to me.

I think what they said to you in the bank was odd too. There's a lot of oddness about this.
 

Flankerl

Well-Known Member
We obviously have to send those poor cypriots more money. The party has to go on.

Which is what the cypriots have in mind.
 

Flankerl

Well-Known Member
Oh yeah the evil germans forced the cypriot banks to heavily invest their dirty russian money into the craziness that is known as greece.

Its all in the evil germans masterplan to rule over middle earth uh i mean the world.

To enslave all the people. Yes those germans never changed...


When the germans turn their backs to the european idea you'll wish that there still was a EU.
 

sandandfoam

Veteran Member
When the germans turn their backs to the european idea you'll wish that there still was a EU.


While peripheral Europe is dying on its feet because of austerity German wages are rising above the rate of inflation and its economy continues to grow helped in no small measure by the Euro. That would not be happening if Germany had its own currency - no one could afford German stuff.
Of course notions of German superiority are being peddled by Bild and its ilk but Germans bailing others out is nonsense. The transfer of wealth is from the peripheral nations to Germany. Killing the rest of us but great for the Germans. If in a moment of madness the Germans abandoned the empire building and left the euro behind the German economy would implode. I admit I would experience schadenfreude in that event - but it's never going to happen.
 

Flankerl

Well-Known Member
While peripheral Europe is dying on its feet because of austerity German wages are rising above the rate of inflation

Oh yeah german wages are rising. Where exactly? Because its simply not happening.
Most people earn less than 15 years ago. Their wages simply didnt rise while the daily costs did indeed rise.
When the Euro was introduced the shops just changed from DM to € without changing the actual numbers. But according to politicians this never happened.

But keep believing.


That would not be happening if Germany had its own currency - no one could afford German stuff.

Yeah like the old times when germany still had the DM. Basically no one bought german stuff... oh well except everyone.


Of course notions of German superiority are being peddled by Bild

The BILD? Who cares? No one except the idiots? Great.


but Germans bailing others out is nonsense. The transfer of wealth is from the peripheral nations to Germany. Killing the rest of us but great for the Germans.

Yes because everyone pays except the germans. Of course. Thank goodness you arent biased.


If in a moment of madness the Germans abandoned the empire building and left the euro behind the German economy would implode.

Yeah like back in the days when they had their own currency and germany was basically a giant dump. Except it was not.


I admit I would experience schadenfreude in that event - but it's never going to happen.

Shows how biased you are.

Germany is doing somewhat good because it had a rather difficult welfare reform which basically took away the whole left wing of the social democrats.

Now people work for 5 - 8€ an hour without any pay for overtime. Usually they cant live on it and have to get welfare support by the state.
And if they refuse? Then there are some romanians or bulgarians nearby who easily work for 3€ an hour.

Yeah those evil germans really are living the dream.
 

sandandfoam

Veteran Member
Oh yeah german wages are rising. Where exactly? Because its simply not happening.

The facts are against you. You can blather on about how the Germans are really the victims but it does your argument no justice.
For the record I don't hate Germans, nor do I consider them evil.

UPDATE 2-Steel workers in north-west Germany win 3 pct pay rise | Reuters

Around 75,000 steel workers in north-west Germany will receive an above-inflation wage hike of 3 percent this year, trade union IG Metall and employers agreed on Wednesday, in a deal which could set the tone for a series of wider agreements.
Economists have predicted wage rises in Germany will outpace inflation in 2013 as September's federal election makes politicians more likely to back unions' demands


German state workers win above-inflation pay rise | News | DW.DE | 09.03.2013
Some 765,000 employees of Germany's state governments have won an above-inflation, 5.6 percent pay increase over two years. It is the first major wage deal made in Germany this year. ......Germany's recent economic growth has fueled calls for big pay rises after years of relative restraint. In March 2012, federal and municipal employees won a 6.3 percent raise over two years.

German growth view doubled - Investors.com
German workers have secured hefty wage gains recently, lifting their disposable income.
 

oldbadger

Skanky Old Mongrel!
BBC News at 10pm reports a worsening situation in Cyprus. Bank employees are demonstrating outside the Government offices, huge queues outside banks, hoping to obtain some money from ATMs. I remember the Northern Rock queues, but this is something much more dreadful. I don't think that we've reached anywhere near the bottom of this financial pit.
 

sandandfoam

Veteran Member
I don't think that we've reached anywhere near the bottom of this financial pit.
Nor do I
Cyprus is criticised for having an overly large banking sector and, at seven times its GDP, it is too large. Part of the reason it is too large is that Cyprus, like another small island we can think of, operates as an offshore financial centre. And here we see a rancid whiff of racism and xenophobia.

