Biblical Banners Banned But Christian Cheerleaders Challenge Change

[Skwim]

"HOUSTON -- Texas is football country, and in the small town of Kountze, about 85 miles north of Houston, that means many of the roughly 2,000 residents gather at the public high school on Friday nights to watch the show: the coaches, the players and of course the cheerleaders toting their homemade Biblical banners, or “spirit signs.”

“I can do all things through Christ which strengthens! Phil 4:13.”

“If God is for us, who can be against us? Romans 8:31.”

"Coaches preach devotionals before games. We wanted to show our support for our boys," said cheerleader Meagan Tantillo, who started making the religious signs this year, inspired during summer cheer camp.
Sophomore Macy Matthews said she made the signs to "give glory to God" and to encourage the team.

"It's what motivated the boys each week," said Macy, 15, in a local media report. “I didn't understand why it would be a problem."

But cause a problem it did. The school district banned the signs last month; the cheerleaders sued; a judge reinstated the signs; and on Thursday, the matter again came to court. At stake — a day before the Lions’ next varsity home game — was the order protecting the signs.

The uproar started a few weeks ago when someone notified the Madison, Wis.-based Freedom From Religion Foundation. Organization officials complained to the superintendent, who consulted attorneys and the Texas Assn. of School Boards — and banned the signs.

Fifteen cheerleaders -- a dozen from the high school and three from the middle school -- sued the district in county court.

Churches held rallies to support the cheerleaders and their signs. They petitioned the Texas attorney general, who came out in support of the cheerleaders, then Gov. Rick Perry. They launched a Facebook page that as of Thursday had more than 45,000 followers.
source and more
​

So, what ya think. Let 'em stand up and cheer or tell 'em to stuff their banners?

 

[Photonic]

It seems a pretty cut and dried case of tyranny of the majority to me.


As long as the banners have nothing to do with school funding (or the school) though, I don't really have a problem with it.

I also want to make it clear though, if I go in and put up banners displaying my beliefs and how they inspire me, and they take offense. I would now have grounds to sue the crap out of the school.

It's all or nothing people. Take your pick.

 

[Rakhel]

Did you intend to start this thread twice?

 

[Storm]

1) Love love love the thread title. Alliteration ftw!
2) I really don't care enough about football or anything related to it to read the article. So, I'll just ask you: it's not a private school, is it? Presuming the answer is no, the issue is stupid. Just because someone enjoys football is no excuse to preach at them. Everyone has their vices.
3) I'm so passionate and worked up over this that I totally forgot my third point.

 

[Skwim]

Did you intend to start this thread twice?

Nah, one of those mistake things. I was interrupted for a few minutes and forgot where I was in the posting process. Hopefully, the "Staff" will delete the other one.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

"HOUSTON -- Texas is football country, and in the small town of Kountze, about 85 miles north of Houston, that means many of the roughly 2,000 residents gather at the public high school on Friday nights to watch the show: the coaches, the players and of course the cheerleaders toting their homemade Biblical banners, or “spirit signs.”

“I can do all things through Christ which strengthens! Phil 4:13.”

“If God is for us, who can be against us? Romans 8:31.”

"Coaches preach devotionals before games. We wanted to show our support for our boys," said cheerleader Meagan Tantillo, who started making the religious signs this year, inspired during summer cheer camp.
Sophomore Macy Matthews said she made the signs to "give glory to God" and to encourage the team.

"It's what motivated the boys each week," said Macy, 15, in a local media report. “I didn't understand why it would be a problem."

But cause a problem it did. The school district banned the signs last month; the cheerleaders sued; a judge reinstated the signs; and on Thursday, the matter again came to court. At stake — a day before the Lions’ next varsity home game — was the order protecting the signs.

The uproar started a few weeks ago when someone notified the Madison, Wis.-based Freedom From Religion Foundation. Organization officials complained to the superintendent, who consulted attorneys and the Texas Assn. of School Boards — and banned the signs.

Fifteen cheerleaders -- a dozen from the high school and three from the middle school -- sued the district in county court.

