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Featured Christians, which Old Testament Laws to obey, and which to ignore?

Discussion in 'Biblical Debates' started by oldbadger, Mar 18, 2017.

  1. oldbadger

    oldbadger Skanky Old Mongrel!

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    Christians, which Old Testament Laws to obey, and which to ignore?
    How were some O.T. laws dropped, and others kept?
    A few Christians can be self-righteously judgemental about the lives, feelings, cultures, sexualities and beliefs of others.
    Exactly what laws are within the New-Covenant, and which others 'repealed'?
     
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  2. Shiranui117

    Shiranui117 Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
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    Dietary and ritual cleanliness laws were basically all rendered optional by the Council of Jerusalem in Acts 15. And given that like 99% of the world's Christian population lives outside of Israel and were never members of the Hebrew tribes, those jurisdictional laws and governmental laws concerning Israel never applied to us Gentiles in the first place, because they were written for an ethnic group constructing a kingdom in a small parcel of land in the Levant 3000 years ago.
     
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  3. Kemosloby

    Kemosloby Well-Known Member
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    They weren't exactly repealed, they still exist but not as a written code. Keep what you think you should keep and practice what you preach.
     
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  4. Evangelicalhumanist

    Evangelicalhumanist "Truth" isn't a thing...

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    "Keep what you think you should keep?" Isn't that a bit like a buffet, where you pick the stuff you like and ignore the rest and everybody else does the same? How is that like "law," exactly?"
     
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  5. Kemosloby

    Kemosloby Well-Known Member
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    Well you have to be honest with yourself. You for instance don't believe you should pick the stuff you like, therefore you should keep the ones you don't like.

    Unwritten law, Not by written code but by the spirit.

    Romans 7:6 But now, by dying to what once bound us, we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code.
     
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  6. Evangelicalhumanist

    Evangelicalhumanist "Truth" isn't a thing...

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    It's my view that humans make many laws based upon what we know (and all too frequently on what we don't know, but imagine). If that's the case, then it has always seemed to me that law should be amenable to change as our knowledge changes -- and that includes, it HAS to include, religious law.

    When we were more ignorant and thought a man only had so much "seed," and repopulation was incredibly important in a violent and uncertain world, then Onan's "sin" is understandable. A little knowledge about that matter suggests that that minor pleasure is pretty inoffensive, and we've all gotten over it (or most of us have). In the same way, as we've learned that there are sexual orientations that are natural and not chosen, many nations who use information rather than dogma to frame their rules, are adjusting their laws appropriately.

    Religious dogma is incredibly unhelpful in pretty much every situation, in my view. Knowledge and reason work so much better. To bad that they're hard to come by...
     
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  7. Evangelicalhumanist

    Evangelicalhumanist "Truth" isn't a thing...

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    Nothing to do with what I "like," but what my reason and knowledge -- couple with my humanity -- make clear to me. I do not do what is hurtful to myself or others, and I do not object to what others do which is likewise not hurtful to themselves or others. In other words, I do not judge when I have no basis on which to judge.
     
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  8. Father Heathen

    Father Heathen uǝɥʇɐǝH ɹǝɥʇɐℲ

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    That's easy; ignore the ones that would impact or inconvenience you, and preach the ones that can be used to judge and condemn others.
     
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  9. Deeje

    Deeje Deeje

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    The ceremonial and sacrificial parts were dispensed with because Christ came to fulfill the law, not to destroy it. He said that the whole law was summed up in just two.....

    Matthew 22:35-40
    "And one of them, versed in the Law, tested him by asking: 36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?” 37 He said to him: “‘You must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind.’ 38 This is the greatest and first commandment. 39 The second, like it, is this: ‘You must love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 On these two commandments the whole Law hangs, and the Prophets."

    Jesus also reaffirmed God's standards for marriage and the moral consequences of sexual immorality. (Matthew 5:27-28; Matthew 19:3-9)
     
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  10. Goddess_Ashtara

    Goddess_Ashtara NIN MOJAVE AK IMEN

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    Some people have no problem dictating their own laws of their own spiritual-religious views, deciding what they wish to practice and how they wish to practice it, and how they wish to live their lives. I completely approve. These people may or may not draw inspiration from holy books or religions. I approve regardless. It is a way of altering and manipulating your own programming.

    A religious code of discipline, for example, needn't be something handed down over many generations, or dictated by some council or some prophet. It can be incredibly awesome and effective when it is... but a religious (or non-religious) code of discipline can be constructed and practiced by the individual as well.


     
  11. jcforever

    jcforever Member

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    As long as God called you with His voice and forces you to obey ALL His commandments, there's nothing to worry about.

    Revelation 3:
    20: Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if any one hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me.

    Deuteronomy 28:
    1: And if you obey the voice of the LORD your God, being careful to do all his commandments which I command you this day, the LORD your God will set you high above all the nations of the earth.
    2: And all these blessings shall come upon you and overtake you, if you obey the voice of the LORD your God.

