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Climate Change Hypocrisy

Kooky

Freedom from Sanity
They don't do it. Why should I?
Good point, and I don't even mean it sarcastically.

You'll likely be dead before people here will be hit by the worst outcomes of the climate crisis.
If you don't care about your fellow human beings and are convinced of your own FYGM philosophy, then you're correct, there really is no incentive for you to actually do anything substantial to reduce your carbon footprint or in any other way help sustain a livable environment for future generations.

This is the fundamental problem, because the US is populated by a hundred million people who adhere to the same philosophy as you do, and there is no amount of convincing them to make life less convenient for them since they don't believe in solidarity, empathy, or even basic decency towards other human beings of the incorrect place of birth.
 

InChrist

Free4ever
I believe the message of the OP, and the reason for posting it comes off like this: "Hah, they say we should make all these sacrifices to stop climate change, and their actions show that they don't even believe in it themselves! So why should we? Quit eating meat, hah! Until they show me that they care, I'm not going to believe them."

That is why people usually post gnat-straining articles like this. That is the message it conveys. Where are all your other posts about why we as stewards of the earth should care about global warming? I'm not recalling any like that. I seem to only see "why should we believe them about all this" type posts. To me, that just encourages people to disregard the facts and act contrary to the common good.
Well, I think it is prudent to observe the actions of those who are trying to impose rules upon others. If they are not following their own rules, as they expect others to, then there is reason to pay attention and question.
It may be those in power don’t care about the common good at all, only their own good.
I remember in the 70’s we were warned an ice age was eminent if we didn’t give our tax dollars to address the problem. In the 80s, it was doom by the ozone hole and then destruction by acid rain if we didn’t give more money and make changes. After that, it was global warming. Now it is climate change. I certainly do not deny climate change.
Can you tell me, based on any evidence, what the ideal temperature or climate should be for the earth?
 

sayak83

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
Well, I think it is prudent to observe the actions of those who are trying to impose rules upon others. If they are not following their own rules, as they expect others to, then there is reason to pay attention and question.
It may be those in power don’t care about the common good at all, only their own good.
I remember in the 70’s we were warned an ice age was eminent if we didn’t give our tax dollars to address the problem. In the 80s, it was doom by the ozone hole and then destruction by acid rain if we didn’t give more money and make changes. After that, it was global warming. Now it is climate change. I certainly do not deny climate change.
Can you tell me, based on any evidence, what the ideal temperature or climate should be for the earth?
14 degree C
It's currently 15.2 C and is going to increase to around 19-20 C by the end of the century if we do nothing.
 

InChrist

Free4ever
14 degree C
It's currently 15.2 C and is going to increase to around 19-20 C by the end of the century if we do nothing.
So how has it been concluded that 14 degrees C is the ideal? And is that the ideal for every area of the earth?
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
How about the government advocating for more local food production and manufacturing, so as to reduce transportation emissions? But no, the government in into global corporatism.
That might help a little, but not that much. I do not think that such an action would make much of a difference. And there are many places where it is not possible. Areas of high population density will always need food shipped in.
 

sayak83

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
So how has it been concluded that 14 degrees C is the ideal? And is that the ideal for every area of the earth?
It's the average global temperature for the past 20000 years, and it's the ideal average for human civilization and agriculture.
It's the average over the entire earth. If the average increases, the temperature everywhere increases (to diffeing extent, we know how much in each region) and it's bad for every where and everyone.
In tropics you will see famines and massive heat deaths, in the subtropics intense storms and flooding, in the Arctic catastrophic melting of the permafrost.
 

Windwalker

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Well, I think it is prudent to observe the actions of those who are trying to impose rules upon others.
If they are not following their own rules, as they expect others to, then there is reason to pay attention and question.
It is then as it appears to be. You are saying to everyone, why should we listen to them if these leaders are hypocrites? You are casting doubts upon the severity of the issues before us, because politicians are hypocrites. But it's not the politicians sounding the alarms, it's all the world's experts. They are not the politicians. The politicians are generally late to the party. The specialists are the ones that should be listened to.

You listen when a meteorologist tells you a tornado is likely and take appropriate action, don't you? If you saw the mayor run out into the field seeming to not understand the warning himself, do you then head out to the beach for the afternoon because he doesn't take it seriously himself? Isn't this the blind leading the blind?