Churches held rallies to support the cheerleaders and their signs. They petitioned the Texas attorney general, who came out in support of the cheerleaders, then Gov. Rick Perry. They launched a Facebook page that as of Thursday had more than 45,000 followers.
source and more
​

So, what ya think. Let 'em stand up and cheer or tell 'em to stuff their banners?

The signs are in violation of the Establishment clause, and as such being that they're on government property when displayed, are illegal.

They need to stuff the banners and actually use their cheerleading skills instead of preaching.

 

[Skwim]

The signs are in violation of the Establishment clause, and as such being that they're on government property when displayed, are illegal.

They need to stuff the banners and actually use their cheerleading skills instead of preaching.

I quite agree.

 

[Sunstone]

These cheerleaders are true humanitarians who have obviously dedicated themselves to keeping lawyers rich.

 

[Falvlun]

The signs are in violation of the Establishment clause, and as such being that they're on government property when displayed, are illegal.

They need to stuff the banners and actually use their cheerleading skills instead of preaching.

If they were student-led, and not initiated by school staff or policy, does that still violate the establishment cause? From what I understand, Bibles aren't banned from schools, nor is praying. What's banned is forcing kids to read Bibles or teacher-led prayer, etc. I think these cheerleading banners are more akin to the former rather than the latter.

Personally, if the kids wanted to hold bible verses at the games, and no one was forcing them to do so and kids of other faiths are allowed to hold their signs as well, I don't see an issue with it.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

If they were student-led, and not initiated by school staff or policy, does that still violate the establishment cause? From what I understand, Bibles aren't banned from schools, nor is praying. What's banned is forcing kids to read Bibles or teacher-led prayer, etc. I think these cheerleading banners are more akin to the former rather than the latter.

Personally, if the kids wanted to hold bible verses at the games, and no one was forcing them to do so and kids of other faiths are allowed to hold their signs as well, I don't see an issue with it.

Here's the thing though, Falv. It's at school-sponsored events that are being attended by the general public. Allowing religiously-oriented signs on government property that is being used by the general public can blur the line into what the school officially supports.

You may not have a problem with it yourself, but somebody might, whether that person is on the football team, a spectator, a parent, an official of the game....and any governmental organization shouldn't chance the possibility that they are seen as officially sanctioning one religion over another, or one group of religions over others. That's why the signs are in violation of the Establishment Clause. They are being viewed by a large group of people on government property.

It's the same thing as schools that allow students to elect students into leading a prayer for the student/parent population before a school event. It's not within bounds, and they shouldn't be allowed to lead prayers at a public school event. This is why I think the signs are in violation, and the cheerleaders should actually do their flips, stunts, and "Go Team!" cheering skills than preaching a Biblical message.

 

[Skwim]

If they were student-led, and not initiated by school staff or policy, does that still violate the establishment cause? From what I understand, Bibles aren't banned from schools, nor is praying. What's banned is forcing kids to read Bibles or teacher-led prayer, etc. I think these cheerleading banners are more akin to the former rather than the latter.

Personally, if the kids wanted to hold bible verses at the games, and no one was forcing them to do so and kids of other faiths are allowed to hold their signs as well, I don't see an issue with it.

As I see it, because the cheerleaders are a school sanctioned group it amounts to using the privilages of school powers to advance religion.
As for the forcing issue, because the banners are prominently displayed to others they loose the protection of "a personal act"; being no different than erecting a religious sign on school property in front of the school's main entrance .

 

[Straw Dog]

Sweet alliteration on the title for the thread! Are you trying to make my head explode?

 

[Straw Dog]

Anyway, what would Jesus do? He'd probably take a look at cheerleading and football and think, "What the sheol are these shenanigans?"

 

[Skwim]

Sweet alliteration on the title for the thread! Are you trying to make my head explode?

Not in the least, but thanks for the comment.

 

[Storm]

Here's the thing though, Falv. It's at school-sponsored events that are being attended by the general public. Allowing religiously-oriented signs on government property that is being used by the general public can blur the line into what the school officially supports.

