Christians:Condemning Vs. Teaching

[Nada]

I think Peter was also right. He remained a Jew and was worried about that. The dream he had was a better way for The Lord to speak to him. (You guys must know the story of Peter's dream about eating animals, if not, it's in Acts).

Remaining a literal Jew means nothing.All of mankind has a chance for salvation through the blood of Jesus Christ.That is why at the end of the 70 weeks prophecy,it was fulfilled with Cornelius the Centurion and his family being blessed with holy spirit.God's blessing was for the Jew and the Gentile.All of mankind.It's in Acts 10.

23...The next day Peter started out with them, and some of the believers from Joppa went along.24 The following day he arrived in Caesarea. Cornelius was expecting them and had called together his relatives and close friends.

44 While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit came on all who heard the message.45 The circumcised believers who had come with Peter were astonished that the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out even on Gentiles.


All who follow God and believe in Jesus are now spiritual Jews.That is why Paul spoke of circumcision of the heart.
Romans 2:29 No, a person is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a person's praise is not from other people, but from God.

So we can see that being a literal blood Jew means nothing.It is those who are spiritual Jews.All who follow Gods commands.

 

[Nada]

I think Peter was also right. He remained a Jew and was worried about that. The dream he had was a better way for The Lord to speak to him. (You guys must know the story of Peter's dream about eating animals, if not, it's in Acts).

Peters vision in Acts 10:9-16 took place right before Peter arrived at Cornelius house.It was a vision where God corrected Peter's way of thinking.Peter tried to remain in the old way of thinking.God corrected him real quick and told him,15 The voice spoke to him a second time, “Do not call anything impure that God has made clean.”

This agrees with 1 Timothy 4:3,4. 3 They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth.4 For everything God created is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving,5 because it is consecrated by the word of God and prayer.

Before there were kosher laws and eating certain animals was considered unclean.When Jesus came and established the new covenant,all of that was done away with.As long as one prayed before eating ones meal,it was considered sanctified.This is called Thanksgiving.Peter was still accustomed to the old ways.He was having trouble letting go.God corrected him and Peter responded.In the same way Paul had to correct him also when Peter discriminated against the uncircumcised Jews in Antioch.It took Peter a while, but he came around.

 

[nazz]

I am in absolute agreement

This discussion has come up in another thead, I don't wish to hijack that other discussion so:

As a follower of Yeshua (Jesus), it is taught that if we see a fellow Christian doing something that may be against the faith to talk to them in private about it. That is not negotiable, we are supposed to do that.

People mistake that to mean to condemn a fellow Christians, that we are not supposed to do. We are not supposed to point at a person and say "You are not a true Christian if you believe/don't believe ________".

Do you all agree with this? I would like people who actually follow my faith, no matter which denomination, to answer. If another faith wants to answer, that does not bother me, as long as we keep on the discussion, thank you.

It begs the question "what is a true Christian". Everyone has different ideas so they can't all be right. So which one, if any, is? I think the descriptor "Christian" doesn't tell us a lot about a person at all other than some vague connection to Christ.

I admit I am a very judgmental person especially when it comes to other Christians who I often deem to be self-righteous and hypocritical. But then I see that Jesus was as well.

 

[Robert.Evans]

As I said, Paul did have a right. It was doing it publicly that I was questioning. I said this later in the thread.

Ok.
I will think on this. Good point

 

[Robert.Evans]

This discussion has come up in another thead, I don't wish to hijack that other discussion so:

As a follower of Yeshua (Jesus), it is taught that if we see a fellow Christian doing something that may be against the faith to talk to them in private about it. That is not negotiable, we are supposed to do that.

People mistake that to mean to condemn a fellow Christians, that we are not supposed to do. We are not supposed to point at a person and say "You are not a true Christian if you believe/don't believe ________".

Do you all agree with this? I would like people who actually follow my faith, no matter which denomination, to answer. If another faith wants to answer, that does not bother me, as long as we keep on the discussion, thank you.

I would say that Pegg is correct. Personal offences would be dealt with personally. I think that is normal, is it not? But Paul was speaking in Gal of something that was a more public part of his actions, and he dealt with it in questioning him. I don't think that is bad. Did he say he was not a true christian? I don't think so..... but I stand to be corrected.

 

[ChristineES]

I would say that Pegg is correct. Personal offences would be dealt with personally. I think that is normal, is it not? But Paul was speaking in Gal of something that was a more public part of his actions, and he dealt with it in questioning him. I don't think that is bad. Did he say he was not a true christian? I don't think so..... but I stand to be corrected.

I don't think it's just personal grievances. I think it's doing things against God. I can't truly speak for Paul and Peter's situation, I spoke out of line with that one, and I wasn't the one who even brought it up: It wasn't what I was even speaking about. I am speaking of the here and now. If I were doing something wrong, for example, I don't think it would do any good for me for the elders of my Church to shout out about in front of the whole congregation. Talk to someone in private. That's all

 

[ChristineES]

I am in absolute agreement

It begs the question "what is a true Christian". Everyone has different ideas so they can't all be right. So which one, if any, is? I think the descriptor "Christian" doesn't tell us a lot about a person at all other than some vague connection to Christ.

I admit I am a very judgmental person especially when it comes to other Christians who I often deem to be self-righteous and hypocritical. But then I see that Jesus was as well.

