Conscious thoughts struggle to find a reason.

[Trailblazer]

Maybe they still posting because they want to make you frustrated, they know you will reply and go in to any battle with them.
Better to not say anything and leave them thinking what they do.

I think they are still posting because they have to be right, they just have to be. This is all about ego.
They cannot admit they are wrong about me because it would be too much of a blow to their ego.

I do not care who is right about beliefs or non-beliefs but when people start the personal criticisms and cannot produce any evidence of what I did wrong that is where I draw the line. They can't explain why they are right about me and what I did, they just deflect and obfuscate when I ask them to produce the evidence. The only reason I respond is because it is unjust to accuse me of doing things and not present any evidence of what I did.

2: O SON OF SPIRIT! The best beloved of all things in My sight is Justice; turn not away therefrom if thou desirest Me, and neglect it not that I may confide in thee. By its aid thou shalt see with thine own eyes and not through the eyes of others, and shalt know of thine own knowledge and not through the knowledge of thy neighbor. Ponder this in thy heart; how it behooveth thee to be. Verily justice is My gift to thee and the sign of My loving-kindness. Set it then before thine eyes.
The Hidden Words of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 3-4

 

[PureX]

Even if it is so, isn't it just ego to have to prove it is so?

Why assume one is just "proving it"? Why can't they be trying to enlighten a dimmed mind? Or simply establishing boundaries for those who have no sense of propriety? There are some good reasons for confronting people (bad one's too, of course). and there are situations where kindness and tolerance do more harm than good.

 

[Trailblazer]

Why do you assume one is just "proving it"? Why can't they be trying to enlighten a dimmed mind? Or simply establishing boundaries for those who have no sense of propriety?

I did not assume that, that was just the first thing that came to my mind. There are all kinds of reasons why people respond to posts....

Personally, I think it is pretty hopeless to try to enlighten a dimmed mind since those kinds of people never hear what what others say to them. I also see it as hopeless to try to establish boundaries with people who have none. They are not going to change unless they want to change. Working on oneself is hard work and unless people think they need to change they will not try to change. Egotistical people are people who only look at the faults of others never at their own faults so they see no reason to change.

Of course not all people on this forum are like, not even most, but some are. I consider these people toxic and I don't want anything to do with them. They always want to blame me and try to make it look like I am the one who is wrong or bad but when confronted they can never explain why but rather they obfuscate and deflect.

One thing I learned in the 12 step programs many years ago is that we cannot change other people places and things, we can only change ourselves by looking at our own character defects and trying to address them.

 

[PureX]

I did not assume that, that was just the first thing that came to my mind. There are all kinds of reasons why people respond to posts....

Sorry, that was worded badly on my part.

Personally, I think it is pretty hopeless to try to enlighten a dimmed mind since those kinds of people never hear what others say to them. I also see it as hopeless to try to establish boundaries with people who have none. They are not going to change unless they want to change. Working on oneself is hard work and unless people think they need to change they will not try to change. Egotistical people are people who only look at the faults of others never at their own faults so they see no reason to change.

All true, But I find that I am very bad at predicting when and how someone else's 'light bulb' will go on. So really all I can do is speak my piece and move on. It'll either take root or it won't. And the same is true in return. I need other people to speak their piece as well because I never know when they will say something that changes the way I see the world.

One thing I learned in the 12 step programs many years ago is that we cannot change other people places and things, we can only change ourselves by looking at our own character defects and trying to address them.

I think we can and do change other people for the better. But we just can't do it by our will, or against theirs. (Thank God!) It'll happen when they (or we) are ready. And that's very hard to predict.

 

[Trailblazer]

All true, But I find that I am very bad at predicting when and how someone else's 'light bulb' will go on. So really all I can do is speak my piece and move on. It'll either take root or it won't. And the same is true in return. I need other people to speak their piece as well because I never know when they will say something that changes the way I see the world.

That's very true. We can never know what people are thinking, only what they say, so what we say might have a positive influence even if we do not realize it, and even if they don't realize it.

Likewise, what others say can have a positive influence upon us. I can still remember something you said about religion and being able to believe it by interpreting it in your own way. That comment came at a time when I was struggling with some teachings of my religion and I needed to view them in my own way rather than being concerned with how others view them.

I think we can and do change other people for the better. But we just can't do it by our will, or against theirs. (Thank God!) It'll happen when they (or we) are ready. And that's very hard to predict.

I fully agree. I am a firm believer in free will, the right to choose, and personal responsibility. That is why when atheists say I have the burden of proof to prove that God exists or that someone is a Messenger of God I disagree. If they want to believe in God or the Messenger they are responsible to prove it to themselves. All I can do is tell them where I believe the evidence is and where they can go to look at it.

I don't think anyone but God can predict the future or know it, but that is probably for the best because I don't even want to know mine! I can barely deal with the present, one day at a time.

 

[Truthseeker]

I am sorry I have to call out atheists but they are the ones who always think they are right and I am wrong.

