Causes of Entrenchment

[Vinayaka]

Last night I watched a news story about the US election. The concept was to catch up to the very same individuals that they had interviewed in 2016, and have another chat. What struck me was they (CBC, if I remember right) didn't find a single person that had changed their vote, from who they voted for in 2016.

Personally, I've voted for 4 different parties, at one time or another here federally, for various reasons at those times.

I see it in religion as well, where the words of a leader are infallible, where the 'I'm right, you're wrong' philosophy prevails. Ideas are hard set psychologically, like concrete, with little or no chance of movement. Even strong stuff, like the un-Christian actions of a certain president have little effect.

I have seen an entrenched individual change though. An acquaintance lost his homophobia when he thought about how his gay teenage son was about to face the world. Love trumped hate. But that's been rare in my observations of entrenched people.

My own faith and life ideas constantly evolve. The entire system is all about change. My Guru's Guru's Guru had a saying that encompasses that: "Let go the rope."

What do you think are some of the causes, from a psychological perspective?
Have you had life-changing moments?
Do you want to change, but can't, because of some barrier? If so, what are those barriers?

 

[Hermit Philosopher]

Last night I watched a news story about the US election. The concept was to catch up to the very same individuals that they had interviewed in 2016, and have another chat. What struck me was they (CBC, if I remember right) didn't find a single person that had changed their vote, from who they voted for in 2016.

Personally, I've voted for 4 different parties, at one time or another here federally, for various reasons at those times.

I see it in religion as well, where the words of a leader are infallible, where the 'I'm right, you're wrong' philosophy prevails. Ideas are hard set psychologically, like concrete, with little or no chance of movement. Even strong stuff, like the un-Christian actions of a certain president have little effect.

I have seen an entrenched individual change though. An acquaintance lost his homophobia when he thought about how his gay teenage son was about to face the world. Love trumped hate. But that's been rare in my observations of entrenched people.

My own faith and life ideas constantly evolve. The entire system is all about change. My Guru's Guru's Guru had a saying that encompasses that: "Let go the rope."

What do you think are some of the causes, from a psychological perspective?
Have you had life-changing moments?
Do you want to change, but can't, because of some barrier? If so, what are those barriers?

Personally, I changed (completely) over night. In 2005. Unplanned and most unexpectedly; to myself and everyone who knew me. However, not much change has taken place thereafter.

 

[Stevicus]

I think some people become entrenched because they don't really know what it's like on the other side of the hill. For me, when I was growing up, I was raised with certain political/philosophical ideals which I believe were relatively common for Americans in my age group. At the time, the politics in America were in a state of transition and people were formulating different values and ideals.

But I also wanted to learn about the other side. I suppose that's why I took an interest in studying about Russia, since they were considered our most feared enemy at the time. They were often portrayed as evil, malicious, and devious, so I wanted to find out what caused them to be like that. I don't think there were that many people who took that kind of interest. They seemed content to simply accept that "that's how they are," and leave it at that. But I wanted to know more.

What I eventually came to realize is that issues and ideologies are far more complicated than what had been originally presented to me in school or by the media or peers. Everyone has a point of view, even those who might seem like wild-eyed fanatics on the surface. I wanted to look beyond the surface of media portrayals and see what was underneath.

But a lot of people are unwilling or unable to do that. They seem stuck in a simplistic world view of "good" and "evil" - and they obviously believe that they're on the side of "good." This may be where the entrenchment comes in, as it seems more religious with a lot of people.

 

[Vinayaka]

I think some people become entrenched because they don't really know what it's like on the other side of the hill. For me, when I was growing up, I was raised with certain political/philosophical ideals which I believe were relatively common for Americans in my age group. At the time, the politics in America were in a state of transition and people were formulating different values and ideals.

But I also wanted to learn about the other side. I suppose that's why I took an interest in studying about Russia, since they were considered our most feared enemy at the time. They were often portrayed as evil, malicious, and devious, so I wanted to find out what caused them to be like that. I don't think there were that many people who took that kind of interest. They seemed content to simply accept that "that's how they are," and leave it at that. But I wanted to know more.

What I eventually came to realize is that issues and ideologies are far more complicated than what had been originally presented to me in school or by the media or peers. Everyone has a point of view, even those who might seem like wild-eyed fanatics on the surface. I wanted to look beyond the surface of media portrayals and see what was underneath.

But a lot of people are unwilling or unable to do that. They seem stuck in a simplistic world view of "good" and "evil" - and they obviously believe that they're on the side of "good." This may be where the entrenchment comes in, as it seems more religious with a lot of people.

