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Featured Conversion to Your Religion

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by SalixIncendium, Aug 31, 2019.

  1. SalixIncendium

    SalixIncendium सच्चिदानन्द
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    I was reading a thread in which someone wished to convert to Judaism and that the process can take a couple of years and one has to be accepted into the religion. This got me wondering...

    How difficult is it for someone of another religion or faith or someone of no religion to convert to your religion? What does it take to be officially recognized as a (insert name of your religion here)?
     
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  2. MikeDwight

    MikeDwight Well-Known Member

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    Of Course your Parliament has to ratify Presbyterianism, or a King has to like your origin country, or a President has to want to move your Presbyterianism around. Personal Faith is never experienced in Scotland its just like, oh there it goes, now its over this way, oh. The tax rate, just start sending in a tax rate of 10% every tax day and you can pretend you're an Establishmentarian. For all the hard work Presbyterians are doing in the world.
    [​IMG]
     
  3. SalixIncendium

    SalixIncendium सच्चिदानन्द
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    [​IMG]
     
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  4. MikeDwight

    MikeDwight Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
    Obviously if you just want to get a saber and start chopping up Europe, see, obviously Light Blue is good, blue, they need some convincing from the top, yellow , green, swing away. We got your dogtags. no Wait! Send in your dogtags
     
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  5. Phaedrus

    Phaedrus Active Member

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    Deconversion from religion to become an atheist is easy; just stop placing irrational faith in fairy tales.
     
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  6. SalixIncendium

    SalixIncendium सच्चिदानन्द
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    Did you intend to answer either of the questions in the OP?
     
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  7. Vinayaka

    Vinayaka devotee
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    Hinduism, as you probably know, is all over the map. Some Hindus, for example, will flat out say it is impossible to do. No non-Hindu can ever become a Hindu, period.
    Others, on the other end of the spectrum, will say all you have to do is start practicing, or just declare it, and then you are Hindu.

    Personally, I don't buy into either of these two extremes. In my sampradaya, it would take a couple of years, or longer, and it's termed colloquially 'ethical conversion' as it's a process. The first step is to go back and study out your own religion to have a better look at that so you have time to reflect, and perhaps conclude that this was just some whim. Best to not act on whims. But eventually, with persistence and due diligence, we do accept converts and adoptives.

    There are many other sampradayas that do variations of this. Arya Samaj, for example will de-convert, accepting souls back who have temporarily gone astray so to speak.

    In the end, it's business as usual in that the individual decides for himself/herself.
     
    #7 Vinayaka, Aug 31, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2019
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  8. SalixIncendium

    SalixIncendium सच्चिदानन्द
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    Where to you prefer irrational faith be placed if not in fairy tales?
     
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  9. MikeDwight

    MikeDwight Well-Known Member

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    Alright Salix! Alright! If you don't have the disposition to accept the general ruling of government on behalf of your soul, the English tend to do this, I suppose a very special recognition may be to read the Scriptures, accept Baptism by sprinkling is just fine, confess to the Westminster Confession, the Nicene Creed, the Longer and Shorter Catechism, and don't forget about that dogtag.
     
  10. Salvador

    Salvador RF's Swedenborgian

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    Anybody who follows the teachings of Emanuel Swedenborg is Swedenborgian.

    Emanuel Swedenborg was an 18th Century Swedish civil engineer, inventor, musician, scientist and theologian. Also, he was connected with the "Spirit "world that enabled him to perform some remarkable feats. On the 29th of July in the year of our Lord 1759, he attended a large dinner party gathering in Gothenberg, nearly 300 miles away from his home in Stockholm. At 6 p.m. that evening, he alerted several party attendees that there was a fire spreading then in Stockholm where one of his friend's home was just then burnt down by this fire which had also put his own home and manuscripts in peril of being destroyed. At 8 p.m. that evening, he reported the fire as being extinguished 3 doors away from his home. Three days later, news of this fire had reached Gothenberg via pony express from Stockholm. It was then confirmed that the fire had happened exactly as Swedenborg had described. When people asked Swedenborg how he could have known about this fire when it was in progress, he told them that Spirits told him about the fire.