I think part of the reason you are singling out atheists is that you have talking to them so much lately. Remember your contentious debates with some Christians? Including here. Remember being thrown out of Christian forums at Delphi forums?

 

[Trailblazer]

I think part of the reason you are singling out atheists is that you have talking to them so much lately. Remember your contentious debates with some Christians? Including here. Remember being thrown out of Christian forums at Delphi forums?

I have had no problems with any Christians on this forum, only with atheists, but not all atheists, only a few.
I remember Delphi forums but this forum is different because it has a large staff and a fair staff.

 

[Truthseeker]

Sometimes it is so.

You can't presume that.

 

[Spirit of Light]

You can't presume that.

What do you mean?

 

[Truthseeker]

I have had no problems with any Christians on this forum, only with atheists, but not all atheists, only a few.
I remember Delphi forums but this forum is different because it has a large staff and a fair staff.

There is one Christian in particular you have complained about to me. There are more atheists perhaps.

 

[Truthseeker]

What do you mean?

Sorry I haven't talked to you lately, but I have been harangued by atheists lately. I was too involved with them. I was defending my faith.

 

[Truthseeker]

Even if it is so, isn't it just ego to have to prove it is so?

That's a much better response than I gave to that response.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Sorry I haven't talked to you lately, but I have been harangued by atheists lately. I was too involved with them. I was defending my faith.

No problem
Your faith is between you and God, what others say is not that important, atheists has their view

 

[Truthseeker]

I have started to do that. Once something has been said, it's been said. Why go over it again and again? If they want the last word they can have it, It is pure unadulterated ego to have to be right, especially when it is about another person and what they are thinking and doing. It is so arrogant and they can't even see it. Baha'u'llah had something to say about this.

26: O SON OF BEING! How couldst thou forget thine own faults and busy thyself with the faults of others? Whoso doeth this is accursed of Me. The Hidden Words of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 10

66: O EMIGRANTS! The tongue I have designed for the mention of Me, defile it not with detraction. If the fire of self overcome you, remember your own faults and not the faults of My creatures, inasmuch as every one of you knoweth his own self better than he knoweth others. The Hidden Words of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 45

You may have a character trait of compulsively answering again and again, but you can control it somewhat. I can also do the same with my character traits of autism, ADD, and anxiety.

 

[Trailblazer]

There is one Christian in particular you have complained about to me. There are more atheists perhaps.

Oh, I forgot about her. I don't really view her as a Christian and certainly not one I am debating since all she does is take pot shots at me and Baha'u'llah and the Baha'i Faith.She never engages me in any kind of discussion. She just looks for ways to try to embarrass me.

 

[Trailblazer]

You may have a character trait of compulsively answering again and again, but you can control it somewhat. I can also do the same with my character traits of autism, ADD, and anxiety.

I have some control but not as much as I'd like. I plan to work on that with my counselor.

 

[Truthseeker]

I do not care who is right about beliefs or non-beliefs but when people start the personal criticisms and cannot produce any evidence of what I did wrong that is where I draw the line.

I wish I could be like you in one way. I care too much when my faith is attacked. It used to make me angry when someone attacked it, and I've made some progress, now it just makes me depressed after it relentlessly happening over and over like the last two days. I hope that's progress, anyway. I don't get angry, and want to say something I'll regret in anger. So many times I've not replied at all because I didn't want to explode on them.

 

[Trailblazer]

I wish I could be like you in one way. I care too much when my faith is attacked. It used to make me angry when someone attacked it, and I've made some progress, now it just makes me depressed after it relentlessly happening over and over like the last two days. I hope that's progress, anyway. I don't get angry, and want to say something I'll regret in anger. So many times I've not replied at all because I didn't want to explode on them.

I do not care that much if the Baha'i Faith is attacked because I can always defend it, unless they bring up something I am unfamiliar with, and then I send it on to other Baha'is like you, sorry. What gets to me more are personal attacks. Even though I know what they are saying is not true, it hurts because it is just mean.

 

[Truthseeker]

Oh, I forgot about her. I don't really view her as a Christian and certainly not one I am debating since all she does is take pot shots at me and Baha'u'llah and the Baha'i Faith.She never engages me in any kind of discussion. She just looks for ways to try to embarrass me.

Not a Christian? In what sense, doesn't behave like one, or unusual beliefs?

I'll take your word for it on the rest. I've not been present for most of that. How you describe that sounds like a certain Hindu atheist I know which I've put on ignore.

 

[osgart]

I do not care that much if the Baha'i Faith is attacked because I can always defend it, unless they bring up something I am unfamiliar with, and then I send it on to other Baha'is like you, sorry. What gets to me more are personal attacks. Even though I know what they are saying is not true, it hurts because it is just mean.

Well I've never resorted to personal attacks. I do believe everyone thinks they are right. Thing is people may not realize their own arrogance by officiating their perspective as the only way things could be.