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Biblical Law and Civil Law

clirus

Member
Biblical Law and Civil Law

Anytime the Bible is mentioned relative to Civil Law in America, there is an immediate cry from liberals that Civil Law in America was not derived from Biblical Law (Ten Commandments) and Biblical Law should not be used as a bases for Civil Law.

That brings up the question then of what should be used as the bases for Civil Law in America? I personally believe Civil Law was based on the Ten Commandments and can trace a path from God's Law (The Ten Commandments), Christ Law (Bear ye one another's burdens - Love your neighbor as yourself), Catholic Canon Law, English Law and American Civil Law. However, I have not found an direct equivalence between God's Law and American Civil law.

The Bible is many things, including the history of a nation. One could say all parts of the Bible were a "lessons learned" history. However, I believe God provided law to the Jewish to keep them out of trouble, but they in every way tested all of God's law and proved God was right. So whether the Bible is "lessons learned" or God direction, the end result is that the Bible is probably the best reference source of what will or will not work in a society.

A lot of people seem to think that if they have done something for six months and they are not dead, that means it is ok. Smoking is a good example. Most immoral things start out as pleasureful, but end up with addictions, diseases and sorrow. The Bible represents about 4000 years of history relative to what is successful and what happens if the laws are violated by a society.

To me, if Civil Law agrees with God's Law then it is good. If Civil Law does not agree with God's Law, then a great big caution flag should be raised.

Homosexuality is a case study. Whether the Jewish people concluded, or God decreed that homosexuality was wrong can be argued, but the result is the same. Even today, with AIDS, it is obvious homosexuality is not a life style, but a death style. All other major religions have come to the same conclusion about homosexuality. Homosexuality surly represents, "hope against all evidence".

If homosexuality did not affect other people, it might be acceptable, but 50 billion dollars have been spent on AIDS research, without a cure. The life expectancy in Africa has been reduced by AIDS.

Surly the present day evidence confirms the Biblical view of homosexuality.

The judicial system in America is violating the separation of church and state by legalizing pornography, abortion and homosexuality.

No Christian should vote for any person in the democratic party because of the democratic party support of abortion and homosexuality.
 

Green Gaia

Veteran Member
clirus said:
Anytime the Bible is mentioned relative to Civil Law in America, there is an immediate cry from liberals that Civil Law in America was not derived from Biblical Law (Ten Commandments) and Biblical Law should not be used as a bases for Civil Law.
Well, American civil law wasn't based on Biblical law... we've been over this many times on this forum.
That brings up the question then of what should be used as the bases for Civil Law in America? I personally believe Civil Law was based on the Ten Commandments and can trace a path from God's Law (The Ten Commandments), Christ Law (Bear ye one another's burdens - Love your neighbor as yourself), Catholic Canon Law, English Law and American Civil Law.
Live by whatever laws you choose. But Christians cannot force their religion's laws (and therefore their religion) on society as a whole.
So whether the Bible is "lessons learned" or God direction, the end result is that the Bible is probably the best reference source of what will or will not work in a society.
So do you kill your children when they disobey? Because the Bible tells you to....
A lot of people seem to think that if they have done something for six months and they are not dead, that means it is ok.
Is this a rule somewhere? Who stated this?
The Bible represents about 4000 years of history relative to what is successful and what happens if the laws are violated by a society.
So you support slavery? Because the Bible sure does...
To me, if Civil Law agrees with God's Law then it is good. If Civil Law does not agree with God's Law, then a great big caution flag should be raised.
Well, that's your opinion. But this is not a Christian theocracy, therefore civil laws will based on what is fair and beneficial to ALL of society, not just Christians who get their panties in a wad over every little thing.
Even today, with AIDS, it is obvious homosexuality is not a life style, but a death style.
Wrong, it's neither. Homosexuality is an attraction and love for the same sex.
All other major religions have come to the same conclusion about homosexuality.
No, they haven't. Basically only Christianity, Islam, and some Jews condemn homosexuality.
Homosexuality surly represents, "hope against all evidence".
How's that?
If homosexuality did not affect other people, it might be acceptable, but 50 billion dollars have been spent on AIDS research, without a cure. The life expectancy in Africa has been reduced by AIDS.
You're assuming that only homosexuals have AIDS, and that is a very ignorant view.
Surly the present day evidence confirms the Biblical view of homosexuality.
Hardly.
The judicial system in America is violating the separation of church and state by legalizing pornography, abortion and homosexuality.
How's that?
No Christian should vote for any person in the democratic party because of the democratic party support of abortion and homosexuality.
No Christian should vote for any person in the republican party because the republican party support of hate and intolerance, which clearly goes against Jesus' teachings.
 

