1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Climate Change Debate (Invitation Only)

Discussion in 'Invitation Only Debates' started by Laika, Nov 26, 2016.

  1. Laika

    Laika Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2015
    Messages:
    8,255
    Ratings:
    +8,917
    I've voted Green in the past and considered joining them (but felt I was too left wing for them). Do you think its worth it?
     
  2. Iti oj

    Iti oj Global warming is real and we need to act
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2011
    Messages:
    13,689
    Ratings:
    +2,570
    Religion:
    RF cult leader & taosit black magician
    Since you mentioned writing the white house what about visiting your local American embassy ?

    I'm also in the green party and I'm trying to start a local chapter in my county
     
    • Like Like x 1
  3. Kirran

    Kirran
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2015
    Messages:
    10,694
    Ratings:
    +6,396
    Hmmm. What do you wanna get out of it?

    Apparently the main wings are environmentalist liberals and environmentalist old-school-Labour-style socialists, then you've got an anarchist undercurrent somewhere. But I haven't encountered it.

    Hmm, I could visit. Tell them to get their act together. Get thrown out.

    Oh yeah? I don't know how similar our respective Green parties are - probably quite similar, actually.
     
  4. YmirGF

    YmirGF Bodhisattva

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2005
    Messages:
    29,081
    Ratings:
    +14,883
    Religion:
    Beyond the Light
    I could never bring myself to vote for a Green Party candidate. Their economics is generally ludicrous, has no real support or power base. Big labor and big business are also generally not fans. Without either of those two behind you... a candidate and party is doomed. So, no, I don't see it as worthwhile.

    From what I have read thus far, I'm inclined to label the affable @Iti oj as a bit of an idealistic extremist. The shotgun approach simply will not work. There is too much to be done and too much to be changed. A large scale attack on several fronts will alienate far more than it will convince which could end up in setting things in a backwards tailspin. In Maoist terms this is a "long march", taking one hill at a time. Baby steps... baby steps...
     
  5. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Abnormal before it was fashionable
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    195,471
    Ratings:
    +70,315
    Religion:
    Atheist
    When many things are uncertain, focus upon what can be done with
    certain positive effects, eg, conservation, urban planning for efficiency.
    It won't solve all problems, but it addresses GW with independent value.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  6. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Rival's Wife

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2005
    Messages:
    78,941
    Ratings:
    +33,087
    Religion:
    God is in the Rain
    I only hope we have enough time for a long march and baby steps.
     
  7. YmirGF

    YmirGF Bodhisattva

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2005
    Messages:
    29,081
    Ratings:
    +14,883
    Religion:
    Beyond the Light
    Short of world wide revolution, we do not have a choice as the "environmental movement" does not have a Gandhi or a Lenin to take us the way forward...
     
  8. Eliab ben Benjamin

    Eliab ben Benjamin Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2014
    Messages:
    1,000
    Ratings:
    +706
    Religion:
    Jewish
    We needs first to encourage organic farming,
    with companion crops to control weeds, and insect attack ... natural compost fertilizer,

    This is simple once first learned, and can be done for window box, home vege garden and commercial venture ..

    Then later perhaps, a few chicken or ducks..
    for eggs.. free range required..
     
    • Like Like x 2
  9. Laika

    Laika Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2015
    Messages:
    8,255
    Ratings:
    +8,917
    Why wait for a leader when you can be one and look amazingly cool for it? :D

    [​IMG]
     
    • Winner Winner x 1
  10. Kirran

    Kirran
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2015
    Messages:
    10,694
    Ratings:
    +6,396
    While it would reduce the burden if it took over globally, and so be of benefit, it wouldn't do much in the face of ongoing pollution, GHG emission and deforestation.

    There are some major industrial-level industries that we've gotta stop, and some major (bio) remediation we've gotta get stuck into, for other efforts to have been worth their while.
     
  11. Kirran

    Kirran
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2015
    Messages:
    10,694
    Ratings:
    +6,396
    I did lean Labour-wards a lot shortly after joining the Greens and strongly considered jumping ship. Labour at least has a history of deep involvement and a basis in the working class, it has union backing and it's got a strong syndicalist tradition.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  12. YmirGF

    YmirGF Bodhisattva

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2005
    Messages:
    29,081
    Ratings:
    +14,883
    Religion:
    Beyond the Light
    I currently have 12 10' x 4' raised beds designed for organic gardening. The downside to this is that it is a lot of work, fine if you have the time, but well beyond the time constraints of the average person, ditto for those who have no interest in gardening. I do not deny that it is a great idea for people to grow their own produce but it isn't like everyone is going to put down their smart phone, tear up the lawn and begin gardening. I would think this is especially true in urban environments.

