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Born From Above

Discussion in 'Sacred Texts' started by Eyes to See, Sep 24, 2020.

  1. Eyes to See

    Eyes to See Active Member

    Apr 10, 2020
    Was looking for a forum to place this subject. Didn't want to put it in religious debates because what is going to be discussed is of a personal nature beyond debatable. It's like in the The Interview Place forum there is a thread by Secret Chief about autism.

    This subject has to do with being "born again" or "born from above." You often hear the expression. Recently I read one of the forum members say that for a time they were "born again" as a Christian and then converted to another religion and no longer considers themselves "born again".

    Now this is in no way to single out someone saying something like that. But it is to give a personal experience of what it is.

    Was debating whether to write a subject about the matter at all, but thought that it may be helpful and enlightening to some who are searching for the truth. It is in no way meant to be bragging, or considering someone better or higher than anyone else. That is far far from the truth. In God's eyes we all fall short, and are all sinners. It is only by means of undeserved kindness, indeed undeserved kindness upon undeserved kindness that we have hope.-John 1:16.

    Jesus first explained the hope of being "born again" when talking to Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews. Nicodemus was a Pharisee, and part of the Sanhedrin, the Jewish high court. And was also a secret believer of Jesus Christ, but was fearful to express it openly.

    Nicodemus reveals that the Jewish religious leaders knew Jesus was sent from God when he says:

    "Rabbi, we know that you have come from God as a teacher, for no one can perform these signs that you perform unless God is with him.”-John 3:2.

    Unlike others of the Jewish leaders, he was not envious of, or plotting to murder the son of God because of the powerful works he was performing, rather he put faith in him and asked some questions of him.

    This is where the discussion of being born again is revealed. Jesus tells Nicodemus:

    Most truly I say to you, unless anyone is born again, he cannot see the Kingdom of God.”-John 3:3.

    Nicodemus does not understand what Jesus is telling him. It is a new thought. Nicodemus thus replies:

    "“How can a man be born when he is old? He cannot enter into the womb of his mother a second time and be born, can he?”-John 3:4.

    So he does not understand what Jesus is telling him. Jesus replies:

    Most truly I say to you, unless anyone is born from water and spirit, he cannot enter into the Kingdom of God. What has been born from the flesh is flesh, and what has been born from the spirit is spirit."-Johhn 3:5, 6.

    What was Jesus stating? It was perplexing to Nicodemus for he says:

    How can these things be?”  Jesus replied: “Are you a teacher of Israel and yet do not know these things? Most truly I say to you, what we know we speak, and what we have seen we bear witness to, but you do not receive the witness we give.  If I have told you earthly things and you still do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things?"-John 3:9-12.

    The earthly things were those pertaining to the law and were going to be fulfilled in the Christ. The heavenly things? Will these were sacred secrets safely hidden away in the Christ and only revealed by him. This heavenly thing had to do with the calling and choosing to go to heaven. That this was to happen he states:

    "Moreover, no man has ascended into heaven but the one who descended from heaven, the Son of man.  And just as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so the Son of man must be lifted up,  so that everyone believing in him may have everlasting life.-John 3:13-15.

    He says that no one has gone to heaven accept the one that descended, the son of man, Jesus Christ. And that just as the copper serpent was lifted up by Moses int he wilderness, and all those who were bitten by the serpents could look on it and live, so the son of man would be lifted up, on the torture state, be put to death for humankind's sins, and that everyone looking toward the torture stake in faith would receive everlasting life.

    Many people today are taught that when they believe in Jesus they are "born again." But is that true? What does it really mean?

    Jesus was not stating that everyone believing in him would be born again. He simply was stating that to enter into heaven, into God's kingdom, one needed to be born again.

    What does it involve? Being "born again" or "born from above?"

    God's kingdom in heaven is a real place with real people. Jesus is the king of that heavenly government. No sinner can enter into heaven. One has to be a "son of God" to gain entrance.

    It can be likened to a city that has a college that only citizens of the city can attend. A foreigner to the city has no right to enter and cannot gain admittance. But a man of the city adopts a son from outside and the son gains the rights of a citizen and now gains the right to entrance.

    That is what is meant here. Not that everyone is "born again" or called and chosen, but that in order to gain entrance into heaven one needs to be adopted as a spirit son of God, thus "born again" with holy spirit.