clirus

Member
To Maize

Maize quote
Well, American civil law wasn't based on Biblical law... we've been over this many times on this forum.

Reply
I am new here, maybe you could summarize the key points of the proof that American civil law wasn't based on Biblical law.
 

clirus

Member
To painted wolf

Can't say I agree the reference represents proof that American civil law wasn't based on Biblical law. One could always argue that Hammurabi was based on Jewish Law. Got anything else?

However, I did like Number 5
5
If a judge try a case, reach a decision, and present his judgment in writing; if later error shall appear in his decision, and it be through his own fault, then he shall pay twelve times the fine set by him in the case, and he shall be publicly removed from the judge's bench, and
 

Mister Emu

Emu Extraordinaire
Staff member
Premium Member
They were posted at all roads leading into and out of the kingdom.

They had all 282 codes posted on the roads? Must have had some big signs.
 

painted wolf

Grey Muzzle
yup... written on large pillers or stelae(sp)...

clirus- it may be, but as there is no record of jewish law pre-dating the code of Hamurabi then the evidence thus stands for Hanurabi being older.

wa:do
 

clirus

Member
To painted wolf

painted wolf quote
clirus- it may be, but as there is no record of jewish law pre-dating the code of Hamurabi then the evidence thus stands for Hanurabi being older.

Reply
Which law would you rather follow, the laws of a failed nation or the laws of a surviving nation?

I am still waiting for those key points of the proof that American civil law wasn't based on Biblical law.
 

Rex

Founder
clirus said:
I am still waiting for those key points of the proof that American civil law wasn't based on Biblical law.
I think he inferred that when he talked about Hammurabi Code which predated the bible which influenced the bible..
 

Mister Emu

Emu Extraordinaire
Staff member
Premium Member
I am still waiting for those key points of the proof that American civil law wasn't based on Biblical law.

There aren't any, the colonies were started by other christians tired of the Church of England's oppression. Much of the country's ideals as a whole are based on christian ones, the laws were based upon England's as that is where the colonies originated. England's laws were most likely based on Roman laws, which by the time the legoinnaires left was a christian nation, which in turns leads to biblical law.
 

Mister Emu

Emu Extraordinaire
Staff member
Premium Member
I think he inferred that when he talked about Hammurabi Code which predated the bible which influenced the bible..

I believe that this is not so, as before Moses came down from the mountain the Jews were practicing pretty much lawlessness, now whether or not the Ten Commandments were divine or merely conceived of Moses's mind is a theological debate, and if you see my religion you can guess what I believe :)
 

Pah

Uber all member
clirus said:
To Maize

Maize quote
Well, American civil law wasn't based on Biblical law... we've been over this many times on this forum.

Reply
I am new here, maybe you could summarize the key points of the proof that American civil law wasn't based on Biblical law.

I would suggest the thread U.S.A - A Nation Founded on Christian Faith in the Political Issues forum where the proof is conclusive.

-pah-
 

painted wolf

Grey Muzzle
if the bible is right and Moses left during the rein of one of the Ramses Pharos then he left Egypt post-Hamurabi... Thus the Egyption laws were also written long before the Biblical laws...

unless the bible is wrong about when Moses made his journey....

