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Featured Christians. Heaven and hell

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Unveiled Artist, Jan 11, 2021.

  1. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    Haha. Just what I remember as an adult. As a teen, well....

    This is cute. I remember in a movie, I think Titanic, where Cal accused Jack of being an "honest thief." Would stealing be considered lying?

    Thanks

    Some interesting links.

    Orishas
    Ochún
     
  2. BilliardsBall

    BilliardsBall Well-Known Member

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    First you must answer, "if we all deserve Hell, why does God show mercy to some"? How does it sit with you to say that anyone will get to Heaven?
     
  3. Mestemia

    Mestemia Advocatus Diaboli
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    So then free will is ONLY about choosing to believe in god?

    How does that work for those who are not children, yet do not believe in god?
    they have no free will?
    Only theists can have free will?
     
  4. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    Shrugs. Not sure why. That's how the christian belief is. Believe or reject.

    Do you believe god will save children?
     
  5. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    Well, non-theist will be separated from god forever. It shouldn't be an issue, though since we're (non-believers) aren't under christian's god edict. I think Catholicism believe children will go to heaven since they are baptized as infants and have purgatory.
     
  6. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    I was reading the bahai question/answer. What is the determining factor that separates god from adults non-believers?

    I know sin temporarily separates, but in christianity there's a "unforgivable sin." Is that the case in bahai?
     
  7. Mestemia

    Mestemia Advocatus Diaboli
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    How does this address the post it was in reply to?
     
  8. lostwanderingsoul

    lostwanderingsoul Well-Known Member

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    The Bible says NO ONE goes to heaven. The punishment for sin is eternal DEATH. Those who follow God's laws will recieve eternal life.
     
  9. Thief

    Thief Rogue Theologian

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    a respectable play.......

    I suspect heaven and hell are nigh close to each other

    a parable describes a moment when one suffering in hell.....
    would be close enough to ask an angel to in turn ask someone in heaven
    for a cool drink of water

    and the immediate response......nay
    for there is a great divide between us

    SO.....a great divide?
    yet close enough to converse
     
  10. Mestemia

    Mestemia Advocatus Diaboli
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    Are you ever going to address the point of the first post?
     
  11. stvdv

    stvdv Veteran Member

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    Hahahaha
    I originally added this in brackets (as an adult), but I removed that part
    But you are very honest, so you correct me for failing to add that part:D

    Not according to the writer of the Ramayana (Hindu scripture), the writer used to be a so called criminal, and the Master only asked him to stop lying and repeat the Name of Rama. Doing this he later became the well known writer of the Ramayana Scripture

    Suppose you tell your mother "I have stolen money". But you did not steal money. That would mean you are not a thief, but you are liar:D

    IF you rob a bank. When asked "where did you get the money" you reply "I robbed a bank". That means you are a bank robber, but not a liar
    (And when lucky they might reply "aha, that's a good joke, and you get away with it;)")

    Thank you
     
  12. 1213

    1213 Well-Known Member

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    Interesting, if some believe so, because according to the Bible, death is the wage of sin and eternal life is a gift for righteous. And so, no one gets hell because of Adam and Eve, but because of their own unrighteousness.

    These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
    Mat. 25:46

    For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
    Romans 6:23
     
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  13. lostwanderingsoul

    lostwanderingsoul Well-Known Member

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    The OP asks if we all deserve hell (separation from God). We all deserve death.
     
  14. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    Of course that would not determine the eternal relationship one has with God....
    Adults do a lot of that too, but that does not mean that are not close to God.
    I am known for being angry at God a lot, but given the degree of my suffering I am sure God understands and forgives.
     
  15. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    Yes. According to christian belief it's between rejection or acceptence.

    It's "taught" that non-believers have free will too but we reject their gods grace.

    Going back to the children, I'd say they're not under gods grace of salvation since they couldn't choose to reject. I assume all who don't have the mental ability to accept will die just as children.
     
  16. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    Hmm. So if a person on earth never sins (which I believe is possible), than he is righteous like Christ and will be with god?
     
  17. lostwanderingsoul

    lostwanderingsoul Well-Known Member

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    I guess your beliefs are not based on the Bible because the Bible says ALL have sinned.
     
  18. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    I replied to 1213. Since all has sinned and children are sinners because of their parents, they should go to hell given they haven't accept jesus to be saved.

    How do you feel about that?

    Also. Do you have the correct interpretation of the bible? I know many Christians tend to think they do.
     
  19. Deeje

    Deeje Avid Bible Student
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    God is the judge of a person's heart.....no righteous person will lose their lives by God's hand. But God has his criteria for salvation and what he considers as "righteousness". We can't tell the judge to carry out justice......his justice is perfect, based on his stated laws, not on sentimentality. This is a God who knows the heart, not just the actions. It matter more to him what our motivation is, not the performance we carry out.

    Since Jesus himself used the flood of Noah's day to illustrate the situation that we would face again, (Matthew 24:37-39) how many children survived the flood? Why do you think only Noah and his family survived, when everyone outside the ark, perished? Were the people prevented from coming onto the ark? Did God prohibit any of them from saving themselves? Noah was called a "preacher of righteousness" in an unrighteous world....(2 Peter 2:5) so they knew what the message was...but they just chose to ignore it in much the same way as people do today.
    He said "they took no notice until the flood came and swept them all away".....and we believe that it will be that way again with the nay-sayers and unbelievers.

    Ignoring Noah's warning and treating him with disrespect is what claimed the lives of those people, as well as their children.
    So we need to put the blame where it lies. The invitation was open to all, and for a very long time, but nobody took it up, choosing instead to stay with the violence and immorality to which they had become accustomed.

    Violence and immorality can become accepted when people are exposed to it for a long time.....much of today's violence and immorality is served virtually, via the entertainment media. Children are raised with very violent video games and movies where no imagination is needed as the carnage and immoral conduct is portrayed very graphically and accepted as "normal"....just harmless entertainment. Don't we have to ask why humans have such an insatiable appetite for those things?
    If we have a sense of morality like no other creatures, is that appetite, normal or abnormal? The Bible calls that appetite..."sin" and it is in all of us. But its up to us whether we treat it as "normal" or not.

    The apostle Paul also explained an interesting fact regarding a child's standing with God....
    "....If any brother has an unbelieving wife and she is agreeable to staying with him, let him not leave her; 13 and if a woman has an unbelieving husband and he is agreeable to staying with her, let her not leave her husband. 14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified in relation to his wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified in relation to the brother; otherwise, your children would be unclean, but now they are holy." (1 Corinthians 7:12-14)

    If a Christian has an unbelieving mate, God views them as "sanctified" because of their children. This means that there is an age of accountability where children are concerned.....but it is not numerical, it is an age where a child can choose to worship God on their own. Spiritual maturity knows no age. So, before that time they are on their parent's 'ticket' (so to speak) and will be saved (or not saved) by virtue of their believing parents' standing with God.

    Does that answer your question?
     
  20. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    Just the last part here. Not sure the other references.

    So if their parents did not believe in God and they were under age to worship, they would be separated from god by death?
     
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