It may be those in power don’t care about the common good at all, only their own good.
I remember in the 70’s we were warned an ice age was eminent if we didn’t give our tax dollars to address the problem. In the 80s, it was doom by the ozone hole and then destruction by acid rain if we didn’t give more money and make changes. After that, it was global warming. Now it is climate change. I certainly do not deny climate change.
What I hear in this is, 'why should I believe this, because they've said all sorts of things in the past, and we're all still fine today.' This is a form of denial. In reality all of these things were valid concerns, which have only all grown in intensity. Yet, people didn't want to believe it then, and not now. "Crisis, what crisis?", is the attitude of the careless.

This current climate change is due to global warming caused by unchecked human activity, driving by greed and a lust for money. In reality, we aren't be asked to give money to fix these things. We're being asked to shift where we spend our monies away from fossil fuels to safer and more renewable forms of energies which don't destroy this earth. But the fossil fuel industry pays lots of money to not have their piece of the money pie go to other forms of energy. They want to keep things the way they are, with zero regard to the planet, our health, and the future generations of our children's children. As a Christian, you should be offended by this as an act against God, like crucifying the Christ. It is an act against Life itself.

Can you tell me, based on any evidence, what the ideal temperature or climate should be for the earth?
What is was before we started filling the skies with greenhouse gasses. That's the equilibrium the planet had formed that allowed the world we have had for the past 15,000 some years now. The evidence this was ideal is the fact we were able to survive and thrive as we have since the last ice age. That is now changing, rapidly. And most people are still in denial, thinking it's not real. It is real. We are being faced with an immanent terminal diagnosis, and no one is taking it seriously. We are all complicit in this if we don't speak out against what we are doing.

BTW, it's understandable people are in denial of a serious potential terminal illness. But fear often just helps accelate us to the end, because we fail to act and prevent it becoming worse. We hasten our own demise through denialism.
 
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InChrist

Free4ever
Yes, hypocrisy is bad. Humans often fail to live up to their own ideals. No argument there.

Do you believe we need to reduce our GHG emissions? Should we be transitioning to renewable energy instead of fossil fuels?
Sure, as long as the transition is done wisely with consideration of the various consequences, such as what is to be done with all the giant wind-power blades when they wear out? Or what about all the birds killed by those blades? Or what should be done for back-up power when the blades freeze as happened in Texas? I wonder about the lithium needed for electric vehicle batteries. Will mining the needed lithium ravage third world countries and their environments?
Then there’s China which has emissions which exceed all the developed nations combined. Why are US companies doing so much manufacturing over there, using cheap and in some cases ill-treated laborers, and then transporting goods over here?
 

Kooky

Freedom from Sanity
Well, I think it is prudent to observe the actions of those who are trying to impose rules upon others. If they are not following their own rules, as they expect others to, then there is reason to pay attention and question.
It may be those in power don’t care about the common good at all, only their own good.
So you have no intention of voluntarily following those rules, regardless of what those in power do, do I have that correct?
 

Left Coast

This Is Water
Staff member
Premium Member
Sure, as long as the transition is done wisely with consideration of the various consequences, such as what is to be done with all the giant wind-power blades when they wear out?

I assume the same thing that is done with any metallic or plastic part on a machine when it wears out. Is there a reason wind turbine blades in particular, of all the thousands such things already in existence, concern you?

Or what about all the birds killed by those blades? Or what should be done for back-up power when the blades freeze as happened in Texas?

Trump Again Overblows Risks of Wind Power - FactCheck.org

I wonder about the lithium needed for electric vehicle batteries. Will mining the needed lithium ravage third world countries and their environments?

I do hope we either start mining lithium domestically or pay people in developing countries more for this labor, as it is definitely a concern.

Then there’s China which has emissions which exceed all the developed nations combined. Why are US companies doing so much manufacturing over there, using cheap and in some cases ill-treated laborers, and then transporting goods over here?

You answered your own question there - we do it because it makes things cheap. The next time you shop at Walmart or a similar store, importing of goods from developing countries with lower labor standards is one of the main reasons the things there are so cheap. There aren't easy answers to that issue.

But that's a problem that extends beyond this conversation about climate change and has more to do with trade policy. My question to you was to establish that yoy agree that conversion of our energy system to renewables should be a priority. Sounds like you agree, which I'm glad about. If we agree on that goal, particular roadblocks should not be insurmountable hindrances.
 

InChrist

Free4ever
Which meat-eating members of this elite told us to eat bugs at COP26? I seem to have missed it somehow?
Whether it was said by one of the members present; I don’t know. Nevertheless, in a report commissioned by the U.N. on climate change and land by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), was stated...