Thus Hamurabi is pre-biblical and more than likely influinced Moses as did the laws of Egypt...

as for keeping the laws of failed states... Isrial is a modern nation... re-founded on the ruins of a past civilization... Modern Jewish culture is not the same as that of their ancestors although thier faith is.

wa:do
 

true blood

Active Member
Biblical Law was only given to the children of Israel. It ended when Israel's Messiah, Jesus Christ, was personally present on earth. He fullfilled all the law and when he fullfilled it he said IT is finished. Please, someone explain then what is christian law? It's a totally made-up term.
 
true blood said:
Biblical Law was only given to the children of Israel. It ended when Israel's Messiah, Jesus Christ, was personally present on earth. He fullfilled all the law and when he fullfilled it he said IT is finished. Please, someone explain then what is christian law? It's a totally made-up term.

Um, what "law" did he fulfill? That is to say that the laws gave to Moses were not fullfilled? Sounds very funny. So what law did he fullfill then?
 

anders

Well-Known Member
clirus said:
Biblical Law and Civil Law
Follow the direction pah pointed out and/or use the search function. I am (sufficiently, I hope) far from the US, but I have been perfectly convinced that the US is a secular state with secular laws.
However, I have not found an direct equivalence between God's Law and American Civil law. ... To me, if Civil Law agrees with God's Law then it is good. If Civil Law does not agree with God's Law, then a great big caution flag should be raised.
Fortunately, for all of you. You are not forced to kill disobedient children, you may eat crayfish and shrimp, you may wear clothes of cotton/polyester blend etc. etc.
the Bible is probably the best reference source of what will or will not work in a society. ... The Bible represents about 4000 years of history relative to what is successful and what happens if the laws are violated by a society.
Could you please point to one successful and happy society in the world which follows the laws of the Bible.
Homosexuality ... Surly the present day evidence confirms the Biblical view of homosexuality.
You are ridiculously misinformed about homosexuality as well as of the Bible's view of it. Read some old threads. There is no condemnation of homosexuality in the Bible; on the contrary, there are a few cases which can be read as referring to such relationships without any negative word at all. Examples are David-Jonathan (who seem to have been married!) and Ruth-Naomi.
No Christian should vote for any person in the democratic party because of the democratic party support of abortion ...
No true Christian can oppose abortions, as abortion-cum-sterilisation is compulsory in Num. 5, if a husband even suspects that his wife = his property is pregnant by another man.
 

DianJo

New Member
We are all aware of those things that are beneficial to society and those things that are not.
We all agree that:
Honoring your mother and father are good and benefits society.
Stealing is not good and hurts society.
Murder is not good and hurts society.
Adultery is not good and hurts society.
Coveting others possessions is not good and hurts society.
Worshipping other gods, i.e., money - in the context of worshipping money, this is not good and can hurt society in that that's all that becomes important and the good is ignored.

Do these things sound familiar - where did these things that we know in our hearts come from? Without a written law, we KNOW that these things are either good or bad and affect society.
It's called the natural law that God imprinted on our hearts! These "laws" were on our hearts before they were written down. We pulled these things from our hearts and our logic and wrote them down!
 

Melody

Well-Known Member
clirus said:
Biblical Law and Civil Law
The judicial system in America is violating the separation of church and state by legalizing pornography, abortion and homosexuality.


I'm not sure I understand your logic on this. You appear to be arguing the point that if the government makes a law that violates your religious beliefs then they're violating the separation of church and state?? :confused:

It's a *long* stretch from the intent of our founders. Separation of church and state was designed to allow religious freedom and prevent the government from enforcing a state religion on its citizens....not to keep the state from making laws that are opposite of your religious beliefs.
 

Erika24

New Member
To painted wolf

Can't say I agree the reference represents proof that American civil law wasn't based on Biblical law. One could always argue that Hammurabi was based on Jewish Law. Got anything else?

However, I did like Number 5
5
If a judge try a case, reach a decision, and present his judgment in writing; if later error shall appear in his decision, and it be through his own fault, then he shall pay twelve times the fine set by him in the case, and he shall be publicly removed from the judge's bench, and
I fully agree that today's judges should pay the consequences of their mistakes. They would be much more careful in judging.
 

Erika24

New Member
I fully agree that today's judges should pay the consequences of their mistakes. They would be much more careful in judging.
 
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