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Featured Blasphemy

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Wu Wei, Mar 3, 2021.

  1. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    No i didn't
     
  2. stvdv

    stvdv Veteran Member

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    We have the right to follow Dharma; IF we see something which is Adharmic THEN we should do something about it

    We can not always oblige, but we can speak obligingly; no need to offend someone's belief system or lack thereof
    We should not criticize what someone feels/believes. But the moment he start acting/speaking Adharmic then we can criticize his Adharmic actions
     
  3. sun rise

    sun rise "This is the Hour of God"
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    It's a dumb stunt.

    Personally my answer is yes unless their sensibilities impinge on my rights. Example: a cab driver won't take a passenger who has liquor. A woman wants to have a driver's license but not show her face.

    There's a big difference between freedom to do something and wisdom to refrain. Things are legal to do but people who do them are just illustrating their immaturity.

    This case is also the same conceptually as the Taliban murdering people they consider to be blasphemers. The penalty is different but the psychology is the same.

    It also illustrates that making this a crime ignores the Sermon on the Mount's statement about turning the other cheek.
     
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  4. icehorse

    icehorse Veteran Member
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    offended is one thing - blasphemy laws is quite another.

    and -btw - your attitude about transgender folk is also quite telling.
     
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  5. icehorse

    icehorse Veteran Member
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    If I'm hearing you correctly, you're saying that it can be okay to respond to a verbal criticism with violence??
     
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  6. SomeRandom

    SomeRandom Still learning to be wise
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    I don’t recall France having blasphemy laws on its books.
    Whilst I wholeheartedly agree that one should be free to blaspheme. To do so in a country that has the laws prohibiting blasphemy?
    I mean you don’t get to cry foul when you face consequences over that. As much as I dislike such laws. Though I would lend my support in overturning such laws. And indeed my support is ultimately behind the artist.
     
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  7. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein Caritas Christi Urget Nos
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    It's not a stunt. He's in an acclaimed black metal band that is very Satanic and occult in its imagery. That's part of his spiritual expression. My user title and profile post are actually lyrics from Behemoth, his band. The Polish government has been after him before for his beliefs. They have a grudge against him.
     
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  8. lewisnotmiller

    lewisnotmiller Grand Hat
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    It's the law. Poland is well-known for having some religiously inspired laws, including around blasphemy and abortion (note on that last : it goes far beyond what other Catholic countries commonly legislate against in Europe).

    It sounds like you're loathe to take a position on whether such a law (on blasphemy) is 'good' or 'bad'. That's fair enough, but it was one of the direct propositions in the OP.
    For me, blasphemy laws are bad. They commonly are applied unevenly, and used to quell free speech, as well as 'hate speech'.
    Instances of incitement to violence (for example) are already covered by other laws. There does not need to be special religious laws.
     
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  9. lewisnotmiller

    lewisnotmiller Grand Hat
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    No one has the right to retaliate 'in any way they see fit'. That is an odd assertion.
     
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  10. Earthtank

    Earthtank Active Member

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    Thanks for your reply. While I am saying they 'in any way they see fit' this does not mean i am saying they are free of the consequences on how they retaliate, if that retaliation is against the law then, they should dealt with accordingly.

    For example, if my choice of offending you is verbal by cursing at your mom and sister, if you chose to retaliate by verbal abuse in return, that's your right and choice, if you chose to punch me in return, that's your right and choice, if you chose to run me over with your car, that's your right and choice however, if any of your 3 choices have legal repercussions you still have to deal with them. Just because I think something is your right or choice, does not mean you are right and free from consequence of that choice.
     
  11. Earthtank

    Earthtank Active Member

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    So if you were in charge or a lawmaker, what would you do if you were in Poland? Carry out the law? change/repeal it? What would you tell all the people that got offended this act? Is it better to at least have a law in place or let the people deal with it on their own?

    I personally do not have a perfect answer but, simply saying something is bad because you don't like it is not a solution either. I prefer to think about how my words (or hypothetical actions) would have a real world effect rather than, just saying something is good or bad based off my personal preference

    This is already widely done in the US lol and not even against criminals, this is being done against comedians and actors by cancel culture. Trust me, the least of your fear are the religious people when it comes to freedom of speech, its the political left that's carrying this out. This is how i see the religious people vs the political left. When religion gets offended the followers demand for form of "punishment", take this Poland example. When the left get offended, they want you canceled, fired, humiliated and to never earn a living again. Simply go through some of the most recent "twitter drama" by the left when they get offended. Freedom of speech isn't at risk from the religious people, its the political left. While i know many won't like what i am saying but, be objective and look at the world today. With all that said, i am not for any religion nor religious, i try to be as objective as i can when looking at issues.
     
  12. Earthtank

    Earthtank Active Member

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    see reply #31
     
  13. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    Blasphemy laws are an immoral, and in some countries illegal, attempt to make offense illegal. Arguably Poland's actions were actually illegal in this case.
     
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  14. Earthtank

    Earthtank Active Member

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    As an anti-theist that is your opinion but, not the opinion of all the Christians that took offense to what happened in Poland. Outside if your anti-theist stance, is there any good logical and rational reason why Blasphemy law shouldn't be considered and take just as serious as other offensive laws? Before answering, I ask that you think of the real world ramifications your words/action would actually have instead of just being an anti-theist.
     
  15. Earthtank

    Earthtank Active Member

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    You can say what you want and take any stance you wish however, it seems in Poland this person broke the law.

    'Adam Darski, was charged under Poland’s blasphemy laws for offending religious sentiment with the photo.'

    And since when was morality the standard for law? As I have stated before, i am not taking sides here, I am simply looking at the law and the actions, that's its. If the Polish people disagree with the law they should try and change it.
     
  16. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    Blasphemy laws, such as the one in Poland, appear to be illegal for them since they are members of the UN.
     
  17. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    Many laws are based upon morals. Why do you think that it is illegal to murder? To steal? Please don't conflate rational morality with religious morality.
     
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  18. Evangelicalhumanist

    Evangelicalhumanist "Truth" isn't a thing...
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    That covers it all brilliantly!

    Here's the thing with "blasphemy." If I can be charged -- and convicted -- of blasphemy, anywhere in the world, and concerning any religion in the world, whether I believe it or I do not, requires the court to accept that the belief being supposedly blasphemed is true, and my disbelief false.

    I would like everyone, of every religion, to consider this: if you are willing to convict a visitor to your country, or even a non-believing resident of your country, of blasphemy, then you had better be prepared to accept your fate when you express your own religious beliefs in another country. Thus, to Pakistanis who will declare a statement against Mohammed being God's last and best Prophet as blasphemy, should really be prepared, when in a nation of mostly Christians declaring that he is, to be themselves guilty of blasphemy.

    The reason, by the way, that some of these countries don't worry about that is because they are perfectly well aware that more civilized nations will actually let them get away with what they will not let those civilized people get away with in their country.

    Just another of the 12 trillion known religious hypocricies.
     
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  19. Earthtank

    Earthtank Active Member

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    The same UN that has done nothing to the illegal Israeli occupation and daily killings of innocent women and children? The same UN that has done nothing to Saudi for killing of the journalists and the treatment of their people? The same UN that has done nothing to China for their treatment of the Uighur Muslims and throwing them in concentration camps? The UN (which is nothing more than a joke imo) seems to have a lot to worry about before getting to Poland
     
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  20. Earthtank

    Earthtank Active Member

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    Are those clearly defined somewhere? I would love to learn and know where the line is drawn and how such a distinction is made and by whom
     
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