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Can all Religions unite in the belief that banning pornography is good?

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
Don't you tell me porn doesn't create rapists, pedophiles, weirdos, serial killers, human traffickers, break up of families, cause abortions, fatherless children, people with no self-control, and the entire decay of Civilization. I've experienced it personally.
It doesn't cause that.
As a Satanist, I can't endorse a sentiment that is an emotional appeal at best. There must be more to violate someone's autonomy and rights.
Really, we need to be more interested in porn, amd more accepting of it so the discussions of the abuses in it are more easily approachable, and regulators will be more willing to enforce the law amd create laws to improve conditions for people in them (such as mandatory STI screening). It's better than creating unregulated black markets and socially turning a blind eye to abuse that has resulted from centuries and millennia of dogmatic and repressive thoughts and outright lies about sex that have dominated social thought and discourse.
 

Spiderman

Veteran Member
It doesn't cause that.
As a Satanist, I can't endorse a sentiment that is an emotional appeal at best. There must be more to violate someone's autonomy and rights.
Really, we need to be more interested in porn, amd more accepting of it so the discussions of the abuses in it are more easily approachable, and regulators will be more willing to enforce the law amd create laws to improve conditions for people in them (such as mandatory STI screening). It's better than creating unregulated black markets and socially turning a blind eye to abuse that has resulted from centuries and millennia of dogmatic and repressive thoughts and outright lies about sex that have dominated social thought and discourse.
I know better though.

I'm not saying porn will do to everyone what it did in my case.

I think very rarely does it do that.

But what it does is cause addiction. That much is proven.

It works on the same neurotransmitters and chemicals as meth, cocaine, and heroine.

And I've known plenty guys who are obsessed with sex and talk about it all the time. They are not mature, they are not very altruistic, not very patient, always need instant gratification, and I simply don't trust a guy that shows signs of being obsessed with sex or potential excessive masturbator.

It strikes me as being intrinsically disordered to some extent and a weakness. In my case as a child, it was far an understatement to simply say my pornography use was harming me or a weakness.

But I'm going to assume it doesn't have that effect on most people.

But it keeps the mind for long extended periods of time living in a shallow minded fixation on a typically young attractive ideal external figure of a body that most women aren't going to have, especially once they are past age 35.

It causes complete objectification of the female body. This does not usually lead to sexual assault or an unwanted pregnancy , but it can cause a load of other problems in a relationship.

In most religions, walking according to the flesh is a no to growing spiritually.

Porn can also cause a person to live excessively in a fantasy, which that can lead to mental health problems as well.

Now, to pornography addicts, many are lonely, and something isn't being met. They are trying to fill a void and there is comfort there.

We should not despise the addicts.

Now, people who are making millions off it I wouldn't mind seeing comfortably euthanized.

I've seen how sexual perverts behave and know what it's like when being lied to and manipulation attempts and cons by them. People making millions stirring up sexual perversion in our culture, robbing children of innocence, and creating sick tortured hearts do tremendous damage.

I'm not saying all viewers of pornography are sick.
 

Brickjectivity

Turned to Stone. Now I stretch daily.
Staff member
Premium Member
Some cultures ban all images of people, and that could eventually happen here like so: Suppose that the court precedents eventually firmly establish that the law may not decide what is and isn't porn? (That appears to be the drift of things, so perhaps it will continue to extremes.) Then it will be impossible under free speech to ban porn apart from other images, and the amount of porn will continue to grow. People will no longer differentiate images from porn in their daily lives. Things will come to a head, and all images could get banned. Sounds crazy I know, but people do crazy things.

Sounds strange, but laws can do strange things. All it takes is time and weirdness.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
I know better though.

I'm not saying porn will do to everyone what it did in my case.

I think very rarely does it do that.

But what it does is cause addiction. That much is proven.

It works on the same neurotransmitters and chemicals as meth, cocaine, and heroine.

And I've known plenty guys who are obsessed with sex and talk about it all the time. They are not mature, they are not very altruistic, not very patient, always need instant gratification, and I simply don't trust a guy that shows signs of being obsessed with sex or potential excessive masturbator.

It strikes me as being intrinsically disordered to some extent and a weakness. In my case as a child, it was far an understatement to simply say my pornography use was harming me or a weakness.

But I'm going to assume it doesn't have that effect on most people.

But it keeps the mind for long extended periods of time living in a shallow minded fixation on a typically young attractive ideal external figure of a body that most women aren't going to have, especially once they are past age 35.

It causes complete objectification of the female body. This does not usually lead to sexual assault or an unwanted pregnancy , but it can cause a load of other problems in a relationship.

In most religions, walking according to the flesh is a no to growing spiritually.

Porn can also cause a person to live excessively in a fantasy, which that can lead to mental health problems as well.

Now, to pornography addicts, many are lonely, and something isn't being met. They are trying to fill a void and there is comfort there.

