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Buying God

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
The first time I heard of "charging to practice a religion" was when I went to a Santera and she was telling me a bit about the Lukumi faith. You pay for the animals, the clothing, sacred jewelry statues, and statues, etc. People pay over $1,000 towards being a Santera/o and it is a life long devotion. Nothing overnight.

Nichiren Buddhism, the same thing. Except for the sacrament was I think $20.00, the Butsadan a little more, and the candles, flowers, etc. Less than a thousand.

All the people I spoke with said something like this, "how do you expect everything to be paid for. Money has to be given to do what we do" type of thing.

Fare enough.

In a business, maybe a service exchange, and things like that, I'd expect money for service...

but for "god"???

I told one Catholic who asked why I didn't give tithes, and I told her "that's like paying Jesus to save me."

I know the realistic side of needing money for objects; and, on the religious side, how does money fit in to your spiritual belief besides just getting the items you need for practice?

Is your religion or practice based on the money that goes into the sacraments (things held sacred) since without the money, you wouldn't have the objects of worship?
I always wanted to ask this. When I gave my $20 to get the Gohonzon and Gongyo book, I felt I was giving up the core of my practice by the exchange of money. (I was paying to be a Bodhisattva). On top of that, when Nichiren Shonin was imprisoned, people gave him food, clothing, etc not money.

I know the practical side of it; but, how does the money play in when needing it for religious or spiritual purposes?​
 
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Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
I can't see anyone really viewing it as buying God. I think most people feel they're supporting the religion, and other people involved rather than adding to their personal relationship with God.

I have my suspicions how it all started though. In Hinduism's case the priests were starving, quite literally, so a sad necessity, because the people weren't chipping in, was to charge fees. This probably came about as the transition from a feudal society to a social society happened. In the old days, the kings supported the temples and the priests. When that social system collapsed the people continued not paying.

But these are just conjectures.

On a personal note, I love giving to my faith, but certainly its not viewed as making a closer connection to God.
 
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allfoak

Alchemist
Money is necessary.
We pay for all sorts of things and think nothing of it.
When i can't get to the local spring, i pay for my water.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
I can't see anyone really viewing it as buying God. I think most people feel they're supporting the religion, and other people involved rather than adding to their personal relationship with God.

I have my suspicions how it all started though. In Hinduism's case the priests were starving, quite literally, so a sad necessity, because the people weren't chipping in, was to charge fees. This probably came about as the transition from a feudal society to a social society happened. In the old days, the kings supported the temples and the priests. When that social system collapsed the people continued not paying.

But these are just conjectures.

On a personal note, I love giving to my faith, but certainly its not viewed as making a closer connection to God.

Wow. Yeah. I live near a Buddhist monastery and the monks come to town and residents in the area give them food and drink. A lot of what they have are from donations. With the Church, I never had that issue. It was more of a choice rather than obligation. Nichiren Buddhism, SGI, though, they count how many numbers they get each year in conversion and a month specific for donations to the organization and their sensai. They look down on you when you don't donate something.

My friend also says it has a bit to do with American culture. It's not that religious Americans want to get things for free. A lot of us work. It's more when we think of something sacred, it is free of material things that (in some minds) cause people to sin or things like that. Don't mix oil with water.

Do you feel that's mostly what it is charity and donations? The money is not "part of the religion" itself? Money as a sacrament?
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
Do you feel that's mostly what it is charity and donations? The money is not "part of the religion" itself? Money as a sacrament?

I don't think I understand what you're trying to ask here. In Hinduism sacraments are things like incense, food, flame, etc. I would never offer money as part of a puja, but I'd use it to purchase sacraments, yes, and I give it to building funds, or to pay for services.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
On a personal note, I love giving to my faith, but certainly its not viewed as making a closer connection to God.

I just missed that after my post. I'm hoping a lot of believers see it that way. With Catholicism, I kind of got what how you view it. With Buddhism, it was completely different.
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
I just missed that after my post. I'm hoping a lot of believers see it that way. With Catholicism, I kind of got what how you view it. With Buddhism, it was completely different.

I know very little about Buddhism, but it could just be that specific monastery or sect. I've never taken that kindly to beggars in that way. Perhaps they've yet to establish a large lay membership.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
I don't think I understand what you're trying to ask here. In Hinduism sacraments are things like incense, food, flame, etc. I would never offer money as part of a puja, but I'd use it to purchase sacraments, yes, and I give it to building funds, or to pay for services.

Yeah. That's what I mean: "offer money as a part of puja" instead of just for practical things needed for worship. I was wondering if people gave money as part of the core of their practice. I know that the Eucharist, for example, isn't free; but, priest don't charge at the door when you go to Mass.

I don't know about other faiths, though other than Catholicism and Nichiren Buddhism. What I learned from the Santera floored me, though. I never heard of my saying, "I can't go into the faith because I can't afford it." That sounds weird to my ears.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
I know very little about Buddhism, but it could just be that specific monastery or sect. I've never taken that kindly to beggars in that way. Perhaps they've yet to establish a large lay membership.

Probably. I was planning to go there since they have mini retreats. It's up in the wooded mountains in the middle of nowhere. While there, if on a full, new, and I think quarter (not sure) moon, if one was ready they can take the vows (my mind is slipping on the word) to be a Buddhist.
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
Yeah. That's what I mean: "offer money as a part of puja" instead of just for practical things needed for worship. I was wondering if people gave money as part of the core of their practice. I know that the Eucharist, for example, isn't free; but, priest don't charge at the door when you go to Mass.

That does happen, as you can see on this picture, but its generally because there was no fruit or flowers handy, or the devotees were jut too lazy, or they saw other money sitting there.

1679962071_16e1c23c07_z.jpg
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
That does happen, as you can see on this picture, but its generally because there was no fruit or flowers handy, or the devotees were jut too lazy, or they saw other money sitting there.

1679962071_16e1c23c07_z.jpg

That make sense. I remember one person tell me when we were talking about offerings. He says, "many people give fruits and water for offerings [because of survival/history] but you Americans. Better sacrifice for you is money since you seem to want a lot of it."

Very rough interpretation from years back.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Money is a safe bet all around. The temple I'm affiliated with here has a bunch of stuff we don't need.

For some reason it feels different when giving it as an offering... say at the Church, there are statues of many saints. A lot of us would throw nickles and dimes like the picture you showed me. In my practice, I do something similar but for my grandmother. However, I got a raw impression about the use of money with spiritual things via prior experiences.

It's weird, though. We value people for their personal gain but when a business makes "too much" we belittle them as an greedy organization. That perspective has a lot of influence on how Americans see money and spirituality. (Reflecting)
 

psychoslice

Veteran Member
Tithing is just a way of making people feel guilty if they don't pay, a church should just be a simple meeting place and that's it.
 

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
That does happen, as you can see on this picture, but its generally because there was no fruit or flowers handy, or the devotees were jut too lazy, or they saw other money sitting there.
The money left in front of the idol is for upkeep of the temple or the priest. Sometimes it would be a request to God to help them pass a difficult stretch in Himalayas like at the base of a pass where people leave some money to propitiate God. No traveller or priest would touch the money. It just rusts away. Sometimes it is just giving away of some of their possessions when people drop money in a holy lake (environmentally not very wise). Many takes.

Kamrunag (1 & 2), Parashar Lake (Mandi, Himachal Pradesh)
kamrunag-5455fefbe8f6b_exlst.jpg
Kamru-Nag-Lake-bhaaratdarshan-3.jpg
parashar-lake.jpg
 
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