You may not have a problem with it yourself, but somebody might, whether that person is on the football team, a spectator, a parent, an official of the game....and any governmental organization shouldn't chance the possibility that they are seen as officially sanctioning one religion over another, or one group of religions over others. That's why the signs are in violation of the Establishment Clause. They are being viewed by a large group of people on government property.

It's the same thing as schools that allow students to elect students into leading a prayer for the student/parent population before a school event. It's not within bounds, and they shouldn't be allowed to lead prayers at a public school event. This is why I think the signs are in violation, and the cheerleaders should actually do their flips, stunts, and "Go Team!" cheering skills than preaching a Biblical message.

^This.^

 

[tempter]

"HOUSTON -- Texas is football country, and in the small town of Kountze, about 85 miles north of Houston, that means many of the roughly 2,000 residents gather at the public high school on Friday nights to watch the show: the coaches, the players and of course the cheerleaders toting their homemade Biblical banners, or “spirit signs.”

“I can do all things through Christ which strengthens! Phil 4:13.”

“If God is for us, who can be against us? Romans 8:31.”

"Coaches preach devotionals before games. We wanted to show our support for our boys," said cheerleader Meagan Tantillo, who started making the religious signs this year, inspired during summer cheer camp.
Sophomore Macy Matthews said she made the signs to "give glory to God" and to encourage the team.

"It's what motivated the boys each week," said Macy, 15, in a local media report. “I didn't understand why it would be a problem."

But cause a problem it did. The school district banned the signs last month; the cheerleaders sued; a judge reinstated the signs; and on Thursday, the matter again came to court. At stake — a day before the Lions’ next varsity home game — was the order protecting the signs.

The uproar started a few weeks ago when someone notified the Madison, Wis.-based Freedom From Religion Foundation. Organization officials complained to the superintendent, who consulted attorneys and the Texas Assn. of School Boards — and banned the signs.

Fifteen cheerleaders -- a dozen from the high school and three from the middle school -- sued the district in county court.

Churches held rallies to support the cheerleaders and their signs. They petitioned the Texas attorney general, who came out in support of the cheerleaders, then Gov. Rick Perry. They launched a Facebook page that as of Thursday had more than 45,000 followers.
source and more
​

So, what ya think. Let 'em stand up and cheer or tell 'em to stuff their banners?

I read somewhere that the one cheerleader said the signs were made off school property (or something like that) and didn't think it would be an issue. To me, that itself shows they knew there would be controversy - that this might not "be OK". Therefore, the cheerleaders should have contacted school officials prior to ensure this would/wouldn't be a problem (if they didn't).
If it's a public school, and they allow other religions to preach the same way, then it should be "OK".
Personally, I think all public schools should be a place of learning and education - religion and beliefs that aren't based on facts should be held for other areas of life. Unless, of course, churches would allow scientists to teach science Sunday morning.

 

[Storm]

I read somewhere that the one cheerleader said the signs were made off school property (or something like that) and didn't think it would be an issue. To me, that itself shows they knew there would be controversy - that this might not "be OK". Therefore, the cheerleaders should have contacted school officials prior to ensure this would/wouldn't be a problem (if they didn't).
If it's a public school, and they allow other religions to preach the same way, then it should be "OK".
Personally, I think all public schools should be a place of learning and education - religion and beliefs that aren't based on facts should be held for other areas of life. Unless, of course, churches would allow scientists to teach science Sunday morning.

Of course, that arguably rules out football games and cheerleading squads altogether.

 

[tempter]

Of course, that arguably rules out football games and cheerleading squads altogether.

IMO education has taken a backseat to football in the US anyway. As far as I'm concerned, football and cheerleading could disappear for a while and I'd be fine with that.

 

[Storm]

IMO education has taken a backseat to football in the US anyway. As far as I'm concerned, football and cheerleading could disappear for a while and I'd be fine with that.

Dude, check my location. Preaching to the choir.

 

[Photonic]

Dude, check my location. Preaching to the choir.

The sigh really ties together your disappointment that you live there.