Comprehend
Res Ipsa Loquitur
Christians - If God is omnipotent, why was it necessary for Jesus to come to the earth and die for our sins?
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Christian - The Atonement and the omnipotence of God
- Thread starter Comprehend
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Comprehend
Res Ipsa Loquitur
bump.
Hope
Princesinha
There's an excellent quote from C.S. Lewis that answers that question, but I'll have to find it.....
Because He has personal rules that He follows...
Comprehend
Res Ipsa Loquitur
Is he required to follow them? What are the rules?
sojourner
Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
It wasn't! Christ didn't come to earth to die for us. He came to live as one of us, to know God and to make God known. The cross was not the final installment on some cosmic debt.
Jesus died because the clash between unwavering love and unyielding pride and intolerance always result in execution, torture, or imprisonment. The cross is just one more sign of humanity's consistent resistance to grace.
Comprehend
Res Ipsa Loquitur
I have never heard of Christians who didn't believe Jesus died for our sins.... what kind of Christian are you?
sojourner
Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
It wasn't the death that effects salvation. Only God saves. Jesus shows us the way to come to God, so that we can participate in the grace that is ours.
What kind of Christian am I? "There is no longer Jew or Greek,, there is no longer slave or free, there is no longer male and female; for all of you are one in Christ Jesus. And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to the promise."
The question is irrelevant where the promise is concerned.
What kind of Christian am I? "There is no longer Jew or Greek,, there is no longer slave or free, there is no longer male and female; for all of you are one in Christ Jesus. And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to the promise."
The question is irrelevant where the promise is concerned.
Comprehend
Res Ipsa Loquitur
Jesus not only showed us the way to God, but he made it possible through the Atonement.
If you do not accept the premise of the question as fact, then it renders the rest of the question meaningless.
lunamoth
Will to love
I agree Soj, it was not the death that effects salvation, but the conquering of death through Love.
So I will claim the same as Soj: What kind of Christian am I? "There is no longer Jew or Greek,, there is no longer slave or free, there is no longer male and female; for all of you are one in Christ Jesus. And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to the promise."
Comprehend
Res Ipsa Loquitur
I have no idea what you are trying to say with this...
I will say the same thing I said to Sojourner, if you do not accept the premise of the question, it doesn't make much sense to respond to it...
Are you really saying the Atonement was not necessary?
lunamoth
Will to love
I don't know what you think it means, but atonement is 'at-one-ment.' That was accomplished by God with us in Jesus...not by some kind of tit for tat sacrificial death.
Your insinuation that Soj and I are not Christians is a personal attack. You would not stand for someone telling you that you are not a 'real Christian.' :areyoucra
Comprehend
Res Ipsa Loquitur
Luna, You have misunderstood what I wrote. This isn't the first time you have done so and I am beginning to wonder if you are doing it on purpose.
I in no way insinuated that you two were not Christians. Mormon's don't play the "your not a christian"game, we think anyone who tries to follow Jesus should be considered a christian and besides that, we don't think one even has to be a christian to go to heaven so the title doesn't mean the same thing it means to MSC's.
I am sorry that you were offended but could I suggest that you give me the benefit of the doubt next time rather than jump all over me for anything that could possibly be construed as an insult?
A
angellous_evangellous
Guest
***MOD ADVISORY***
Please stay on topic. Personal insults have been removed. Anyone who considers themself a Christian is welcome to participate. Please be civil.
Please stay on topic. Personal insults have been removed. Anyone who considers themself a Christian is welcome to participate. Please be civil.
Comprehend
Res Ipsa Loquitur
I didn't insinuate anything. I asked a direct question.
If you notice, the OP assumes the following premise: Christians believe the Atonement was necessary.
If you don't accept the premise then the question doesn't make any sense.
Comprehend
Res Ipsa Loquitur
It means both actually:
An Atonement is a payment for our sins -
a·tone
1.to make amends or reparation, as for an offense or a crime, or for an offender (usually fol. by for): to atone for one's sins. 2.to make up, as for errors or deficiencies (usually fol. by for): to atone for one's failings. 3.Obsolete. to become reconciled; agree. –verb (used with object) 4.to make amends for; expiate: He atoned his sins.
Which brings about an "at-one-ment" with God.
PS. Thanks for the frubals, that was really kind of you.
lunamoth
Will to love
It means both actually:
An Atonement is a payment for our sins -
a·tone
1.to make amends or reparation, as for an offense or a crime, or for an offender (usually fol. by for): to atone for one's sins. 2.to make up, as for errors or deficiencies (usually fol. by for): to atone for one's failings. 3.Obsolete. to become reconciled; agree. verb (used with object) 4.to make amends for; expiate: He atoned his sins.
Which brings about an "at-one-ment" with God.
PS. Thanks for the frubals, that was really kind of you.
You are welome for the frubals sweetie, anytime.
As for apologies I am waiting for yours for implying that Soj and I are not Christians. Don't be so disingenuous. You know exactly what you were saying when you wrote:
I will say the same thing I said to Sojourner, if you do not believe Jesus paid for our sins with the Atonement, you shouldn't be participating in the thread as the question does not apply to you.
We've both explained our understanding of the atonement.
sandy whitelinger
Veteran Member
Why are the two related?
A
angellous_evangellous
Guest
If God were all-powerful, why would Jesus need to come to earth and die to atone for our sins?
Isn't that a testimony against the power of God, if God cannot atone for sins some other way?
A
angellous_evangellous
Guest
***Thread closed for MOD review.***
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