    The local small city I live a 1/2 hour away from developed a modest community garden and oddly a lot of things were grown in barrels. What was genuinely weird is that this garden was placed directly beside a main highway, so all the produce was exposed to a continuous luxurious bath of carbon monoxide and other delectable treats from the endless stream of passing cars. (Filed under: Things that make you shake your head in disbelief.)
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  13. Quetzal

    Quetzal A little to the left and slightly out of focus.
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    May 4, 2015
    Messages:
    9,947
    Ratings:
    +8,339
    We are in a bit of uncharted territory so that entire idea of the unknown comes to mind. Extreme weather is a big concern of mine. What this does is it puts developing nations at a severe and dangerous disadvantage. They do not have the infrastructure to deal with this problems as they arise. This is anything from extreme flooding, drought, or unstable weather patterns. This can lead to water and food shortages as a result. These people will have to migrate somewhere. Unfortunately, if the current political climate stays remotely the same as it is now, this will create an entire array of problems. We have already seen what happens when refugees are met with nationalists, I am not optimistic.

    It is already occurring, the only question now is to what extent and for how long? I feel we have an opportunity to address that, but I fear our window is growing smaller.

    Public awareness and benefit. These two go hand-in-hand and are the key to helping limit the damage done. I would like to see 1-2% of the budget the US invests in military operations to be dedicated to tax breaks and discounts for solar energy and other renewable energy sources (electric cars, wind generators, etc.) I am aware we do this to an extent, but it needs more. The public need to want to do this. The best way to incentivize change is to reward those who are courageous enough to give it a shot. We then, of course, need to offer similar programs to industries willing to do the same.
     
    #73 Quetzal, Nov 28, 2016
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2016
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  14. Iti oj

    Iti oj Global warming is real and we need to act
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2011
    Messages:
    13,689
    Ratings:
    +2,570
    Religion:
    RF cult leader & taosit black magician
    I don't disagree but I'm not one to put my all my eggs in one basket. though idealistic I can think pragmatically and act as a realist. That's part of why I have brought up RepublicEn.org a few times on rf and fb . they bring great ideas, sollutions and information even if I think it's to little to late. I see multiple paths forward.

    I have to ask you though am I really idealistic and extreme or is the whole world lazy and apathetic ?


    And now you want an idealistic and extremist to lead. Well here I am. just don't be the Trotsky to my Lenin please
     
  15. MD

    MD qualiaphile

    Joined:
    May 5, 2012
    Messages:
    4,159
    Ratings:
    +1,742
    Religion:
    Zoroastrian
    I voted Green in the last election. They failed miserably and Trudeau won. I don't think the Left or the Right really gives a **** about the environment, I mean the Left tries to pay lip service to it but they don't really do anything.
     
  16. Quetzal

    Quetzal A little to the left and slightly out of focus.
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    May 4, 2015
    Messages:
    9,947
    Ratings:
    +8,339
    I think it is safe to say that political figures on both sides of the aisle are in the pockets of oil companies.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  17. Laika

    Laika Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2015
    Messages:
    8,255
    Ratings:
    +8,917
    Sadly, I agree. I wish I didn't. I think Quetzal got it right. Given the nature and urgency of the threat, the sort of action required on this issue isn't to be found in mainstream parties. Which is admittedly depressing.

    There was an article in the Guardian which made the case that the (UK) greens weren't radical enough to deal with climate change. It tipped me towards joining the Communist Party over them but their policies on climate change were "thin" beyond a sort of green populism (probably coming from its youth wing). Whats scary is the idea we'd need something even more radical and are unlikely to get it.
     
  18. Quetzal

    Quetzal A little to the left and slightly out of focus.
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    May 4, 2015
    Messages:
    9,947
    Ratings:
    +8,339
    It can happen, but it would take a dramatic shift in popular opinion. As long as the majority of the voting American population have a "meh" attitude about it instead of a progressive one, it is unlikely to change.
     
    • Optimistic Optimistic x 1
  19. MD

    MD qualiaphile

    Joined:
    May 5, 2012
    Messages:
    4,159
    Ratings:
    +1,742
    Religion:
    Zoroastrian
    I went to the mall today. I was bored out of my mind but I noticed people shopping non stop. There is an addiction to consumption in our society, which is being exported to the 3rd world.

    It took decades to reduce smoking rates, when the health risks were clear, and even still people smoke. It will take longer to even reduce rampant consumption of goods and services. To combat addictions is very hard, almost impossible.

    I think the prepper option is the best for the individual, some basic survival skills and a solid unit.
     
  20. MD

    MD qualiaphile

    Joined:
    May 5, 2012
    Messages:
    4,159
    Ratings:
    +1,742
    Religion:
    Zoroastrian
    One civil war in a small country like Syria caused a refugee crisis. Imagine a country like Pakistan with 200 million people, without water.

    Not pretty.
     
Loading...