    The more that Swedenborg became involved with spiritualism, the more that was revealed to Swedenborg by "spirits".

    During the following year in the spring of 1760, a Dutch ambassador's widow was assured by Swedenborg that her deceased husband's spirit would reveal to her the location of a receipt which showed a bill paid to a silversmith who'd falsely claimed that this bill was left unpaid. Eight days after this Dutch ambassador's widow had received spiritual comfort from Swedenborg, the widow of the Dutch ambassador had a dream which revealed the location of the receipt which showed her husband had indeed paid his bill owed to the silversmith.

    During 1762 in Amersterdam, Swedenborg held a séance with many attendees to whom he provided an accurate and precise vision of Russian emperor Peter III's death, just moments after Russian emperor Peter III was indeed strangled to death in prison.

    Emanuel Swedenborg was the first person to propose parts of the Nebular hypothesis, which may have been revealed to him by the "Spirit "World.

     
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  11. SalixIncendium

    SalixIncendium सच्चिदानन्द
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    In your sampradaya, who makes the final determination that one is ready to be officially recognized as a Saivite Hindu? Are there prescribed guidelines other than that mentioned above?
     
  12. Shiranui117

    Shiranui117 Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
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    For Christians coming from other denominations, it can take anywhere from a few months to a few years to become an Orthodox Christian. For people coming from other religions entirely, I have no idea since I haven't spoken with anyone who's converted to Orthodoxy from another religion about this particular subject, but I'd imagine it'd be more on the side of a year or more. In my case, I was coming from Roman Catholicism, but I took 8 years to fully decide to join because I wanted to be sure that Orthodoxy would remain home for me (which my priests were all perfectly cool with). The length of time depends on a lot of individual factors--familiarity with Orthodoxy, any areas where the inquirer has some problems with Orthodox teaching, feeling of readiness to commit oneself fully to the Orthodox Church, etc.

    During this time, inquirers into Orthodoxy should get in the habit of going to Divine Liturgy every Sunday. Getting in touch with a priest to learn more about the Faith is essential. The priest will instruct the inquirer, either in more formal-style classes if there are many converts, or it may just be you and the priest sitting down with a couple books after Liturgy during coffee hour. At least in the English-speaking world, the go-to catechetical materials are generally Metropolitan Kallistos Ware's The Orthodox Church and The Orthodox Way. We also make use of Fr. Thomas Hopko's The Orthodox Faith series of books. Other books can be thrown in from there as each individual priest sees fit, and depending on what the particular inquirer wants to/needs to learn more about.

    Once the inquirer feels confident enough and the priest thinks the inquirer is ready, the inquirer is made into a catechumen. In some parishes, this is an official mini-ceremony. In other parishes like mine, the priest just pretty much says "K sweet you're a catechumen now". A date for the individual's baptism or chrismation is then set. This can be 40 days out, a few months out, or it can be a full year out, it depends on an individual basis. Many converts are received on Lazarus Saturday (the week before Pascha), on Pascha (Orthodox Easter) or on Christmas (in my case, I was received on the Sunday before Christmas). During the period of the catechumenate, it's standard practice during the Liturgy to pray the Litany of the Catechumens, where the catechumen is called forth before the Royal Doors and the priest intones a litany of prayers for the catechumens. Depending on the age of the catechumen, godparents or sponsors may be assigned at this point as well. The priest will advise the catechumen on how much they should worry about participating in the fasts of the Orthodox Church (generally they're told to not worry about it or are only given a very light fasting rule).

    From here, the track deviates a bit. For those who have been baptized in some other Christian denomination in the name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, generally a baptism is not recognized as necessary, though there are some Orthodox jurisdictions which baptize all incoming converts, regardless of their former religious tradition. Previously baptized Christians will go to confession shortly before their reception into the Church and make a lifetime confession to Christ, confessing every sin they can recall ever having committed in their lives (some priests just have you confess all your sins since your baptism or since your last confession as a Catholic) though the priest does not yet pronounce Christ's absolution of your sins.