I am beginning to not even like the term "Christian". It was brought up that the term "Christian" was rather vague and it's true. It can be used to describe anyone from a person who goes to Church on Easter and Christmas and lives secularly to a person who goes to Church every week and has several Bible studies besides. It can describe a person who gives to charities and walks in Jesus' path and another who doesn't give, doesn't pray and never thinks of God at all. It's not place to judge them true Christians or not, however, so I don't.

That's off topic, though. Saying someone is doing something wrong, as Paul said Peter was doing is not the same thing as saying to Peter "You are not a true disciple of Yeshua" Paul didn't say that and didn't insinuate that, so I am not 100% sure why it was even brought up in the first place.

 

[Nada]

There are true christians, and then there are those who do what they want,pick and choose what they want to believe from the holy scriptures,but still call themselves christians.Some just can't handle the truth or admit when they are incorrect.You learn when you come to realize that you are wrong and God is right.

 

[ChristineES]

There are true christians, and then there are those who do what they want,pick and choose what they want to believe from the holy scriptures,but still call themselves christians.Some just can't handle the truth or admit when they are incorrect.You learn when you come to realize that you are wrong and God is right.

God is right. Men's interpretations are just that: Men's interpretations. You never did answer my question about the log and the splinter that Jesus spoke about. What do you think that means?

 

[Nada]

God is right. Men's interpretations are just that: Men's interpretations. You never did answer my question about the log and the splinter that Jesus spoke about. What do you think that means?

I did answer you.I told you twice I think.I explained that it refers to those who judge or teach others when they themselves do the same thing.One cannot try to try to help another remove and fix his sins when the one trying to help is doing the exact same thing.

Romans 2:21,22. 21 you, therefore, who teach another, do you not teach yourself? You who preach that one shall not steal, do you steal? 22You who say that one should not commit adultery, do you commit adultery? You who abhor idols, do you rob temples?…

 

[ChristineES]

I did answer you.I told you twice I think.I explained that it refers to those who judge or teach others when they themselves do the same thing.One cannot try to try to help another remove and fix his sins when the one trying to help is doing the exact same thing.

Romans 2:21,22. 21 you, therefore, who teach another, do you not teach yourself? You who preach that one shall not steal, do you steal? 22You who say that one should not commit adultery, do you commit adultery? You who abhor idols, do you rob temples?…

Not necessarily the same thing. It means judging someone of sin while you sin yourself, it doesn't matter if it's the same sin or not. I sin myself, not delibrately, but I have human nature; because of that I try not to judge others.

 

[Nada]

Not necessarily the same thing. It means judging someone of sin while you sin yourself, it doesn't matter if it's the same sin or not. I sin myself, not delibrately, but I have human nature; because of that I try not to judge others.

There is a huge difference between stumbling and deliberately sinning.All are imperfect.

 

[ChristineES]

There is a huge difference between stumbling and deliberately sinning.All are imperfect.

No argument there. A true Christian doesn't sin delibrately (hopefully), yet will still fall short, as Paul stated in Romans.

 

[Nada]

Not necessarily the same thing. It means judging someone of sin while you sin yourself, it doesn't matter if it's the same sin or not. I sin myself, not delibrately, but I have human nature; because of that I try not to judge others.

What you see as judging is not the same as what is spoken of in the holy scriptures in some passages. We are to watch out for one another and if a brother gets out of line,they are to be rebuked,corrected,just as Paul did with Peter. 2 Timothy 3:16,17. 16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,17 so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.

Rebuking:express sharp disapproval or criticism of (someone) because of their behavior or actions:

Correcting:free from error; in accordance with fact or truth:

 

[Nada]

No argument there. A true Christian doesn't sin delibrately (hopefully), yet will still fall short, as Paul stated in Romans.

How come you can say "A true Christian" but I can't? Lol...

 

[ChristineES]

What you see as judging is not the same as what is spoken of in the holy scriptures in some passages. We are to watch out for one another and if a brother gets out of line,they are to be rebuked,corrected,just Paul did with Peter. 2 Timothy 3:16,17. 16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,17 so that the servant of God[a] may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.

I don't disagree with that. Rebuking needs to be done on occasion. But this whole scenario between Peter and Paul has always been a sore spot with me. Certainly, I don't believe being in the military is a sin, yet some people seem to think so. I was in the Navy, I never shot a gun, never killed anyone, never worked on any war machines that would kill someone and so on. But, at the same time, our country needs protection. Even King David had soldiers and an army. That is more a difference of opinion, whether it is a sin or not, not an actual teaching of Jesus.

 

[ChristineES]

How come you can say "A true Christian" but I can't? Lol...

You know perfectly well I am speaking generally and not specifically. I never said you couldn't say it.

 

[Nada]

You know perfectly well I am speaking generally and not specifically. I never said you couldn't say it.

I know you did not say that I could not say it.I never said you did say that.I asked a question.
I was being funny because every time I said it, you took offense to it, and you claimed I was being judgmental.

 

[ChristineES]

I know you did not say that I could not say it.I never said you did say that.I asked a question.
I was being funny because every time I said it, you took offense to it, and you claimed I was being judgmental.

Actually, I only did that once and it was done in private. I do take offense to it, if it done to someone as an individual. I won't say you or anyone else is a false Christian, but I can say that I know that there are false Christians out there. That's the difference.

 

[Nada]

Actually, I only did that once and it was done in private. I do take offense to it, if it done to someone as an individual. I won't say you or anyone else is a false Christian, but I can say that I know that there are false Christians out there. That's the difference.

Ok.......