Commitment to God

[Trailblazer]

Nobody else makes our decisions.

They do if you decide to let other sources make your decisions for you.

But we don't allow sources to make our decisions, we use our free will to decide.

No man is an island, everyone is influenced by what you call sources, it is just a matter of what sources they are influenced by.

 

[QuestioningMind]

I will still have to chose to do the right thing in every situations i experience but to i understand the consequence of it if I chose to follow my ego, and not listen to Allah. So to the best of my ability i chose to do it the way Allah teaches me to do it.

True, you have the choice of whether or not you do the 'right thing', but you've decided to let someone else decide for you what the 'right thing' is. And it seems to me that such thinking often leads to negative consequences.

 

[Spirit of Light]

True, you have the choice of whether or not you do the 'right thing', but you've decided to let someone else decide for you what the 'right thing' is. And it seems to me that such thinking often leads to negative consequences.

I can only speak from my own experience of what you said now
My experience is that when i did not have the faith in Islam and Allah, i experienced a lot more negativity in my life. Still there are aspect of it. But now i see the negativity as a sign that I have things i have to work on spirituality.

 

[QuestioningMind]

But we don't allow sources to make our decisions, we use our free will to decide.

No man is an island, everyone is influenced by what you call sources, it is just a matter of what sources they are influenced by.

There's a difference between using various sources to make a decision and deciding that you're going to rely on a single source to make decisions for you. I can seek out information on whether or not a food is healthy for me me from numerous different sources and decide for myself if I should or should not eat it. But if I decide not to eat a certain food simply because there's a book that tells me I'm not allowed to eat it, I've given up the right to make the decision about the food myself and instead have decided to let the book decide for me.

 

[QuestioningMind]

To a muslim, the "old books" are just as relevant today, as they were 1400 years ago

That's what scares me. People have been using these old books to justify immoral behavior for centuries.

 

[Spirit of Light]

That's what scares me. People have been using these old books to justify immoral behavior for centuries.

Umm religion teaches how to become morally good. The verses in the quran about war or jihad is not meant for killing others, it is meant to conquer once own ego, and have jihad with once self from within. Unfortunatly that teaching has been forgotten by so many muslims

 

[QuestioningMind]

Umm religion teaches how to become morally good. The verses in the quran about war or jihad is not meant for killing others, it is meant to conquer once own ego, and have jihad with once self from within. Unfortunatly that teaching has been forgotten by so many muslims

That's because they still consider those old books to be relevant and rely on them to determine what's morally good instead of using basic empathy to decide for themselves what's right and what's wrong. If people would stop looking to old books for moral guidance and instead start relying on their ability to empathize to determine what's morally good, the world would be much better off.

 

[Spirit of Light]

That's because they still consider those old books to be relevant and rely on them to determine what's morally good instead of using basic empathy to decide for themselves what's right and what's wrong. If people would stop looking to old books for moral guidance and instead start relying on their ability to empathize to determine what's morally good, the world would be much better off.

I can not speak for you, but the old books (quran) is the best book i ever read. And the guidance it give me changed my life to something very good.
I would personally not live a life without religion or spiritual teaching.

 

[QuestioningMind]

I can not speak for you, but the old books (quran) is the best book i ever read. And the guidance it give me changed my life to something very good.
I would personally not live a life without religion or spiritual teaching.

I too have read many books whose guidance has changed my like for the good. But I think it's very dangerous to accept any book as being the authority on morality to the point where I would ignore what my own internal morality proclaims in favor of what's in the book. I've seen far too many instances where otherwise decent people argue that something blatantly immoral is acceptable, just because their holy book says so.

 

[Trailblazer]

True, you have the choice of whether or not you do the 'right thing', but you've decided to let someone else decide for you what the 'right thing' is. And it seems to me that such thinking often leads to negative consequences.

What would be the 'negative consequences' of following the teachings of a Messenger of God as opposed to following one's self?

 

[Trailblazer]

I too have read many books whose guidance has changed my like for the good. But I think it's very dangerous to accept any book as being the authority on morality to the point where I would ignore what my own internal morality proclaims in favor of what's in the book. I've seen far too many instances where otherwise decent people argue that something blatantly immoral is acceptable, just because their holy book says so.

It seems to me that one has to ask who sets the standards for morality, God or man.

However, the problem with most holy books is that they are not the direct Word of God, they are written by men who claim to speak for God. Another problem is that the Laws of most holy book's were written to apply to past ages, not the present age, so how can we know what God's standards of morality are for this age? Are we going to put homosexuals and adulterers to death because of the Laws in the OT? Was that ever moral? Are those Laws even God's Laws, or are they the words of men?

 

[Trailblazer]

There's a difference between using various sources to make a decision and deciding that you're going to rely on a single source to make decisions for you. I can seek out information on whether or not a food is healthy for me me from numerous different sources and decide for myself if I should or should not eat it. But if I decide not to eat a certain food simply because there's a book that tells me I'm not allowed to eat it, I've given up the right to make the decision about the food myself and instead have decided to let the book decide for me.

I am not suggesting we make all our choices based upon one source. However, some sources are more reliable and trustworthy than others. If we believe in God we believe that God is the ultimate source of truth, but whether we believe in God or not, we need to follow our own conscience and make our own decisions.