    Jesus was "born again" when he was baptized in water and holy spirit descended upon him in 29 C. E. in the form of a dove. Thus he gained the right to renter heaven at the end of his earthly course. Thusly he could say:

    "Moreover, no man has ascended into heaven but the one who descended from heaven, the Son of man."-John 3:13.

    Jesus was the first among many to be adopted from among mankind. That is why we are told that there are many sons:

    "For it was fitting that the one for whom and through whom all things exist, in bringing many sons to glory, should make the Chief Agent of their salvation perfect through sufferings."-Hebrews 2:10.

    Remember the scripture put into parenthesis at the beginning of this post John 1:16 about God's undeserved kindness upon undeserved kindness respecting the calling? John says of these:

    "However, to all who did receive him, he gave authority to become God’s children, because they were exercising faith in his name."-John 1:12.

    Even the Hebrew scriptures foretells the calling and choosing. It says:

    "And in the place where it was said to them, ‘You are not my people,’ it will be said to them, ‘The sons of the living God.'"-Hosea 1:10

    Do you see what this means? A people who were once not God's people will be called upon by Jehovah's name and it will be said of them they are "the sons of the living God?"

    These ones dedicate their lives to Jehovah after learning about his purposes and his will, they are glorified in learning about Jehovah and his son Jesus Christ, and then repent, delicate themselves to God and are baptized in water. Afterward if God so chooses he baptizes them with holy spirit, this is being "born again." It is an adoption as a son of God. As such these children, although sinners are declared righteous, and attain admittance into the heavenly realm as citizens of heaven, adopted sons of God, brothers of Christ Jesus, and heirs of the promises and covenants.

    Those who are called to heaven are to rule as kings and priests and are given said hope.

    In vision Daniel the prophet himself sees these saints, or holy ones ruling with Jesus Christ known as the "son of man."

    Notice that Daniel tells us that this heavenly spirit will become human, and when he returns to heaven he will thus rightly have the title "son of man." To him are given a kingdom and a rulership that will never end. This person in prophecy is none other than Jesus Christ:

    I kept watching in the visions of the night, and look! with the clouds of the heavens, someone like a son of man was coming; and he gained access to the Ancient of Days, and they brought him up close before that One. 14 And to him there were given rulership, honor, and a kingdom, that the peoples, nations, and language groups should all serve him. His rulership is an everlasting rulership that will not pass away, and his kingdom will not be destroyed."-Daniel 7:13, 14.

    Jesus will not rule alone. The same vision tells us:

    "But the holy ones of the Supreme One will receive the kingdom, and they will possess the kingdom forever, yes, forever and ever.’"-Daniel 7:18.

    How is one born again? God's spirit bears witness with our spirit that we are God's children. We are already baptized servants of God in water. Then when and if he choses too he sends his holy spirit in a unique way and calls us to heaven.

    He changes our hope from one that we may have had when we first served him to live on earth forever in happiness. He plants a seed, and there is a quickening and a new birth happens inside the person, and the hope is changed from that of living on earth to that of being adopted as God's children, both men and women, who have such a hope and such an experience.

    When such happened and there was a struggle to understand such a wonderful happening, many times in prayer I would say, why me? Why me? I am not worthy there are so many better than me. God's spirit said:

    "I will show mercy to whomever I will show mercy, and I will show compassion to whomever I will show compassion."-Romans 9:15.

    When I continued to refuse the calling of the spirit I was reprimanded a second time and was told:

    "You will therefore say to me: “Why does he still find fault? For who has withstood his will?” But who are you, O man, to be answering back to God? Does the thing molded say to its molder: “Why did you make me this way?”-Romans 9:19-20.

    It was a humbling experience I kept answering back and saying no...it cannot be. I have been taught otherwise and I am not worthy. But then it was revealed:

    "What, then, if God had the will to demonstrate his wrath and to make his power known, and he tolerated with much patience vessels of wrath made fit for destruction? And if this was done to make known the riches of his glory on vessels of mercy, which he prepared beforehand for glory, namely, us, whom he called not only from among Jews but also from among nations, what of it? It is as he says also in Ho·seʹa: “Those not my people I will call ‘my people,’ and her who was not loved, ‘beloved’; and in the place where it was said to them, ‘You are not my people,’ there they will be called ‘sons of the living God.’”-Romans 9:22-26.
    #1 Eyes to See, Sep 24, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2020
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  2. Eyes to See

    Eyes to See Active Member

    Apr 10, 2020
    And eyes are opened:

    "He has enlightened the eyes of your heart, so that you may know to what hope he called you, what glorious riches he holds as an inheritance for the holy ones,  and how surpassing the greatness of his power is toward us believers. It is according to the operation of the mightiness of his strength, which he exercised toward Christ when he raised him up from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places."-Ephesians 1:18-20.