We should not despise the addicts.

Now, people who are making millions off it I wouldn't mind seeing comfortably euthanized.

I've seen how sexual perverts behave and know what it's like when being manipulated by them. People making millions stirring up sexual perversion in our culture, robbing children of innocence, and creating sick tortured hearts do tremendous damage.

I'm not saying all viewers of pornography are sick.
Then, in my opinion we should help those who need help rather than demonizing porn and banning it.
The risks for elevated human suffering with an outright ban is too high. We have to be more caring about porn and those in them (women and men alike) and insist things improve legally.
And nothing has been proven. It's even debated whether or not sex addiction is it's own thing or a symptom of a larger issue since it just isn't seen alone and on its own. Being abused and abusing drugs, for example, are very commonlu seen in those regarded as sex addicts, suggesting there may be something further up the line causing the issues that have manifest.
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
If you dont like abuse target abuse, not pornography.

Pornography is not necessarily abusive.

It is just filming natural acts.
My opinion on this topic:

I disagree with this

Pornography is a major business
IMO this business is not Dharmic
Whatever is not Dharmic brings down humanity

This Pornography is not just Adharmic, it's more like major Adharmic to put it mildly:D
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Rarely would it create a serial killer
But pornography usually is an indirect 'killer' and is often used to 'kill', unless you can watch it in a pure state of being a 'witness'

Then it can be a tool to check how far advanced you are in your Spiritual practice. If you remain in a pure state of mind while watching it then no problem watching it (I think)
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Don't you tell me porn doesn't create rapists, pedophiles, weirdos, serial killers, human traffickers, break up of families, cause abortions, fatherless children, people with no self-control, and the entire decay of Civilization. I've experienced it personally.
Some good points here
You're not beating around the bush:cool:
I like that
I confess I get a bit too fanatic about it.
I believe you when you say you were fanatic
Though IMO your OP is not too fanatic
You made a clear point on this issue

I'm not saying a nude woman on the beach or in nature is pornographic or should be banned.
You started the OP very generous and mild;)
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Where are you getting these figures from?

I googled and this came up top of the list;
'The Pink Cross Foundation, an anti-porn organisation, which seems to use this analysis by Rev. Daniel R. Jennings as a reference, says:

...the average life expectancy of a porn performer is only 36.2 years whereas the average life expectancy of an American is 78.6 years.

Is this true?'

And the answer given;
'The analysis by Jennings states:

when the death ages of these porn stars were averaged it was discovered that the average life expectancy of a porn star is only 37.43 years whereas the average life expectancy of an American is 78.1 years.

He has simply calculated the average age at death of those unfortunate 129 persons and presented it as "average life expectancy of people working in the porn industry."

This is an error in statistical sampling. Life expectancy is not the average age at death of a subset of a group that has died. According to the Wikipedia article on the subject,

life expectancy is a statistical measure of the average time an organism is expected to live, based on the year of their birth, their current age and other demographic factors including gender.

Incorrectly calling the average age at death (37 years) the "life expectancy" gives a very misleading and pessimistic picture.

Moreover, the article ignored the lifespan of the large number of persons who might have worked in the porn industry for many or a few years before retiring or moving on to other occupations.

In short, the figures probably show selection bias, as also pointed out in some early comments on the question.'

Source: Is the average life expectancy of a pornographic actor significantly lower than the rest of the population?.
The careers of porn stars are usually rather short. Especially the female talent. Quite a few male stars have careers of over 20 years. Female, after five you are past your prime. But then from what I hear the female talent tends to make much more than the male talent. That's Sexist!!
 

SomeRandom

Still learning to be wise
Staff member
Premium Member
Well, I see a culture full of perverts as bankrupt and decaying within.

Plato basically said the same thing.
Yeah I’m sure Ancient Greece and Rome collapsed because of porn, right?
What did 120 Days of Sodom (written in 1784, by a guy literally responsible for the English definition of Sadism, fun fact) cause France to burn to the ground too?
Incidentally a loose adaptation (Salo) still has quite the reputation among artsy film types.
I guess pretentious film fans are also responsible for such decay, eh?

Sexual perversion does destroy people.
Cite a reputable source that proves this.
If you’d be so kind

It ruins marriages, disrupts unity, causes people to use one another, lose respect for each other, causes abortions, unwanted pregnancies, rape, suicide, mental illness, and sometimes murder!

Hyperbole much? Geez

You better believe pornography readily available to people is causing all those problems.
I don’t. There’s no valid scientific evidence to warrant such an unreasonable claim. Not that I can find anyway.

