Bible and old age solved?

[stvdv]

We read in the Bible about Methuselah being like 1000 years old.

True or Not?

My Master declared that age has to do with breath. So if you control breath and breathe once a minute instead of 15 times then you can immensely extend life. Makes also sense to me, considering age/breath of animals [don't know yet of exceptions, but I'm sure some will be so friendly to provide it]

If true then it's possible. Once I did an breath exercise and did not breath for ca 21 minutes. I was amazed that this is possible even. Not running. Just laying down.

If normal age is 100 years then probably you have to go down to once a minute. I tried out walking and slow breathing and could only manage 4 breath a minute while walking not too fast. If I did this my whole life I could manage like 400 years. But I very much doubt this is possible, takes a lot of control.

So I find it highly unlikely to believe these high age numbers. Also taking into account that in these years the average age was about 33 years or so. And medical care was not of the same standard as nowadays. And plenty of diseases we have got rid of now.

All the above facts make me believe that 1000 years is not a correct fact. Would be cool though

Now how to understand why this error came into existence?

Scenario A):
In the old times they were using month instead of years. Then 1000 month would give ca 80 years. That was very old, remembering the average was 33 years. So that seems to make sense.

Scenario B):
Jesus took fishermen along with him. In Holland we have the saying "fisherman's latin". They tend to exaggerate a lot. I met fisherman who allegedly caught fish being 1 meter, but when going into detail it maybe was 45 cm. Also they have the fisherman joke. They know they should not lie, so they spread their arms wide "this big a fish it was (1,5m)", and in the mean time spread also their hands "meaning 20 cm only.

After all they were all human. And human just have a tendency to exaggerate. So I think that might as well be the case. Kid asking grandfather "how old are you". Oh kid, I am 1000 years old, not kiddin'. And kids are gullible. Grandfather dies, never able to correct this error.

Or just to make the Bible story more special, nice. 1000 years gives some flavor to it [I liked it]

Just a few scenarios that came into my mind this morning. Before I always accepted "Okay, if Bible says so, why not? I can't check it anymore, so why question it?". Also a good viewpoint. Question all weird scenarios is time consuming. But today I had some spare time.

 

[Dawnofhope]

We know that it is exceedingly rare for a human being to live beyond the age of 120 years. I suspect we were simply not designed to live longer and any thoughts that we can somehow or other prolong life to a thousand years is simply wishful thinking.

The book of genesis was probably composed by a variety of unknown authors during the Babylonian period of the Jewish exile. There appears to be much mythology and was unlikely meant to be taken literally.

Edit: Thanks @Jayhawker Soule

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

The book of genesis is composed by a variety of unknown authors during the Babylonian period of the Jewish exiles.

I'm impressed that you've resolved current scholarly debate to the point that you feel competent to instruct us with such certainty.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

We read in the Bible about Methuselah being like 1000 years old.

True or Not?

Not.

 

[Stevicus]

We read in the Bible about Methuselah being like 1000 years old.

True or Not?

My Master declared that age has to do with breath. So if you control breath and breathe once a minute instead of 15 times then you can immensely extend life. Makes also sense to me, considering age/breath of animals [don't know yet of exceptions, but I'm sure some will be so friendly to provide it]

If true then it's possible. Once I did an breath exercise and did not breath for ca 21 minutes. I was amazed that this is possible even. Not running. Just laying down.

If normal age is 100 years then probably you have to go down to once a minute. I tried out walking and slow breathing and could only manage 4 breath a minute while walking not too fast. If I did this my whole life I could manage like 400 years. But I very much doubt this is possible, takes a lot of control.

So I find it highly unlikely to believe these high age numbers. Also taking into account that in these years the average age was about 33 years or so. And medical care was not of the same standard as nowadays. And plenty of diseases we have got rid of now.

All the above facts make me conclude that 1000 years is not a correct fact.

Now how to understand why this error came into existence?

