1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Christians - Bible Interpretation

Discussion in 'Same Faith Debates' started by drummrguy14, Nov 29, 2005.

  1. drummrguy14

    drummrguy14 New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2005
    Messages:
    7
    Ratings:
    +2
    Here's another issue I've been dealing with lately...

    In my discussions with my girlfriend, I have discovered just how literally she takes the Bible. She takes it to be 100% fact, not metaphorical, not interpretable...but that it is God's infallable word.

    I on the other hand, believe most of it to be metaphorical...I find that more people can be touched by God's word that way, and in doing so draw nearer to Him, so why wouldn't he want that?

    I'm interested in hearing some other opinions about this, as well as maybe some advice on how to talk about the Bible with someone who takes it so literally.

    thanks!
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. Mike182

    Mike182 Flaming Queer

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2005
    Messages:
    13,381
    Ratings:
    +1,388
    the problem i find when reading the bible literally is that you start with adam and eve, you then get cain and abel, and you then get .... .... .... well, a very short humanity

    however, some things in the bible must be taken literally, like jesus's sacrifice upon the cross, this is central to the belief

    i see jesus as a teacher and a friend - he talks and uses parables, which many people can relate to, and these are metaphores for reality - so if jesus talked in metaphores, why can't the bible be metaphorical in places?

    mike
     
  3. Quiddity

    Quiddity UndertheInfluenceofGiants

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2005
    Messages:
    19,866
    Ratings:
    +1,395
    Religion:
    Catholic
    I pick and choose according to Church teaching.

    ~Victor
     
  4. drummrguy14

    drummrguy14 New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2005
    Messages:
    7
    Ratings:
    +2
    Mike182 -

    Yes, thank you. I agree with you about Jesus teaching in metaphorical parables, and about creation with Adam and Eve...just to further the discussion, how would you respond to this:
    It's God's word. Why would it be in the Bible if it wasn't true?

    Thanks for your input :)
     
  5. Aqualung

    Aqualung Tasty

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2005
    Messages:
    8,761
    Ratings:
    +604
    "It's not "God's word." It's what God has said to people, that they then wrote down, that was then copied and re-copied, translated and re-translated, until this very day."
    That's what I would say.
     
  6. michel

    michel Administrator Emeritus
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2004
    Messages:
    28,667
    Ratings:
    +2,657
    I must admit I take the Bible (especially the O.T) with a very large pinch of salt; at best, I see it as an enbelished and exagerated history book. But hey, if your girlfriend wants to take the whole Bible literally, "power to her". My motto with all such thoughts is 'If it doesn't hurt anyone else............'

    Ah, now that is something no one can answer for you; only you can make that decision. As far as I see it, you have two options;
    1. Be truthful, and say "look, I respect your views, but you need to understand I don't see things your way........."
    2. Sit patiently by and agree with what she says; that depends on how you view 'tact' and honesty in a relationship. In my experience, choosing the latter option means you would be creating a rathger large rod for your own back. better to clear the air........but it is up to you.
     
  7. jeffrey

    jeffrey †ßig Dog†

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2005
    Messages:
    5,366
    Ratings:
    +1,008
    I'm with michel, again, (wish I could find something to disagree with you about just to brake the monotony! lol!) And remember, that even the NT was wrote, excluding the Gospels and Acts, as letters to address issues in Churches that they where having. This does not take away the importance of them, but you must understand what the issues where to gain the full meaning of the letters. Sometimes they take on a different light, addressing issues in that time frame.
     
  8. sdotbrown

    sdotbrown Member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2005
    Messages:
    30
    Ratings:
    +1
    i take the bible literaly. it does not make sense to me to pick and choose parts you like. people always tell me that it has been changed a lot over time, but i know that what is written in my bible is from God
     
  9. Scuba Pete

    Scuba Pete Le plongeur avec attitude...

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2004
    Messages:
    16,466
    Ratings:
    +3,191
    Religion:
    Christian Taoist
    I take all of the Bible and let God's Spirit guide me into understanding it.

    It's like a calculus book... when I read it for the first time, I had no idea how to work the first problem. I needed a GUIDE (aka professor), to help me understand. The lectures helped (preaching) but UNTIL I tried to put it into practice, I still had no idea how to do it. The more I practiced, the better I got at it. As my understanding increased, I could see how others got it wrong just like I used to do.
     
