Circumcision without consent. Is it wrong?

[Subduction Zone]

No it doesn't. See my above research link.

It is easy to make claims. Supporting them is another matter. Earlier I demonstrated that his claim that "women prefer uncircumcised penises was not true with a similar source. Perhaps that is just what his significant other is telling him. We men are rather sensitive about this issue.

 

[The Hammer]

It is easy to make claims. Supporting them is another matter. Earlier I demonstrated that his claim that "women prefer uncircumcised penises was not true with a similar source. Perhaps that is just what his significant other is telling him. We men are rather sensitive about this issue.

Certainly.

It's a tough and touchy subject, with a lot of moving levels of interpretation.

 

[The Hammer]

I didn't vote, fyi.

This thread needs an IDK option.

 

[Subduction Zone]

My point was about the difference in sensitivity. You have always felt what you have always felt and have nothing to compare it to. If your sense of smell was half as sensitive as mine, you would not be aware that you weren't smelling what I can smell. You would just think that you were smelling everything the same.

Well there is only one way to tell for sure. We cannot undo a circumcision. That means that we need a volunteer.

Anyone?

 

[The Hammer]

Well there is only one way to tell for sure. We cannot undo a circumcision. That means that we need a volunteer.

Anyone?

Been there done that. Gave my opinion a few posts back.

I was circumcised when I was 10.

 

[an anarchist]

I didn't vote, fyi.

This thread needs an IDK option.

Added

 

[Revoltingest]

I understand your point. Which is why I concluded there isn't a right answer IMO.

There is no "right" answer to FGM either, because
it would vary from culture to culture. However, in
the western context, both FGM & MGM strike me
as immoral because of the consent issue.

I understand Ameristans position. But it doesn't seem to gel with other avenues of medical autonomy or not. Autonomy changes based on the individual, government, and family units wishes. (Edited post)

Family & religious wishes have limits when imposed
upon others. Infants cannot give consent.

But anyone who argues for infant male circumcision
should allow FGM to a similar extent, which is a type
within the spectrum between the radical kind & the
mere ceremonial non-modifying "nick".
There again, this presumes equal treatment based
upon sex. (Not all cultures & religions believe in
equal treatment.)

 

[Subduction Zone]

Been there done that. Gave my opinion a few posts back.

I was circumcised when I was 10.

I am not sure if that counts. Were you sexually active at that age?

 

[metis]

My point was about the difference in sensitivity. You have always felt what you have always felt and have nothing to compare it to. If your sense of smell was half as sensitive as mine, you would not be aware that you weren't smelling what I can smell. You would just think that you were smelling everything the same.

So?

 

[viole]

I wouldn't compare it to FGM, as it doesn't prohibit sexual pleasure of the man, and isn't used as a method of control, imo.

So, do you think that any intervention on the physical integrity of children is allowed if that does not negatively affect normal physical functioning? What about permanently printing on their forehead “i belong to religion X”. Would you tolerate it?

ciao

- viole

 

[The Hammer]

I am not sure if that counts. Were you sexually active at that age?

Masturbating yes. Sex no. I've masturbated several times a week since I was like.... 5?

 

[KWED]

I have doubts about that claim. Have you seen female sex toys?

Not sure how that is relevant. Which sex toys are you referring to. The ones designed by women often don't look like a penis at all!

It may have more to do with the country of origin and the prevalence of circumcised versus non.

iirc, it was in the US and the participants had all had sex with both types. It was a while ago but I'll try and dig it up.

Edit: At least this one source says that you are terribly wrong. The magic words are "Sorry son, but I heard that it makes it taste better."

Sex and Male Circumcision: Women’s Preferences Across Different Cultures and Countries: A Systematic Review.

Ah, a common mistake. The survey was not about women's preferences in partner, aesthetics, etc. It was purely about the pleasure derived from penetrative intercourse. You are right that those preferences are very much based in tradition, custom, peer pressure, etc. Apparently in the US women's preference for a circumcised penis has been reducing as the rate of circumcision drops. Whereas a few decades ago an uncircumcised penis was an oddity, now it is much more common.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Masturbating yes. Sex no. I've masturbated several times a week since I was like.... 5?

Wow! It was much later for me.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Not sure how that is relevant. Which sex toys are you referring to. The ones designed by women often don't look like a penis at all!

Nor do they facilitate easy movement. They were designed for what you called pounding.

iirc, it was in the US and the participants had all had sex with both types. It was a while ago but I'll try and dig it up.

Ah, a common mistake. The survey was not about women's preferences in partner, aesthetics, etc. It was purely about the pleasure derived from penetrative intercourse. You are right that those preferences are very much based in tradition, custom, peer pressure, etc. Apparently in the US women's preference for a circumcised penis has been reducing as the rate of circumcision drops. Whereas a few decades ago an uncircumcised penis was an oddity, now it is much more common.

Okay, the survey I posted was about a whole range of factors. It appears women prefer a haircut.

 

[Secret Chief]

That is like female genital mutilation on little girls. So, obviously wrong, when performed on humans who cannot decide themselves. A form of baby’s sexual abuse.

ciao

- viole

This.

 

[Secret Chief]

It affected your height? Wow! That's a first.

I thought that too.

 

[Secret Chief]

So ladies, yay or nay on the question?

And some men

 

[fantome profane]

I voted that circumcision is wrong, but I want to explain a couple things.

First, male circumcision is not the same as female genital mutation. spoiler for the graphic description.

Spoiler

To understand imagine they didn’t just cut off the foreskin but hacked off the entire head of the penis, and maybe did it with a rusty piece of metal or a dirty piece of glass. Now imagine they stitched the remaining shaft to the scrotum. Sorry to be so disturbing, but that is what FGM is.

I don’t think male circumcision is the horrific crime that fgm is. Still I think it is unnecessary and should be discouraged.

I don’t think it should be banned, banning circumcision could cause more problems. It could just drive it underground, it could lead to religious oppression and other things.

But I still think it is wrong and shouldn’t be done.

 

[Subduction Zone]

This.

vs this:

" In the overwhelming majority of studies, women expressed a preference for the circumcised penis. The main reasons given for this preference were better appearance, better hygiene, reduced risk of infection, and enhanced sexual activity, including vaginal intercourse, manual stimulation, and fellatio. "

I can see a father talking to his young baby "Son, you may hate me now, but some day you will thank me."

 

[Secret Chief]

vs this:

" In the overwhelming majority of studies, women expressed a preference for the circumcised penis. The main reasons given for this preference were better appearance, better hygiene, reduced risk of infection, and enhanced sexual activity, including vaginal intercourse, manual stimulation, and fellatio. "

I can see a father talking to his young baby "Son, you may hate me now, but some day you will thank me."

I'm a lifelong underperformer
My objection is solely based on the consent issue.