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Christian Deist

Discussion in 'Deism' started by Neo Deist, Jun 12, 2015.

  1. Neo Deist

    Neo Deist Th.D. & D.Div. h.c.

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    I know. Revisiting an old thread.
     
  2. Bunyip

    Bunyip pro scapegoat

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    No worries.

    Just for the sake of the argument though, I do understand what you are saying - I think that interpreting scripture to suggest that Jesus was the son of God as we are all God's children makes a lot of sense. That was very much the form of Catholicism I was raised in.
     
  3. Neo Deist

    Neo Deist Th.D. & D.Div. h.c.

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    That is what I have to remind people of. The NT, especially the gospels, was written years after Jesus' death. Certain elements of the story had to be told a certain way, otherwise the Christian revolution during the time of the Roman Empire was all for naught. The Book of Matthew goes to great lengths to try and convince people of its authenticity and Jesus' divinity, but a careful examination of its contents reveals that the author is obviously "skewing" some facts.

    For example: Matthew 27:62-66. This was a private conversation yet the author of Matthew wrote about it. How is it that a Christian writer knows what took place behind closed doors with Pilate, Jewish priests and Roman guards? This part of the story just fuels the concept that the tomb was guarded and sealed, and in no way could anyone have stolen the body. This was necessary for the resurrection "miracle." Sounds like a cover-up or conspiracy to me.
     
  4. Bunyip

    Bunyip pro scapegoat

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    I think that many people miss the fact that if Jesus had described himself as the son of God he would have been arrested and executed for heresy.
     
  5. Neo Deist

    Neo Deist Th.D. & D.Div. h.c.

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    Well, since they were under the Roman Empire execution would have been up to the Romans, not the Jews. Many people have this idea that the Pharisees DEMANDED that Jesus be executed, but in truth Pilate could have told them to kiss his *** and that would have been the end of it. The Jews could not stand up to the Roman Legions. It was learned later on that Pilate was unusually cruel and was even removed from office and exiled by Caesar. There is a good chance that Pilate was just playing a game with them for his own amusement.

    There is evidence (though I can't place my finger on it this very second) that Jesus was executed by the Romans for inciting a rebellion.

    Thus we strip away the fantasy surrounding the stories, and get to the meat and potatoes.
     
  6. Bunyip

    Bunyip pro scapegoat

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    The Romans tended to leave the priesthood to take care of such matters.

    Now I don't wish to offend anyone - but when you do strip all of the um...metaphysical bits away, the story gets far more interesting. To interpret the life of Jesus as if he were a man - he becomes this incredibly brave freedom fighter, centuries ahead of his time. Alternatively if you assume he was divine, it loses so much of it's power to me.

    Stand up to Rome as a normal person like you or me - that takes courage. Standing up to a mere earthly power as a god is nothing,
     
  7. Neo Deist

    Neo Deist Th.D. & D.Div. h.c.

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    Yes and no. The Pharisees along with Herod were mere pawns under Roman rule. Archaeology has uncovered that the Jewish priest class lived a life of luxury while the commoners struggled to survive. They were obviously under the Roman payroll, but they were also subject to Roman dominance. Crucifixion was a Roman punishment, not Jewish. It was actually against Jewish law as it was considered torture. It was the Romans that nailed Jesus to the cross. Speculation is that the Romans (Pilate) wanted to quell his little rebellion because the Pharisees could not control him.

    The whole "he died for our sins" idea came about long after his death.

    The missing body was a necessity for a risen messiah, otherwise it was game over for Christianity. Did he really resurrect or was his body stolen? Or...did the Romans take him down from the cross and throw his body in the garbage dump, like they did all the others?
     
    #47 Neo Deist, Aug 26, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2015
  8. dust1n

    dust1n Zindīq

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    Why would a god care about human life at all, let alone morality, worship, or death? There's nothing that indicates that god doesn't just finds human misery humorous.
     
  9. TPaine

    TPaine I believe in one God, and the equality of man.

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    I would think a Christian Deist would be a Unitarian who would agree with much of Thomas Jefferson's The Life And Morals Of Jesus Of Nazareth.
     
  10. ThePainefulTruth

    ThePainefulTruth Romantic-Cynic

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    He said his belief was one of a kind. He didn't believe in the divinity of Jesus and referred to him as Jesus instead of Christ, thus denying the human sacrifice of Jesus. And he didn't believe in God's supernatural interaction in the World which was why he composed the Jefferson Bible wherein he edited them all out. I don't think he even believed in divine providence like Paine and Washington did--it not being consistent with a laissez-faire God by reason of God's commitment to our free will, the apparent sole purpose for the universe.
     
  11. Spartan

    Spartan Well-Known Member

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  12. Shakazuluuuuu

    Shakazuluuuuu Deist I guess what that is

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    Jesuit with the guide to Egypt

    NT. Either window NT or natural theist. The ******* was cast out. He trod a trail with a pillar on his shoulders with a couple thieves cast up a forehead. A crown of thorns and the sun sweating his brow. Gave it up. His existence. For what?


    3 days in that cave. Some of us are tough as nails. Tougher 2.
     
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