  10. Dentonz

    Dentonz Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2005
    Messages:
    234
    Ratings:
    +27
    Amen, finally an answer on this website with a little wisdom. So many people try to 'understand' the Bible by there own knowledge and end up like the majority of the responses you see in forums like this. The Bible clearly states that the carnal mind does not and cannot understand the things of God. The Word of God has to be revealed to you by the Holy Spirit.
     
  11. Abram

    Abram Abraham

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2005
    Messages:
    546
    Ratings:
    +72
    I agree with sbotbrown here. I think if God can create a entire world then I believe that he can deliver a book over 2000 years and still be true to his inspiration.

    But as far as your friend taking it to literally, let her. It a journey we all take differently, look around. You can't tell someone how to explore the Bible, be happy that she is.

    "You don't have to take it literally, but you should take it seriously..."
     
  12. Baerly

    Baerly Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2006
    Messages:
    431
    Ratings:
    +13
    Drummrguy, Please go to thepreachersfiles.com and look up this very good lesson:
    "The bible doctrine of Inspiration" thepreachersfiles.com/inspiration_of_the_scriptures/000548.htm

    It will be worth your time if you have a good and honest heart (Luke 8:15) in love Baerly
     
  13. waacman

    waacman Restoration of everything

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2006
    Messages:
    169
    Ratings:
    +10
    I take the Bible literally as well. It would be interesting to just probe her mind of why she takes the Bible literally and what exactly she means by "literally". I've found that there is a big misunderstanding as to what "taking the Bible literally means" in the minds of some people. I think "literally" means that if something is written as poetry, we read it as poetry, if prophecy, then read it as prophecy, and so on. There is a lot of good work out there that will enable one to help intrepret the scriptures properly while using common sense.
     
  14. Baerly

    Baerly Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2006
    Messages:
    431
    Ratings:
    +13
    Drummrguy, Please check this out. This is only a small portion of the lesson. You will have to go to thepreachersfiles.com to see the rest. Baerly

    Our Standard for Authority

    August 17, 2004 by Kevin Cauley - Berryville church of Christ, Berryville Arkansas
    SUBJECT: Bible Authority
    TITLE: Our Standard for Authority
    PROPOSITION: The Bible and only the Bible must be our sole standard for spiritual authority today because 1) Only the Bible is Inspired of God, 2) Other standards are woefully inadequate, 3) The Bible is all sufficient to meet every spiritual need.
    OBJECTIVES: The hearer should be able to state why other standards are lacking, understand Bible inspiration, and state why the Bible is all sufficient.
    AIM: To establish in the mind of each hearer the importance of letting the Bible settle all spiritual questions today.
    INTRODUCTION:
    1. Read: 2 Peter 1:16-21 "For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty. For he received from God the Father honor and glory, when there came such a voice to him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. And this voice, which came from heaven, we heard, when we were with him in the holy mount. We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts: Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost."
    2. About the Text:
    1) Peter is writing to those who had obtained a like precious faith (2 Peter 1:1).
    2) He is trying to build up their faith by adding to it the Christian virtues (5-8).
    3) He does not want to be negligent in ensuring that they are sure about the things upon which their faith is based (11-13).
    4) The things that he taught were not fables.
    5) He was an eyewitness of these things.
    6) Additionally, we have "a more sure word of prophecy."
    7) This prophecy is not of private origination.
    8) This prophecy was originated from the Holy Spirit.
    9) It is only by this authority that we can be "sure" of our calling and election.
    3. Historically
    1) In the early 19th century there was a man by the name of Thomas Campbell
    2) He was very disenchanted with the great amount of religious division that resulted from the reformation.
    3) He wrote a document called the "Declaration and Address."
    4) This is NOT an inspired document.
    5) In this document he wrote 13 propositions to which Christians must adhere to have religious unity. Proposition 2 and 3 are as follows: "That although the Church of Christ upon earth must necessarily exist in particular and distinct societies, locally separate one from another, yet there ought to be no schisms, no uncharitable divisions among them. They ought to receive each other as Christ Jesus hath also received them, to the glory of God. And for this purpose they ought all to walk by the same rule, to mind and speak the same thing; and to be perfectly joined together in the same mind, and in the same judgment. 3. That in order to do this, nothing ought to be inculcated upon Christians as articles of faith; nor required of them as terms of communion, but what is expressly taught and enjoined upon them in the word of God. Nor ought anything to be admitted, as of Divine obligation, in their Church constitution and managements, but what is expressly enjoined by the authority of our Lord Jesus Christ and his apostles upon the New Testament Church; either in express terms or by approved precedent."
    6) Campbell sought to make the Bible our only standard for faith and spiritual practice to gain religious unity.
    7) The Bible claims to be the ONLY standard from God for man's spiritual practices while upon the earth.
    4. Ref. to S, T, P, O, and A.
    DISCUSSION: The Bible and only the Bible must be our sole standard for spiritual authority today because . . .
    I. Only the Bible is inspired of God
    1. Only the words of God are authoritative and powerful.
    1) God's words are always fulfilled; such cannot be said of other authorities. Isaiah 55:10, 11 "For as the rain cometh down and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, and giveth seed to the sower and bread to the eater; so shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it."
    2) Luke 1:37 ASV "For no word from God shall be void of power."
    3) Hebrews 4:12, 13 "For the word of God is living, and active, and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing even to the dividing of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and quick to discern the thoughts and intents of the heart. And there is no creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and laid open before the eyes of him with whom we have to do."
     