Scenario A):
In the old times they were using month instead of years. Then 1000 month would give ca 80 years. That was very old, remembering the average was 33 years. So that seems to make sense.

Scenario B):
Jesus took fishermen along with him. In Holland we have the saying "fisherman's latin". They tend to exaggerate a lot. I met fisherman who allegedly caught fish being 1 meter, but when going into detail it maybe was 45 cm. Also they have the fisherman joke. They know they should not lie, so they spread their arms wide "this big a fish it was (1,5m)", and in the mean time spread also their hands "meaning 20 cm only.

After all they were all human. And human just have a tendency to exaggerate. So I think that might as well be the case. Kid asking grandfather "how old are you". Oh kid, I am 1000 years old, not kiddin'. And kids are gullible. Grandfather dies, never able to correct this error.

Or just to make the Bible story more special, nice. 1000 years gives some flavor to it [I liked it]

Just a few scenarios that came into my mind this morning. Before I always accepted "Okay, if Bible says so, why not? I can't check it anymore, so why question it?". Also a good viewpoint. Question all weird scenarios is time consuming. But today I had some spare time.

I was reminded of stories about some people in the Caucasus living remarkably long lifespans, and I found this article: https://www.verywellhealth.com/the-legendary-longevity-of-the-abkhasia-people-2224044

Living there in the Caucasus mountains in southern Russia are the Abkhasia, a society of people known for their incredible longevity and lifespans. This relatively small group of people have long had a reputation for extremely long and healthy lives.

In fact, in the 1960s and 1970s, claims were made for lifespans of 150 years, marriages at age 110, and even stories of men fathering children at age 136! The greatest claim, made by the propaganda-obsessed Soviet Union, was that one Abkhasian man named Shirali Muslimov reached a remarkable 168 years old. The Soviets honored him and his longevity with a postage stamp, leaving some to ask, are the stories true?

While the stories were ostensibly exaggerated, it is true that they are very long-lived, on average, with more centenarians than most countries.

But when you said that age has to do with breath, this part got my attention:

Their Exercise Program
The Abkhasia live in the mountains and spend nearly every day going up and down, and up and down in the thin mountain air. This constant activity is said to have kept the older members of the Abkhasia fit without resorting to fitness programs or formal exercising.

But I suppose as medical science gets more advanced, longer lifespans seem inevitable. Perhaps there may even be ways to maintain youth and vigor for longer periods, at least as far as the physical body is concerned. But how would that affect the mind? That's what I sometimes wonder about. My grandfather was quite physically healthy into his 90s, but his memory and other mental faculties were starting to go.

 

[stvdv]

We read in the Bible about Methuselah being like 1000 years old.
True or Not?

Not.

Bummer. I was hoping getting a "Yes true" and you proving me wrong on this one.

I am curious if you have "proof" that 1000 years of age is false

I don't have proof

I was reminded of stories about some people in the Caucasus living remarkably long lifespans, and I found this article: https://www.verywellhealth.com/the-legendary-longevity-of-the-abkhasia-people-2224044



While the stories were ostensibly exaggerated, it is true that they are very long-lived, on average, with more centenarians than most countries.

But when you said that age has to do with breath, this part got my attention:



But I suppose as medical science gets more advanced, longer lifespans seem inevitable. Perhaps there may even be ways to maintain youth and vigor for longer periods, at least as far as the physical body is concerned. But how would that affect the mind? That's what I sometimes wonder about. My grandfather was quite physically healthy into his 90s, but his memory and other mental faculties were starting to go.

Thank you for your nice informative reply:

Science says aging has to do with acid/alkaline balance I once read. So when you have good diet/exersize and live healthy mental faculties normally will be okay I think. Probably mental/physical goes a bit together, unless some major disease happens. Or when very strong physical but emotional big unsolved trauma's then mental can be the bigger problem I guess

Indian scriptures also declare that pranayama is good for health/mind. But should not be done before doing the other 2 steps first.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I am curious if you have "proof" that 1000 years of age is false

Seriously?

