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comments on the Qur'an whether good or bad

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
Yes I am putting how comparing how the god of the bible deals with the people and how the god of the Qur'an deals with the people.
The bibles god(not all denominations have the same beliefs)
But I can show you my beliefs with the bible.
1. He created everything good.
2. He created humans perfect
3. He originally planned a paradise for us
4. Our God does not test us with evil
5. Gehenna is figurative, if we do not make it we will not be tortured eternally. We will be asleep (so to speak) forever.
6. His plan makes perfect sense in the 1000 year reign.

The Qur'an makes or maybe it's the people making him sound like a tyrant.

Please quote from Jesus from Bible giving answers to your questions and reasons, please don't guess anything and don't put words into the mouth of your god-Jesus which he did not say. Since, as I understand, you are asking from a Christian standpoint, so it would be appropriate if you remain restricted to NT Gospels. Please
Regards
 

anonymous9887

bible reader
You are right. No one should isolate scripture. But the bible has at least 40 authors. Depends on which bible, and how deep you dig into. Each author is different. Has a different theology. So, what are you supposed to do? If you take the whole bible as one scripture, alright, how about the completely contrasting teachings then?

Let me ask you again, if we all inherited original sin, till Jesus redeemed us, why did God discriminate human beings with defects?
1. 1st we must understand that they were still part of the people and still could have salvation and a resurrection.
2. They couldn't serve in the temple because they law is a shadow of things to come. This representing those that are spiritually crippled cannot approach Jehovah, but the spiritually crippled is because they choose to harden their hearts.
3. Before jumping to conclusions we have to see how Jehovah actually dealt with the crippled. David was sitting on Jehovah's throne as his representation and yet he had a crippled sitting at his table. 2 Samuel 9:13.
 

anonymous9887

bible reader
Please quote from Jesus from Bible giving answers to your questions and reasons, please don't guess anything and don't put words into the mouth of your god-Jesus which he did not say. Since, as I understand, you are asking from a Christian standpoint, so it would be appropriate if you remain restricted to NT Gospels. Please
Regards
Jesus is not my god. Jehovah is.
 

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
[QUOTE="firedragon, post: 4742351, member: 45358"] This is your idea, its not the biblical narrative. You say Bibles God and talk of beliefs of denominations. If the bible is a book, one book, who cares about beliefs? You should be able to quote the bible and show what it says, not personal belief.[/QUOTE]

You are right, it is like spoon feeding the Christian-god-Jesus.
Regards
 

anonymous9887

bible reader
If I may, Ill show you the difference between the portrayal of God in the OT vs the Quran.

Old Testament.

Read Numbers chapter 31.


The LORD said to Moses, “Take vengeance on the Midianites for the Israelites.After that, you will be gathered to your people.” So Moses said to the people, “Arm some of your men to go to war against the Midianites so that they may carry out the LORD’s vengeance on them.

Send into battle a thousand men from each of the tribes of Israel.”So twelve thousand men armed for battle, a thousand from each tribe, were supplied from the clans of Israel. Moses sent them into battle, a thousand from each tribe, along with Phinehas son of Eleazar, the priest, who took with him articles from the sanctuary and the trumpets for signaling.

They fought against Midian, as the LORD commanded Moses, and killed every man. Among their victims were Evi, Rekem, Zur, Hur and Reba—the five kings of Midian. They also killed Balaam son of Beor with the sword. The Israelites captured the Midianite women and children and took all the Midianite herds, flocks and goods as plunder. They burned all the towns where the Midianites had settled, as well as all their camps. They took all the plunder and spoils, including the people and animals, and brought the captives, spoils and plunder to Moses and Eleazar the priest and the Israelite assembly at their camp on the plains of Moab, by the Jordan across from Jericho.

Moses, Eleazar the priest and all the leaders of the community went to meet them outside the camp. Moses was angry with the officers of the army—the commanders of thousands and commanders of hundreds—who returned from the battle. “Have you allowed all the women to live?” he asked them. “They were the ones who followed Balaam’s advice and enticed the Israelites to be unfaithful to the LORD in the Peor incident, so that a plague struck the LORD’s people. Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.


Vengeance. Plunder. Total annihilation. Murder of all married women and non virgins, save the virgins only. All the boys should be killed. Wonder why the virgins are saved!

Quran.

War is only allowed if you are not the aggressor. You are supposed fight for those who are oppressed. Or those who break a treaty etc. You have to have just cause. Even then when your enemy ceases their oppression, you are to stop and be merciful. You are allowed to fight only until there is no more persecution.



And fight in the cause of God against those who fight you, but do not aggress, God does not love the aggressors. And kill them wherever you encounter them, and expel them from where they expelled you, and know that persecution is worse than being killed. And do not fight them at the Restricted Temple unless they fight you in it; if they fight you then kill them, thus is the recompense of the rejecters. And if they cease, then God is Forgiving, Merciful. And fight them so there is no more persecution, and so that the system is for God. If they cease, then there will be no aggression except against the wicked. -Quran 2:190-193

You can see that the Quran does not tell you to be the victim but it establishes that you must not be the aggressor. You are allowed to fight back if someone aggressively fights with you. But even then, you are asked to forgive and cease fighting if the enemy seizes his fight. You are allowed to fight only until the persecution stops.

You must fight if someone is weak, being persecuted and are oppressed.

And why do you not fight in the cause of God, when the weak among the men and women and children say: “Our Lord, bring us out of this town whose people are wicked, and grant us from yourself a Supporter, and grant us from yourself a Victor!” - Quran 4:75

One example.
1. The problem is how much did they know about Jehovah.
2. The bible says the nation's feared them because of Jehovah, and yet they would not submit and stubbornly refuse to submit even after what had been done to egypt. Of course there is a lot more to say, but this is it in a nutshell.
 

anonymous9887

bible reader
[QUOTE="firedragon, post: 4742351, member: 45358"] This is your idea, its not the biblical narrative. You say Bibles God and talk of beliefs of denominations. If the bible is a book, one book, who cares about beliefs? You should be able to quote the bible and show what it says, not personal belief.