    So the calling and the choosing is done by the most powerful force operative, that of God's holy spirit. It is an adoption from among Adam's children, based faith in the ransom sacrifice of Jesus Christ, to becomes God's adoptive children, heirs with the promises. To die and be raised in spirit bodies in the likeness of the Christ and God, to live in heaven always by Jehovah's side, with Jesus Christ.

    This is the hope of those who are "born again." Not all who are Christian are born again. And you do not need to be born again to gain salvation. From many millions alive today are Christians and are not called, and have not been baptized by the holy spirit. And many untold millions more will be raise to life in God's kingdom rule over the earth, in paradise.

    Many who say they are "born again" do not know what it means, and have not truly been called, and have never had witness born with them through the spirit that they are God's children. And do not have the hope to rule with Christ as kings in his kingdom just as he promised us:

    However, you are the ones who have stuck with me in my trials;  and I make a covenant with you, just as my Father has made a covenant with me, for a kingdom,  so that you may eat and drink at my table in my Kingdom, and sit on thrones to judge the 12 tribes of Israel."-Luke 22:28-30.
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  3. lostwanderingsoul

    lostwanderingsoul Well-Known Member

    Jan 17, 2015
    That which is born of spirit IS spirit. Are you spirit? People will be born again when Jesus returns and raises them from their graves. Jesus was called the firstborn from the dead. Others will follow him and be born from the dead at their rising from their graves. NO ONE is "born again" at this time. It is something that will happen at Christ's return.
  4. MNoBody

    MNoBody Well-Known Member

    Mar 23, 2020
    Life changing epiphanies, revelations, insights, tend to make a new man out of people when it happens to them, transformative, they are like, born-again, it is as easy as changing your mind.
    perspective is the key to get the right slant on things, the right angle.
  5. rational experiences

    rational experiences Well-Known Member

    Jan 2, 2020
    Science of God as a human owned living thesis talking about thesis only.

    You are natural first, origin to owning your own life form, a human and can think.

    What you think is your owned choice.

    Why science invented false idealism the false prophet his own self, I can tell you his idea from recorded atmospheric AI memories. Said he wanted to personally go back as a spirit form into the eternal. Knowing that water/daylight held him converted trapped in human life. Knew.

    Today looking back at the first group of agreed brothers in science you could quantify their reasoning as totally irrational. Another reason is that the thesis involved the Sun conversion attack of natural stone mass held Immaculate gas fusion, and Earth in male memories quote in AI it was fused crystalline mass.

    How above ground highest mass melted, flowed into opened sink holes...surrounded the metal radiation core, was sealed by the flood of water that went inside of Earth, volcanic eruptions sealed off.

    A very different origin Earth where science began as compared to the body mass where volcanic radiating heat arose up close to the seal of the stone.

    Science therefore broke the volcanic seal originally and destroyed life on Earth, as a known science/temple pyramid history.

    Flooding of the Earth to save the Earth is water from above. The immaculate a water cooled gas body, was heated by ground radiation heated release, so historically the saving of life comes from above. Rain and a lot of rain.

    The ancients said it rained for 40 days and 40 nights in the first Egyptian science history and the flood had to enter massive underground sink holes first.

    Therefore science says, the Bible flood is not real, when it was. For you have to include what changes to the Earth mass body was caused.

    If you look at the cities sunk beneath the sea, and the sea arises and also disappears on some continents, then it is obvious that water mass also goes inside of the Earth to seal off the volcanic seal deep underground also. Why the flood atop of the Earth owns all of its water losses elsewhere.

    The human owned science told stories are human written for humans on behalf of humans. If you quote born from above, then you would state, the release of water to the ground is where life came from, above us.

    Yet the storyteller already owns their whole natural life. So when you make that quote, you would be saying, where the microbes came from as first life. For we neve existed in first life in water.

    If you ask natural human consciousness where did you come from? And they quote 2 human parents and a little cell ovary. Then little cell is the placement where your thoughts should be today. If you quote a microbe, as that little cell you would be lying, as even the bible information says the 2 parents as humans owned human life continuance.