  15. sojourner

    sojourner Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2006
    Messages:
    37,753
    Ratings:
    +5,898
    Religion:
    Christian/Shamanic
    In what way is Campbell's "Declaration and Address" determined to be "not inspired?"
    I think the article misrepresents what Campbell was after in writing the "Declaration." In a world where one's religious affiliation was too often predicated upon "what we believe," therefore fostering man-made division in a Church that is "essentially, intentionally and constitutionally one," Campbell sought to foster unity by having us focus upon "whom we follow." I find the Declaration to be inspired (but not canonized). Campbell's stance was not strictly sola scriptura. It was also bolstered by the application of tradition, reason, and local practice in the interpretation of Biblical passages. Campbell's issue was not to set sola scriptura on a pedestal, it was to do away with superfluous theology and practice that had caused division in the Church.
     
  16. angellous_evangellous

    Ratings:
    +0
    Would that God were alive today.
     
  17. Terrywoodenpic

    Terrywoodenpic Oldest Heretic

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2005
    Messages:
    17,469
    Ratings:
    +4,578
    Religion:
    Anglican...heretic
    I pick and chose, what ever the church is teaching.

    I pick and chose those things I can understand, that have meaning for me.
    This is not a fixed list, but one that grows with my understanding.
     
  18. Terrywoodenpic

    Terrywoodenpic Oldest Heretic

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2005
    Messages:
    17,469
    Ratings:
    +4,578
    Religion:
    Anglican...heretic
    God is alive in every one of us today.
    The problem is that we don't recognise him.
     
  19. angellous_evangellous

    Ratings:
    +0
    My comment is not directed towards you, Terry, but only to the dead God that can only speak in Scripture.

    I say, "Would that God were alive today"

    Answer: "But God speaks in his word."

    My response: "Then He is mute, and if God cannot speak, He may as well be mute."

    It's not a matter of not recognizing God but taping his mouth shut with his own words.
     
  20. Baerly

    Baerly Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2006
    Messages:
    431
    Ratings:
    +13
    Our God is alive and well. God spoke in many different ways and through different mediums in the O.T. but now in these last days spoken to us through his SON (Jesus) (Heb 1:1,2).

    That message was confirmed by miracles and signs (Heb.2:3,4) (Mark 16:20).

    That message was ONCE DELIVERED according to (Jude 3). There will be no more messages.

    That message contained ALL THINGS pertaining to life and godliness (2Peter 1:3). Therefore we do not need any NEW messages,since God delivered all we needed.

    We look into the word of God (BIBLE) for our spiritual guidance now. We need no other book or creed to follow (Gal.1:6-9) (Rev.22:18-19) (1Cor.4:6) (Deut.4:2).Jesus is our Creed (John 12:48).

    God spoke to man and the apostles wrote the word of Jesus down by the guidance of the Holy Spirit (John 17:8) (John 14:26 ; 16:13). It will serve as a guide book for all spiritual matters for Christians till the end of the world. It will pass all tests man can and will ever give it. It (the bible) will be our Judge in the end (John 12:48).

    in love Baerly
     
Loading...