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Featured Could Christianity and Islam ever reach a consensus?

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Lucian Hodoboc, Jul 23, 2017.

  1. Lucian Hodoboc

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    Could Christianity and Islam ever reach a consensus in regards to Jesus' identity? If no, which of the two religions is more likely to disappear first? If yes, which of the two religions do you think should and will make the bigger compromise? Will Christians accept Jesus as a divine prophet? Will Muslims adopt the concept of Trinity? Will they decide to change Jesus' status into both a prophet and The Son Of God to incorporate both beliefs?
     
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  2. Muslim-UK

    Muslim-UK Well-Known Member
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    Christianity will give ground, it already is with a great falling away. They used to regard the Bible as God's unchanged word, yet few hold that position today. Liberal Biblical Scholars acknowledge much of what we know about Jesus pbuh in the NT are later stories, often altered to elevate the status of Jesus pbuh.

    On a common sense level, it makes no sense to believe the Creator of the known Universe became a imperfect man.

    He was a Prophet, albeit a mighty one.
     
  3. Lucian Hodoboc

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    Well, that's the thing: He didn't become an imperfect man. He became a perfect man.
     
  4. LuisDantas

    LuisDantas Aura of atheification
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    Not very likely. Or at the very least, we would have very different forms of either or both at that point.

    Then again, I am not sure of how meaningful such a goal would be. For both creeds those are not really academical matters subject to research and reconsideration. For quite a few Christians and apparently nearly all Muslims the point is to proudly reject such efforts.


    Islaam, probably, since it apparently has never been a religion.

    But if you mean the doctrines proper, that is not a very useful question. What would such a disappearance even be? How would we even realize that it happened?


    Christians generally have no issue with acknowledging that Jesus was a divine prophet. They just tend to insist that he was so much more besides.

    Muslims forbid themselves from even acknowledging that Trinitarianism deserves a word of its own, distinguishable from "idolatry", and they have also convinced themselves that such is the desire of God himself.

    But that is doctrinary reality, which, to paraphrase, doesn't often survive contact with everyday reality. These matters are highly situational by nature. In Sierra Leone, at least, word has it that neither Christians nor Muslims really care all that much about those doctrinary clashes. And indeed, no one should.
     
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  5. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon shunyadragon
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    I believe this claim of perfection is questionable belief considering Jesus own testimony, and the claim of the literal Trinity will not be accepted outside traditional Christianity. It is not grounded in the Old Testament Monotheism, which both Judaism, Islam and the Baha'i Faith believe in. A number of Christian churches (still a minority) reject the Trinity.

    Even naive, fruitless and idealistic attempts at ecumenism has been long doomed to failure even among the Christian churches that believe in the Trinity.

    As a Baha'i I consider Judaism, Christianity, and Islam ancient religious paradigms that fail to address the universal needs of the modern world, and they in one way or another alienate each other and the other religions of the world with their claims and actions in history. As an alternative secularism offers a more realistic positive world view that allows for change and an evolving human advancement, and rejects the traditional beliefs and ongoing conflicts between the religions, and misguided Nationalism. The standards of secularism in the modern world can be found in the humanist manifesto, and the Charter of the United Nations, which resemble in substance the Divine plan of the Baha'i Faith
     
    #5 shunyadragon, Jul 23, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2017
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  6. Brickjectivity

    Brickjectivity Turned to Stone. Now I stretch daily.
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    For over 1500 years both religions have existed with neither one striking out the other. Has anything changed?
     
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  7. Lyndon

    Lyndon "Peace is the answer" quote: GOD, 2014
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    The thing that would settle it is Jesus coming back to earth, both religions believe in a Second Coming of Jesus.
     
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  8. Brickjectivity

    Brickjectivity Turned to Stone. Now I stretch daily.
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    The Q'ran spells it out the physical return of Jesus with no room for interpretation, but the Christian Bible provides layers of meaning such that should Jesus not physically return there is no problem. Many Christians believe the return of Jesus is about Christ filling everyone with wisdom. Historically many Catholics have said its about Christ reigning in the church. Its only Muslims who *all* believe Jesus must physically return, since that is plain speech in the Q'ran while in the NT it is easily figurative.
     
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  9. Dawnofhope

    Dawnofhope Veteran Member
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    It seems unlikely.

    According to Pew research ( A Christian organisation) Islam is set to numerically overtake Christianity as the worlds largest religion by the end of this century.

    Why Muslims are the world’s fastest-growing religious group

    Both Christianity and Islam are too divided amongst themselves to make that question meaningful. It becomes a matter for each individual to decide the truth. If we sat round waiting for religious leaders to answer those kind of questions, we would be waiting in vain.