And no, it wasn't like that in the 30's.
It kind of was though. Flappers, speakeasies, the bloody and gruesome age of the gangster, thanks in large part to Prohibition. Buddy, there was no such time when society at large was ever anything more than a bunch of barely civil jerks revelling in the sense of humour that was full of sex and fart jokes. Never. Maybe hid it better, arguably. But ehh.
Regardless my grandfather basically said all the same crap about the generation below him you’re saying now. It’s a rinse and repeat scenario, basically. Old game, like a said
 

Heyo

Veteran Member
Circumventing the personal opinions and just answering the title question:

No.
Healthy sexuality is part of some religions (Kamasutra, Tantric sex) and you won't change those.
The Abrahamic religions are already body adverse and you don't need those to incentivise to rail against porn, they do that since their foundation (with little effect).
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
But pornography usually is an indirect 'killer' and is often used to 'kill', unless you can watch it in a pure state of being a 'witness'

Then it can be a tool to check how far advanced you are in your Spiritual practice. If you remain in a pure state of mind while watching it then no problem watching it (I think)
I tend to laugh at it, because there is a lot of it that is just really cheesy, lame, and bad.
Christianity isn't "body adverse". :rolleyes:
Theology of the Body - Wikipedia
Thomas Aquinas is so sex and body averse he felt god should have another method for reproduction (and he's one of the most influential figures in shaping contemporary Christianity). And as the story often goes, Adam and Eve were naked until they saw the sin and shame of their nakedness and covered themselves up. I can't tell you how many times I heard that in church.
 

Kooky

Freedom from Sanity
Yea, the most popular religions already thrive on a mandate of controlling women's bodies for the sake of patriarchial norms.
 

PureX

Veteran Member
Porn doesn't make you or anyone else, into anything. But it does exploit any sick desire or fascination we may already be harboring, for it's own profit. And it's purveyors don't care that in doing so it encourages people to wallow in them, and succumb to them, as opposed to abhorring them, and trying to deal with whatever damage is causing them.

We all need to take responsibility for the damage that has been done to us by circumstance, and by our own mistakes. And that can't happen so long as we continue to wallow in the poison these experiences have injected into us.

I heard a guy in an AA meeting (who looked astonishingly like my dad when he was a very young man) say about the trauma of his childhood; "they spoon-fed me sh*t until I got old enough to hold the spoon myself. Then I just kept eating it." That's what the poison of a bad childhood does to us. But at some point we have to accept that now we are feeding that sh*t to ourselves. And that we have to put down that spoon. It's not easy when it's all we've ever known. And it's become our "truth". But it's not our truth, it's just our past, clinging to our leg, and causing us to keep walking around is circles. Repeating the same stupid behaviors over and over and over, even though we know it's destroying us; and denying us the gift of any hope of living a real authentic life.
 
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Saint Frankenstein

Wanderer From Afar
Premium Member
Thomas Aquinas is so sex and body averse he felt god should have another method for reproduction (and he's one of the most influential figures in shaping contemporary Christianity).
And that's just his opinion, ultimately. It's not doctrine. There's lot of different opinions in Christianity. Even in Catholicism, there's plenty of room to disagree with Aquinas and Augustine on various things.
And as the story often goes, Adam and Eve were naked until they saw the sin and shame of their nakedness and covered themselves up. I can't tell you how many times I heard that in church.
They weren't ashamed because there's something particularly shameful about sex or nudity itself. After all, it was not God Who declared the body sinful. It was our brokenness that did that. God said "who told you that you were naked?" to Adam.

"The fathers of the church teach that Adam and Eve, before the fall, were clothed in garments of glory. When they fell into sin, they were ashamed at their nakedness. It is not that they saw for the first time that they were not wearing clothes, it is that they realized the depravity and true nakedness of a human body that is not clothed in God’s glory. This shame drove them to hide when they heard God approaching. Afterward, they were clothed in garments of skin, which represents our present fallen tendencies, or as St. Paul calls it, the flesh."
Not Naked, But Clothed in Glory

So in the story, the problem isn't our nudity. Obviously Adam and Eve weren't wearing clothes beforehand. The problem is loss of unity with God, which threw everything into disarray and corrupted our relationships with ourselves and others.
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Healthy sexuality is part of some religions (Kamasutra, Tantric sex) and you won't change those.
That is the keyword here;)

The Abrahamic religions are already body adverse
How sure are you about that?

In 2000 years 2 billion Christians. You don't get that by watching porn. You need to practice at least 2 billion times:D
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Thomas Aquinas is so sex and body averse he felt god should have another method for reproduction
Haha, I never heard that.

God did not tell him he had to do reproduce, or did God tell him that? Similarly, if I don't like it, I just don't eat it ... leave it for others to eat

and he's one of the most influential figures in shaping contemporary Christianity

I can't tell you how many times I heard that in church.
They did not just speak about it. From 1910 till now Christianity grew from 600 million to 2000 million. That takes a lot of hard work so to speak
In the High Middle Ages, between the years 1000 and 1300, the population of Europe roughly doubled.
That was in the time this Thomas Aquinas was living. Maybe he was body and sex averse, but definitely not the others:D.
Very hard work, esp. considering the fact that many children died
 
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