Thank you. I'm glad you explored 'the other side'. My first encounter with entrenched politics was at about age 13 (I had just entered Piaget's formal thought stage) when a classmate declared that communism was bad, but couldn't provide me with any reasons for that. That incident was a strong motivator. It made no sense to make a declaration without a reason.

 

[Vinayaka]

Personally, I changed (completely) over night. In 2005. Unplanned and most unexpectedly; to myself and everyone who knew me. However, not much change has taken place thereafter.

Yes. I think plenty of folks have dramatic changes in their lives.

 

[Ponder This]

Last night I watched a news story about the US election. The concept was to catch up to the very same individuals that they had interviewed in 2016, and have another chat. What struck me was they (CBC, if I remember right) didn't find a single person that had changed their vote, from who they voted for in 2016.

Personally, I've voted for 4 different parties, at one time or another here federally, for various reasons at those times.

I see it in religion as well, where the words of a leader are infallible, where the 'I'm right, you're wrong' philosophy prevails. Ideas are hard set psychologically, like concrete, with little or no chance of movement. Even strong stuff, like the un-Christian actions of a certain president have little effect.

I have seen an entrenched individual change though. An acquaintance lost his homophobia when he thought about how his gay teenage son was about to face the world. Love trumped hate. But that's been rare in my observations of entrenched people.

My own faith and life ideas constantly evolve. The entire system is all about change. My Guru's Guru's Guru had a saying that encompasses that: "Let go the rope."

What do you think are some of the causes, from a psychological perspective?
Have you had life-changing moments?
Do you want to change, but can't, because of some barrier? If so, what are those barriers?

2016 really crushed a lot of people mentally and emotionally. I'm talking about people who became clinically depressed. So I would like to take this opportunity to advise to let go a bit and not be so entrenched and attached to their candidate winning the election this year that they become clinically depressed. These sorts of mental break-downs stem from severe entrenchment. So, please, take a moment to open your minds and consider that your candidate might not win this year and that's okay. Take a deep breath. Let it go. Because your mental health matters. Be Well.

 

[Vinayaka]

2016 really crushed a lot of people mentally and emotionally. I'm talking about people who became clinically depressed. So I would like to take this opportunity to advise to let go a bit and not be so entrenched and attached to their candidate winning the election this year that they become clinically depressed. These sorts of mental break-downs stem from severe entrenchment. So, please, take a moment to open your minds and consider that your candidate might not win this year and that's okay. Take a deep breath. Let it go. Because your mental health matters. Be Well.

That's so compassionate of you. Indeed that may also be why I'm so curious about the entrenched syndrome. In my heart, I figure it has to be unhealthy. Entrenched folks do have difficulty dealing with change. I had a colleague who was attached (I would call it severely) to her lesson plans. When the surprise fire drill rang, it nearly killed her. She's go stomping down the the principal's office and explain that her students were in the middle of a test.

Fear of change? Perhaps. Thanks.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Last night I watched a news story about the US election. The concept was to catch up to the very same individuals that they had interviewed in 2016, and have another chat. What struck me was they (CBC, if I remember right) didn't find a single person that had changed their vote, from who they voted for in 2016.

Personally, I've voted for 4 different parties, at one time or another here federally, for various reasons at those times.

I see it in religion as well, where the words of a leader are infallible, where the 'I'm right, you're wrong' philosophy prevails. Ideas are hard set psychologically, like concrete, with little or no chance of movement. Even strong stuff, like the un-Christian actions of a certain president have little effect.

I have seen an entrenched individual change though. An acquaintance lost his homophobia when he thought about how his gay teenage son was about to face the world. Love trumped hate. But that's been rare in my observations of entrenched people.

My own faith and life ideas constantly evolve. The entire system is all about change. My Guru's Guru's Guru had a saying that encompasses that: "Let go the rope."

What do you think are some of the causes, from a psychological perspective?
Have you had life-changing moments?
Do you want to change, but can't, because of some barrier? If so, what are those barriers?

Term limits. For every elected public servant.

 

[Vinayaka]

Term limits. For every elected public servant.

What's that got to do with entrenchment?

 

[Valjean]

What do you think are some of the causes, from a psychological perspective?
Have you had life-changing moments?
Do you want to change, but can't, because of some barrier? If so, what are those barriers?