    Unlikely for most...

    Never

    I think you are barking up the wrong tree trying to get these religions to agree amongst themselves about their core beliefs, but I like your optimism all the same. Both religions are right and both are wrong. Both need to fundamentally change to better adapt to the modern world. I doubt if either can.

    Welcome to RF btw:)
     
  10. The magical volleyball

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    Christians don't agree with other Christians and Muslims don't agree with other Muslims. Seems very unlikely Christians and Muslims would be able to come to a absolute consensus on a topic as monumental as the divinity of Jesus Christ.

    Especially when all evidence of his existence and claims of divinity are unreliable at best and at worst pure fiction.
     
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  11. Limo

    Limo Active Member

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    There is no presentation of what is called "Christianity" only. There is no agreement between Christianities about Jesus identity even.
    There are Christianities that are so close to Islam more than other Christianities.
    The problem with Christianities believes is that it's philosophical thinking more than biblical or inspiration.
    Christianities believes are changing/enhanced over time.
    There are a few born Christians who don't believe in Trinity and divine Jesus without being Moslems.

    There is no way for Moslems to change their believe as it's based on Quran.

    Neither relegions will vanish but no of Christians is decreasing while no of Moslems is increasing
     
  12. wizanda

    wizanda One Accepts All Religious Texts
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    Know of It in the Hadiths; if you could show where the Quran says it please?

    43:60-61 And if We please, We could make among you angels to be successors in the land. And most surely it is a knowledge of the hour, therefore have no doubt about it and follow me: this is the right path.

    This Surah often has jesus added, to make it match the Hadiths. :innocent:
     
  13. Brickjectivity

    Brickjectivity Turned to Stone. Now I stretch daily.
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    Jesus Will Return - IslamiCity

    The Return of Jesus (part 2 of 5) - The Religion of Islam
    "But they killed him not, nor crucified him; It was only a likeness shown to them: Most certainly they killed him not. Rather, God lifted him up to Himself." (Quran 4:157-8)
    "And there is none of the People of the Book but will believe in him before his death, and on the Day of Judgment, he will be a witness against them." (Quran 4:159)
     
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  14. Muslim-UK

    Muslim-UK Well-Known Member
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    Qur'an says Jesus pbuh taken up to Allah swt without being crucified or killed.

    Messiah set to return to Israel according to Jewish Scriptures.
    Messiah set to return according to NT
    Messiah set to return according to Hadiths of the Prophet pbuh

    Seems pretty conclusive to me.
     
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  15. FunctionalAtheist

    FunctionalAtheist Hammer of Reason

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    Then why did he have doubt?
     
  16. Lucian Hodoboc

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    Doubt about what?
     
  17. Augustus

    Augustus the Unreasonable

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    Probably won't be very unifying though as Muslim Jesus comes back to kill all the pigs and break all the crosses.

    Prior to that the Muslims have a war with the Byzantine Empire where medieval style armies fight with swords, so if you see that on CNN, hold onto your hats (and stock up on bacon).
     
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  18. Lucian Hodoboc

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    Why would Muslim Jesus do that?
     
  19. Muslim-UK

    Muslim-UK Well-Known Member
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    Because he was never killed on the cross as Christians like to celebrate. He didn't eat pork either.
     
  20. The Emperor of Mankind

    The Emperor of Mankind Currently the galaxy's spookiest paraplegic

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    But since he's unlikely to ever do that, this point is moot.


    No as both religions rely on separate, exclusionary claims as to who Jesus was. Christians claim he was either the Son of God or God himself, Muslims claims he was merely a prophet.


    It's hard to say at this stage. Christianity seems to have become complacent but could potentially rebound. Islam is growing right now but its hypocritical demands for respect, deference & submission from non-Muslims could backfire and serve to unite the non-Muslim world against Islam's continued spread.


    I can't see either one making a compromise as to do so would irreparably damage their theological claims. But if I had to guess which one would crack first... Christianity. Islam is so doctrinally rigid (and given that it claims to be the complete, perfect religion sent by Allah, why not?) that I don't think the concept of doctrinal compromise is a thing Muslim religious scholars even understand. In fact the concept of bid'ah would stand strongly in the way of any such change in orthodoxy.


    No. If Jesus is merely a prophet and not the Messiah then their entire religion falls apart.


    No - Islam is not just worship of the One God, it's the worship of monotheism itself. Islam is so irrevocably fixated on monotheism that it can't encourage religious thinking that strays even slightly outwith such a paradigm.
     
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