“Meat analogues such as imitation meat (from plant products), cultured meat, and insects may help in the transition to more healthy and sustainable diets, although their carbon footprints and acceptability are uncertain.”

https://www.ipcc.ch/srccl/chapter/chapter-5/

So it would seem those at the climate conference who are concerned would be aware and do their part to consume a climate saving diet. Instead, approximately 60% of the menu consisted of meat and dairy.
 

InChrist

Free4ever
I assume the same thing that is done with any metallic or plastic part on a machine when it wears out. Is there a reason wind turbine blades in particular, of all the thousands such things already in existence, concern you?



Trump Again Overblows Risks of Wind Power - FactCheck.org



I do hope we either start mining lithium domestically or pay people in developing countries more for this labor, as it is definitely a concern.



You answered your own question there - we do it because it makes things cheap. The next time you shop at Walmart or a similar store, importing of goods from developing countries with lower labor standards is one of the main reasons the things there are so cheap. There aren't easy answers to that issue.

But that's a problem that extends beyond this conversation about climate change and has more to do with trade policy. My question to you was to establish that yoy agree that conversion of our energy system to renewables should be a priority. Sounds like you agree, which I'm glad about. If we agree on that goal, particular roadblocks should not be insurmountable hindrances.
From this article below, it sounds like the blades are not easy to deal with, much less recycle.

Bloomberg - Are you a robot?



I try to do most shopping local, frequent thrift stores, and avoid products from China.
 
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Left Coast

This Is Water
Staff member
Premium Member
From this article below, it sounds like the blades are not easy to deal with, much less recycle.

Bloomberg - Are you a robot?

I try to do most shopping local, frequent thrift stores, and avoid products from China.

The story is behind a pay wall, sorry. Assuming there are difficulties recycling them right now - do you regard this problem as permanent and insurmountable, or temporary and solvable? (in terms of the larger goal of reducing GHGs/conversion of the energy sector)
 

InChrist

Free4ever
So you have no intention of voluntarily following those rules, regardless of what those in power do, do I have that correct?
Did I say anything about having no intention of following the rules? Or are you making assumptions as if you can read my thoughts?
The fact is I already recycle, buy local as much as I can, shop at thrift stores, buy organic food, grow a large garden, don’t support corporate agri-business and limit driving to town.
 

Secret Chief

nirvana is samsara
Whether it was said by one of the members present; I don’t know. Nevertheless, in a report commissioned by the U.N. on climate change and land by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), was stated...

“Meat analogues such as imitation meat (from plant products), cultured meat, and insects may help in the transition to more healthy and sustainable diets, although their carbon footprints and acceptability are uncertain.”

https://www.ipcc.ch/srccl/chapter/chapter-5/

So it would seem those at the climate conference who are concerned would be aware and do their part to consume a climate saving diet. Instead, approximately 60% of the menu consisted of meat and dairy.

So you got to the current COP26 conference headline
"Globalists Enjoy Meat While Telling You to Eat Bugs" for your OP from a pre-existing IPCC report that said "Meat analogues such as imitation meat (from plant products), cultured meat, and insects may help in the transition to more healthy and sustainable diets" Correct?
 

InChrist

Free4ever
The story is behind a pay wall, sorry. Assuming there are difficulties recycling them right now - do you regard this problem as permanent and insurmountable, or temporary and solvable? (in terms of the larger goal of reducing GHGs/conversion of the energy sector)
I don’t understand why the Bloomberg article is behind a paywall, as it wasn’t when I read it. Here is another with the same information.
Wind turbine blades can’t be recycled, so they’re piling up in landfills


Possibly the issue of dealing with wind turbine blades can be overcome. I ‘m just pointing out that alternative energy can also have negative consequences that must be considered and addressed.
 

InChrist

Free4ever
So you got to the current COP26 conference headline
"Globalists Enjoy Meat While Telling You to Eat Bugs" for your OP from a pre-existing IPCC report that said "Meat analogues such as imitation meat (from plant products), cultured meat, and insects may help in the transition to more healthy and sustainable diets" Correct?
I did not get the headline. My OP was titled “ Climate Change Hypocrisy “ . The U.N commissioned report shows their stance on how diet can impact the climate, while the linked video demonstrates the attitude of hypocrisy so many who claim to be concerned about the issue of climate actually live by.
 
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