The meme is "Cyprus is stuffed with hot money from Russia," and so any hit to the banking sector will show Ivan who’s boss — Angela, in case anyone wondered. That this is improbable, and that the data suggest that perhaps €7bn of the total €70bn deposit base of the Cypriot banks is held by Russians from Russia, some of which may be hot, is irrelevant. Anyhow €7bn would hardly get you into oligarch circles nowadays. But the meme persists.

Cypriot banks were seen as safe, and so were attracting large flows from Greek and other depositors. The largest growth in non-EU money came from other financial institutions, not households or corporations. And so, faced with 90% debt GDP ratios and fast out of money fast, the Cypriots have been asking for a bailout since last June. Despite this, it took another 3am meeting, chaired lest we forget by Michael Noonan, to decide on an extraordinary course of action.

A bailout of €17bn would have caused a massive spike in the debt/gdp ratio, and there seems still, five years after Bear Sterns, to be no willingness in the chancelleries of Europe to realise that a union means solidarity. Faced with the requirement to restructure Cypriot sovereign debt to make the total sustainable, Cyprus’ European partners, ourselves included, forced them to raid the savings of the Cypriot people. Although the Cypriot banks have little senior debt this was, and here we are into Alice in Wonderland territory, not burned.

And this was accompanied by the by now familiar hectoring and bullying, with the threats of the ATMs running out and the ECB cutting off liquidity and who knows what. All reports suggest, frankly, a hegemonic Germany run amok and declaring fiscal war on another small state. That should make everyone worried. This is dangerous territory, setting a bad precedent. Its unjust and incoherent.

Will Irish savers be next to pay as EU targets Cypriot depositors? | Irish Examiner
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Like virtually all banks in the world cypriot banks are effectively insolvent.
Just to set the record straight, we have quite a few solvent banks here.
A great many local banks hold their own portfolio, so they were more careful about
lending than those who sold loans they originated on the secondary market. I plan
to use only local banks for my current & future banking & borrowing. They're better.
 

dust1n

Zindīq
Just to set the record straight, we have quite a few solvent banks here.
A great many local banks hold their own portfolio, so they were more careful about
lending than those who sold loans they originated on the secondary market. I plan
to use only local banks for my current & future banking & borrowing. They're better.

Especially credit unions, no? I suspect their rates will be higher (not always; elaboration in one second), but the money stored is invested directly in the immediate community. Advantageous in the long run. Especially if you plan on living somewhere for a while. (Elaboration:) Personally, I got way better interest rates for local credit unions that were exclusive in some regards, especially for car rates, but the measure between the two isn't objective.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
I belong to a credit union too, but their services are pretty limited compared to a bank (loan size, commercial lending, check cashing).
 

lunakilo

Well-Known Member
The facts are against you. You can blather on about how the Germans are really the victims but it does your argument no justice.
For the record I don't hate Germans, nor do I consider them evil.

UPDATE 2-Steel workers in north-west Germany win 3 pct pay rise | Reuters




German state workers win above-inflation pay rise | News | DW.DE | 09.03.2013


German growth view doubled - Investors.com
Just because germans are not the victims does not make them guilty.

It is like if a person who gets hit by a car and breaks both legs blames the guy next to him who escaped virtually unharmed for causing the car crash.
 

Reverend Rick

Frubal Whore
Premium Member
That would not be happening if Germany had its own currency - no one could afford German stuff.

The Germans make quality stuff. Thats why they are successful. While I cannot afford to have a German bolt a wheel on a car, I can afford to let them build motors for cars we assemble over here.

The difference between Germany and the rest of the Euro is they are productive and can maintain the services they provide for their citizens.

If your countrymen are educated, talented and skillful you will prosper.

If your workforce is unemployed, uneducated and have no skills, you cannot maintain entitlements and eventually go bankrupt.

Take the Greeks for instance. The one's who come to America are hard working and successful for the most part. If you sit on your butt in coffee shops and retire at 55 expecting entitlements like many folks in Greece do, you go broke.
 
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