 

[Spirit of Light]

I too have read many books whose guidance has changed my like for the good. But I think it's very dangerous to accept any book as being the authority on morality to the point where I would ignore what my own internal morality proclaims in favor of what's in the book. I've seen far too many instances where otherwise decent people argue that something blatantly immoral is acceptable, just because their holy book says so.

The quran making my own moral judgment stronger, not weaker

 

[ajay0]

To commit once life to God (for believers) take a lot of effort, to come to a point where you say, "Ok God" i give my life in service to you. From today, what ever happens i lay my full faith in you.

But it does not end there, that is only the beginning. From that day, you know life will change, if you do those changes in your life, soul searching to empty your mind of bad habbits and to serve God in a righterous way. It is truly difficult to stay focused and ready when life get hard or difficult.

Why is it so hard? Because your ego tells you about all the fun things, the food you can not eat, the partys you can not go to.
Or that if you just relax a little it is ok.

Commitment to God is truly difficult, but the reward is amazing, if one make it.

Any thoughts?

This is an insightful thread. Commitment to God and the spiritual life brings with it its sacrifices. But it brings a greater reward with it in the form of bliss and peace that is priceless.

Quality has a price to be paid for it, but it is worth it.

This also greatly boosts our self-esteem.

As Dadi Janki of the Prajapita Brahmakumaris states, "Self respect is not a matter of what you are doing in your life, but rather of how you are doing it. It requires that you bring quality and virtue into each action, whatever that action maybe."

 

[QuestioningMind]

What would be the 'negative consequences' of following the teachings of a Messenger of God as opposed to following one's self?

Let's see... I suppose it's possible that a person might become convinced that a Messenger of God is telling them that God wants them to do something awful like fly an airplane into a building filled with innocent people. Oh wait, it's not just possible someone might, someone actually did back on 9/11. In fact I doubt there has been a single suicide bomber who wasn't convinced that a Messenger of God told them that God wanted them to kill themselves and others in His name.

Surely you see those as 'negative consequences', right?

 

[Spirit of Light]

Let's see... I suppose it's possible that a person might become convinced that a Messenger of God is telling them that God wants them to do something awful like fly an airplane into a building filled with innocent people. Oh wait, it's not just possible someone might, someone actually did back on 9/11. In fact I doubt there has been a single suicide bomber who wasn't convinced that a Messenger of God told them that God wanted them to kill themselves and others in His name.

Surely you see those as 'negative consequences', right?

So you believe i will become a terrorist just because i am a muslim?

 

[QuestioningMind]

It seems to me that one has to ask who sets the standards for morality, God or man.

However, the problem with most holy books is that they are not the direct Word of God, they are written by men who claim to speak for God. Another problem is that the Laws of most holy book's were written to apply to past ages, not the present age, so how can we know what God's standards of morality are for this age? Are we going to put homosexuals and adulterers to death because of the Laws in the OT? Was that ever moral? Are those Laws even God's Laws, or are they the words of men?

It seems to me that one has to ask who sets the standards for morality, God or man.

All of the evidence suggests that man is the only one who sets moral standards all while claiming to be following what some supposed Messenger of God who told them was moral.

However, the problem with most holy books is that they are not the direct Word of God, they are written by men who claim to speak for God.

I guess that's the problem with assuming that there are Messengers who speak for God, you end up with an endless number of supposed 'holy books'.

Another problem is that the Laws of most holy book's were written to apply to past ages, not the present age, so how can we know what God's standards of morality are for this age?

Yet some of those holy books claim that God's standards for morality are unchangeable.

Are we going to put homosexuals and adulterers to death because of the Laws in the OT?

According to those who say the a Messenger of God states that God's morals are unchangeable and apply just as much today as they did in the past, yes they should. There are nations that do that all the time.

Was that ever moral? Are those Laws even God's Laws, or are they the words of men?

I've yet to see any evidence that there even is a God let alone God's Law. All holy books are the product of men and contain the words of men.

 

[QuestioningMind]

I am not suggesting we make all our choices based upon one source. However, some sources are more reliable and trustworthy than others. If we believe in God we believe that God is the ultimate source of truth, but whether we believe in God or not, we need to follow our own conscience and make our own decisions.

Perhaps there is a god and perhaps that god is the source of truth. But until this god comes down and personally clarifies what the 'truth' is, all we have is our own sense of empathy to decide what's right and what's wrong. The Messenger of God method clearly didn't work, since there are plenty of people who follow religions that claim their holy book is the ONLY source for making choices.

 

[QuestioningMind]

The quran making my own moral judgment stronger, not weaker

I sincerely hope that it does. Yet I know there are plenty of people who use the Quran to justify killing people who dare to draw a picture of the prophet. Are you among that group? If not, how did people who do think the Quran does find such killings to be justifiable reach such a conclusion?

 

[QuestioningMind]

So you believe i will become a terrorist just because i am a muslim?

When did I ever make such a claim? I clearly stated that I sincerely hope that following the Quran does make your moral judgement stronger. I was answering the question: What would be the 'negative consequences' of following the teachings of a Messenger of God as opposed to following one's self? that was asked by someone else.

Why would you assume I was talking about you?