You are right, it is like spoon feeding the Christian-god-Jesus.
Regards[/QUOTE]
Your entitled to your opinion, but again the bible doesn't teach jesus is almighty god.
 

anonymous9887

bible reader
[QUOTE="firedragon, post: 4742351, member: 45358"] This is your idea, its not the biblical narrative. You say Bibles God and talk of beliefs of denominations. If the bible is a book, one book, who cares about beliefs? You should be able to quote the bible and show what it says, not personal belief.

You are right, it is like spoon feeding the Christian-god-Jesus.
Regards[/QUOTE]
I've quoted passages, your just not reading the entire thread, this must be your problem with literature, you read what you want.
 

anonymous9887

bible reader
The Christian say they have got a new Law, so they should quote from NT Gospels only, the Jews could quote from the OT Bible only.
Regards
It doesn't work that way. Jesus quoted fulfilled OT passages and some still need to be fulfilled. Plus that's history. So I can quote it as fact.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
1. 1st we must understand that they were still part of the people and still could have salvation and a resurrection.
2. They couldn't serve in the temple because they law is a shadow of things to come. This representing those that are spiritually crippled cannot approach Jehovah, but the spiritually crippled is because they choose to harden their hearts.
3. Before jumping to conclusions we have to see how Jehovah actually dealt with the crippled. David was sitting on Jehovah's throne as his representation and yet he had a crippled sitting at his table. 2 Samuel 9:13.

Spiritually crippled? That is such a statement, a hypocritical one that I feel a bit disgusted now.

or who is a hunchback or a dwarf, or who has any eye defect, or who has festering or running sores or damaged testicles.

Does damaged testicles and hunchback seem like spiritually crippled.
 

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
It doesn't work that way. Jesus quoted fulfilled OT passages and some still need to be fulfilled. Plus that's history. So I can quote it as fact.
That is not correct, if one is on the old covenant only then one can or reject the new covenant. You cannot have both of them.
Where is Jehovah mentioned by Jesus. The Christian-Jesus had got nothing to do with Jehovah.
Regards
 

anonymous9887

bible reader
Spiritually crippled? That is such a statement, a hypocritical one that I feel a bit disgusted now.

or who is a hunchback or a dwarf, or who has any eye defect, or who has festering or running sores or damaged testicles.

Does damaged testicles and hunchback seem like spiritually crippled.
1 of 2 things
1. Either we crippled because of sin
Or
2. Your god cripples us intentionally to test us

These are the only possible options. Take your pick.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
1 of 2 things
1. Either we crippled because of sin
Or
2. Your god cripples us intentionally to test us

These are the only possible options. Take your pick.

Hunchback crippled because of sin? God cripples us intentionally to test us, then discriminates against cripples, hunchbacks and those with damaged testicles.

Lol, please let me have some pun, I would have instead said to take a prick.
 

Pastek

Sunni muslim
So god put them in the garden and he wanted them to fill the earth and expand the paradise genesis 1:28
That was his original purpose

Look what he says for the future
Psalm 37:10,11, and 29 they will posses the land forever
Jesus= matthew 5:5 the meek shall inherit the earth.

We have this verse too about the hereafter

21.105 We have written in the Psalms, after the Reminder, that the earth will be inherited by My righteous servants.
 

anonymous9887

bible reader
Hunchback crippled because of sin? God cripples us intentionally to test us, then discriminates against cripples, hunchbacks and those with damaged testicles.

Lol, please let me have some pun, I would have instead said to take a prick.
Option 1 is the god of the bible.

Your god cripples us to test us, otherwise why would he do it? Answer that please.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
Option 1 is the god of the bible.

Your god cripples us to test us, otherwise why would he do it? Answer that please.

Mate, it is you who claim that God crippled us to test us or whatever. And you cant answer why God would discriminate poor crippled individuals. The guy gets his testicles smashed and he cant even find solace in the church.

If there is no answer that's fine, but humbly I tell you, that you are circumventing.

That's fine.

You say my God cripples us to test us. Let me tell you plainly, the answer is no. God does not cripple us.

Any good that befalls you is due to God, and any evil that befalls you is due to yourself. We have sent you as a messenger to the people and God is enough as a witness. - Quran 4:79

They say 1 out of 30 babies born in this world has a birth defect. In the U.S its 1 out of 33. During a woman's pregnancy, taking folic acid and getting enough iodine in the food can help prevent some types of birth defects. But it's also important to realize that most babies born with birth defects are born to two healthy parents with no obvious health problems or risk factors. In most cases, doctors don't know what caused a baby's birth defect. When the cause is known, it might be environmental (such as a baby's exposure to chemicals or viruses while in the womb), a problem with the fetus' genes, or a combination of these things. There are many genetic causes too. Doctors don't know what causes most disabilities, and certainly God doesn't cause it.

But the fact in the Quran is that all are equal in salvation. Just because you are crippled, that does not have any weight in your salvation.

Nevertheless, your question would be "Why does God allow it"? The counter question would be, should God disallow it. This is why I explained about God in a long post. This requires a full exegesis. A whole book. The day I am done, Ill send you a copy. ;)
 

Jabar

“Strive always to excel in virtue and truth.”
Oh so for no reason a crippled is born. Ok god created us perfect, and we are capable of being perfect yet we could be born crippled.
Makes a lot of sense.
Some people are tested differently.

God never created us to be perfect, we repent and learn from our sins.

Makes much sense actually.

:)
 
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