    Jeremiah 7:
    23: But this command I gave them, `Obey my voice, and I will be your God, and you shall be my people; and walk in all the way that I command you, that it may be well with you.'

    John 18:
    37: Pilate said to him, "So you are a king?" Jesus answered, "You say that I am a king. For this I was born, and for this I have come into the world, to bear witness to the truth. Every one who is of the truth hears my voice."

    Those of you who were not chosen to hear the voice of God and obey His commandments, this is what you will experience;

    Deuteronomy 28
    15: “But if you will not obey the voice of the Lord your God or be careful to do all his commandments which I command you this day, then all these curses shall come upon you and overtake you.
    16: Cursed shall you be in the city, and cursed shall you be in the field.
    17: Cursed shall be your basket and your kneading-trough.
    18: cursed shall be the fruit of your body, and the fruit of your ground, the increase of your cattle, and the young of your flock.
    19: Cursed shall you be when you come in, and cursed shall you be when you go out.
    20: “the Lord will send upon you curses, confusion, and frustration, in all that you undertake to do, until you are destroyed and perish quickly, on account of the evil of your doings, because you have forsaken me.
    21: The Lord will make the pestilence cleave to you until he has consumed you off the land which you are entering to take possession of it.
    22: The Lord will smite you with consumption, and with fever, inflammation, and fiery heat, and with drought, and with blasting, and with mildew; they shall pursue you until you perish.
    23: And the heavens over your head shall be brass, and the earth under you shall be iron.
    24: The Lord will make the rain of your land powder and dust; from heaven it shall come down upon you until you are destroyed.

    61: Every sickness also, and every affliction which is not recorded in the book of this law, the LORD will bring upon you, until you are destroyed.
    62: Whereas you were as the stars of heaven for multitude, you shall be left few in number; because you did not obey the voice of the LORD your God.
    63: And as the LORD took delight in doing you good and multiplying you, so the LORD will take delight in bringing ruin upon you and destroying you; and you shall be plucked off the land which you are entering to take possession of it.

    But don't worry, it's only the flesh of man that perishes, not the spiritual man created in God.
     
  12. oldbadger

    oldbadger Skanky Old Mongrel!

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    So the Old Testament and its laws don't really hold much weight for most Christian.... is that right?

    I read Acts 15, and saw that Christianity has a number of prophets, such as Judas and Silas. I think that Cephas also received visions while at Jopppa which changed dietary rules, so he is a Christian prophet bas well?
     
  13. oldbadger

    oldbadger Skanky Old Mongrel!

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    OK..... so there are no fixed Christian laws apart from 'follow conscience and 'do unto others...' ?
    Is that right?
     
  14. Kemosloby

    Kemosloby Well-Known Member
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    If there is no written code then do unto others is not a law either. Yet you would be wise to do it. Perhaps the difference is in the nature of law. Law is enforced by punishment, but doing good is rewarded. And the law was never intended to prevent anyone from doing good. So you may do good even without a law, and to "do unto others" is good.
     
  15. oldbadger

    oldbadger Skanky Old Mongrel!

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    So it was more than two laws? You've mentioned four laws + in just that one post, surely?
    This needs looking into. I'm confused.
     
  16. Shiranui117

    Shiranui117 Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
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    Yes, if you want to use that particular term. We believe that many Christians can have the gift of prophecy or receive visions from God, but we typically don't call these people "prophets". To us, a "prophet" refers to people from the Old Testament who God singled out to give a revelation to the people of Israel. We believe that the full faith given to us by Jesus Christ has already been revealed; we don't need any further prophets. I believe it's said that God's revelation of the faith to mankind stopped with the death of St. John, the last of the Apostles and the author of the Book of Revelation. Everything beyond that is just clarifying what has already been revealed to us.
     
  17. meghanwaterlillies

    meghanwaterlillies Well-Known Member

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    what came out of a pyramid sometimes is usually sidelined.
     
  18. MJFlores

    MJFlores John 15:19

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    The old covenant only applies to ancient Israel while the new covenant applies to all who are in Christ.

    Hebrews 8:13 New International Version (NIV)
    By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear.

    notkosher.jpg

    We read the Old Testament bible, to reflect on things about God, about the Lord Jesus Christ and about what happened to ancient Israel. Sabbath and kosher foods are removed in the new covenant in accommodation to the Gentiles in Christ. Penalties of death were repealed in the New Covenant. Circumcision optional, not required. Most of the law in the old are also reflected in the new covenant.

    Summary:

    Old Covenant = ancient Israel only - Non Jews Keep Out
    = circumcision required

    New Covenant = all in Christ - no discrimination

     
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  19. meghanwaterlillies

    meghanwaterlillies Well-Known Member

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    You know, Christian
    what came out of a pyramid sometimes is usually sidelined.
     
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  20. meghanwaterlillies

    meghanwaterlillies Well-Known Member

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    No discrimination? LOL
     
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