There are neurologicalcal differences:
Neuroscience Reveals the Differences Between Republican and Democrat Brains
The Surprising Brain Differences Between Democrats and Republicans
The Difference Between Republican and Democratic Brains

 

[Vinayaka]

There are neurologicalcal differences:
Neuroscience Reveals the Differences Between Republican and Democrat Brains
The Surprising Brain Differences Between Democrats and Republicans
The Difference Between Republican and Democratic Brains

Yes, that figures, but in no way explains entrenchment, as that happens on both sides. An example of the type of entrenchment I'm suggesting is the person who argues vehemently about the spelling of 'realize' when I say the the Canadian spelling is 'realise'. Obviously I accept both.

In politics, my father's claim was that a fencepost would win where we lived, if they ran it for a particular party. So it didn't matter how dumb the guy was, he'd always get in, because of entrenchment.

 

[Secret Chief]

What do you think are some of the causes, from a psychological perspective?

Facts rarely change people's fundamental opinions. This is why we see others as "entrenched." "Facts" rarely persuade, unless someone is near a psychological "tipping point." The ongoing securing (entrenchment) of opinions is emotionally-based. IMentrenchedO.

 

[Vinayaka]

Facts rarely change people's fundamental opinions. This is why we see others as "entrenched." "Facts" rarely persuade, unless someone is near a psychological "tipping point." The ongoing securing (entrenchment) of opinions is emotionally-based. IMentrenchedO.

Lots of folks are easily persuaded by facts. I'm not sure about America, but as an example, in my city 95% (probably higher) of folks are mask compliant. of course it also varies by topic. But perhaps you only meant that 5% or so, I'm not sure.

 

[MNoBody]

Last night I watched a news story about the US election. The concept was to catch up to the very same individuals that they had interviewed in 2016, and have another chat. What struck me was they (CBC, if I remember right) didn't find a single person that had changed their vote, from who they voted for in 2016.

Personally, I've voted for 4 different parties, at one time or another here federally, for various reasons at those times.

I see it in religion as well, where the words of a leader are infallible, where the 'I'm right, you're wrong' philosophy prevails. Ideas are hard set psychologically, like concrete, with little or no chance of movement. Even strong stuff, like the un-Christian actions of a certain president have little effect.

I have seen an entrenched individual change though. An acquaintance lost his homophobia when he thought about how his gay teenage son was about to face the world. Love trumped hate. But that's been rare in my observations of entrenched people.

My own faith and life ideas constantly evolve. The entire system is all about change. My Guru's Guru's Guru had a saying that encompasses that: "Let go the rope."

What do you think are some of the causes, from a psychological perspective?
Have you had life-changing moments?
Do you want to change, but can't, because of some barrier? If so, what are those barriers?

people are "suckers for slogans" said a famous marine general
and the medium is the message, manipulating the media of the clay betwixt peoples ears into whatever shape desired with blatant, overt "programming"...very pavlovian

 

[Secret Chief]

Lots of folks are easily persuaded by facts. I'm not sure about America, but as an example, in my city 95% (probably higher) of folks are mask compliant. of course it also varies by topic. But perhaps you only meant that 5% or so, I'm not sure.

OK, my post said fundamental opinions. I think that's where the entrenchment lies. Give me facts about masks, I'm persuaded. Give me facts about eating meat, I'm not persuaded.

 

[MNoBody]

OK, my post said fundamental opinions. I think that's where the entrenchment lies. Give me facts about masks, I'm persuaded. Give me facts about eating meat, I'm not persuaded.

aren't facts supposed to be things that can be easily verified?
Then one would be "educated" because they can now confirm it from their own experiments.

 

[Secret Chief]

aren't facts supposed to be things that can be easily verified?
Then one would be "educated" because they can now confirm it from their own experiments.

On the face of it yes, but a lot of educated people, apparently aware of the same facts, can hold different opinions. I don't mean things such as the shape of the planet, I mean things like two economists having differing views on various economic systems.

 

[MNoBody]

On the face of it yes, but a lot of educated people, apparently aware of the same facts, can hold different opinions. I don't mean things such as the shape of the planet, I mean things like two economists having differing views on various economic systems.

ok, however such things amongst such august company ought to be quickly settled as matter of contention, else the bystanders start to suspect hidden hands muddying the waters for ulterior motives, which is counterproductive to our collective social aims......which should make more people go Hmmm....

 

[Secret Chief]

ok, however such things amongst such august company ought to be quickly settled as matter of contention, else the bystanders start to suspect hidden hands muddying the waters for ulterior motives, which is counterproductive to our collective social aims......which should make more people go Hmmm....

But they are not. Marxist economists and free market economists are not going to settle on an agreement as to which is the "best" form of economy.

 

[MNoBody]

But they are not. Marxist economists and free market economists are not going to settle on an agreement as to which is the "best" form of economy.

ah great, another "lesser evil".
who was it that won't be fooled again