    Now as far as the actual manner in which converts are received, that's up to the discretion of each individual Orthodox bishop, though everybody recognizes how everybody else receives converts as being valid, so there's no awkwardness for people who are actually received into the Church. The main practice for receiving previously baptized converts to the Orthodox Church is by chrismation, or anointing with oil on the forehead, hands, ears, chest, feet, and I think some other places I'm forgetting about. If the convert is a former Roman Catholic, it's often the case that only chrismation on the forehead happens (as was my case). The priest and the congregation pray for the catechumen, the catechumen says the Creed, the priest pronounces absolution of the catechumen's sins, and then the catechumen is chrismated. As the priest anoints each spot, he says "The seal of the gift of the Holy Spirit", sealing the newly-illumined Orthodox Christian with the Holy Spirit. Then the Divine Liturgy starts up, with some bits changed to reflect the festal nature of the occasion. When it comes time for communion, the newly-received Orthodox Christian is the first to go up and receive the Eucharist. And that's it.

    For people who weren't previously baptized or lack a valid baptism, there is no lifetime confession since they're being baptized anyway, but first the baptism ceremony happens in which they are exorcised, renounce Satan and all his works, give their lives to Christ, say the Creed, get baptized by immersion in water three times in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, then they are robed in white, and then they receive the full chrismation, and then they receive the Eucharist. Families being received into the Church also have their children baptized and chrismated, and the children (including infants) receive the Eucharist.
     
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  13. MikeDwight

    MikeDwight Well-Known Member

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    I'm pretty sure you want to be a Baptist or a Anabaptist or AK Menonite Amish, or. Oh your Special Day?! IS it ?! Your special Day?! And you had a Crazy day the other day and its all clear to you now?! This way! The Burned Over district is this way!
     
  14. Shiranui117

    Shiranui117 Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
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    Literally what are you talking about? I can't make heads or tails of what you're trying to say, this post or your other posts in this thread. Out of actual and legitimate concern for your well-being, without even a hint of malice or snark, are you feeling alright?
     
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  15. Shiranui117

    Shiranui117 Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
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    I'm sorry man, but you have officially lost me. I have absolutely not even a slight inkling of what you're talking about. So uhh, have a nice day I guess.
     
  16. MikeDwight

    MikeDwight Well-Known Member

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    OH look at THIS guy everybody look at this guy, who's entire orthodoxo-sphere fell to communism, and its because 1900 Russia is full of these superstitious relics and land-bound serfs and the poor, and losing to Japan. Maybe some skulls can fix this problem, have we asked blessing from the skulls?
     
  17. Jainarayan

    Jainarayan ॐ नमो भगवते वासुदेवाय
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    Yep. When I went from Catholic to Orthodox it took a couple of months. I had weekly private meetings with the parish priest, attended Divine Liturgy and Vespers. Having been Catholic and being a quick study he said I was ready for Chrismation (why does that spelling look funny?) sooner than he expected.
     
  18. MikeDwight

    MikeDwight Well-Known Member

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    Which Orthodox, it matters. All these Orthodox people , unbelievable. The fall of Constantinople and the Byzantines led to the Russian declaring Russia the Third Rome, Rome, Constantinople, Moscow, and the Eastern expansion across to the pacific ocean, so, the Russians and Cosntantinople are basically excommunicating each other that whole 350 years. I think any other Church Orthodoxy does follow Constantinople's Ecumenicism and not Moscow's Ecumenicism, Ukraine will be in Constantinople's ecumenicism. Bulgaria, Romania, Armenians, Georgia (I think)
     
  19. Pastek

    Pastek Sunni muslim

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    In Islam you just have to say the shahada (in arabic) : "I witness there is no god but Allah and Muhammad is the messenger of Allah".

    You can do it alone, it's ok because your first witness is God himself.
    But better to go in the mosque if possible (not obligatory).
     
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  20. MikeDwight

    MikeDwight Well-Known Member

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    Pikachu is Muslim. this explains so many things. We can still DRAW Pikachu...?


     
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