No, I have no 'proof' that you would accept. Nor do I have 'proof' that the reigns posted in the Sumerian Kings List are false or that the Munchkins in the Wizard of Oz are false.

 

[stvdv]

Seriously?
No, I have no 'proof' that you would accept. Nor do I have 'proof' that the reigns posted in the Sumerian Kings List are false or that the Munchkins in the Wizard of Oz are false.

Oh that is funny. I did write it, but then thought "If he had proof he would have given it". So I deleted it, but it somehow got stuck in RF I think.
Anyway sad to hear you have no proof. I thought Judaism maybe knows more.

I am very gullible. If you have proof, I might be willing to accept. Mine were also just my own explanations, no proof.

 

[shunyadragon]

I'm impressed that you've resolved current scholarly debate to the point that you feel competent to instruct us with such certainty.

Actually, this is based simply on the evidence available. Some texts of the Bible may date earlier to ~1000 to 600 BCE, but the only evidence we have of early text of this period is the 'silver scroll.' Before this we do not have any evidence of a Hebrew written language, and the evidence we have is Hebrew evolving from Canaanite/Ugarit writing.

I believe there is evidence in the text of sources of the text from oral stories and myths, Ugarit/Canaanite sources in Palatine from Hebrews that remained during the exile, and the Hebrews that returned and these contributed to the final compilation.

Your venomous sarcasm is noted, without presenting and constructive alternate scenario.

What is your view of the origins of these scriptures?

 

[shunyadragon]

It must be realized that much of the Torah and Tanakh evolved from oral myths and legends, which like all ancient oral traditions were of course prone to exaggerations of all sorts, even references to giants.

 

[whirlingmerc]

We read in the Bible about Methuselah being like 1000 years old.

True or Not?

My Master declared that age has to do with breath. So if you control breath and breathe once a minute instead of 15 times then you can immensely extend life. Makes also sense to me, considering age/breath of animals [don't know yet of exceptions, but I'm sure some will be so friendly to provide it]

If true then it's possible. Once I did an breath exercise and did not breath for ca 21 minutes. I was amazed that this is possible even. Not running. Just laying down.

If normal age is 100 years then probably you have to go down to once a minute. I tried out walking and slow breathing and could only manage 4 breath a minute while walking not too fast. If I did this my whole life I could manage like 400 years. But I very much doubt this is possible, takes a lot of control.

So I find it highly unlikely to believe these high age numbers. Also taking into account that in these years the average age was about 33 years or so. And medical care was not of the same standard as nowadays. And plenty of diseases we have got rid of now.

All the above facts make me believe that 1000 years is not a correct fact. Would be cool though

Now how to understand why this error came into existence?

Scenario A):
In the old times they were using month instead of years. Then 1000 month would give ca 80 years. That was very old, remembering the average was 33 years. So that seems to make sense.

Scenario B):
Jesus took fishermen along with him. In Holland we have the saying "fisherman's latin". They tend to exaggerate a lot. I met fisherman who allegedly caught fish being 1 meter, but when going into detail it maybe was 45 cm. Also they have the fisherman joke. They know they should not lie, so they spread their arms wide "this big a fish it was (1,5m)", and in the mean time spread also their hands "meaning 20 cm only.

After all they were all human. And human just have a tendency to exaggerate. So I think that might as well be the case. Kid asking grandfather "how old are you". Oh kid, I am 1000 years old, not kiddin'. And kids are gullible. Grandfather dies, never able to correct this error.

Or just to make the Bible story more special, nice. 1000 years gives some flavor to it [I liked it]

Just a few scenarios that came into my mind this morning. Before I always accepted "Okay, if Bible says so, why not? I can't check it anymore, so why question it?". Also a good viewpoint. Question all weird scenarios is time consuming. But today I had some spare time.

It is not possible with today's DNA and environment doesn't mean it was not originally possible

 

[whirlingmerc]

We read in the Bible about Methuselah being like 1000 years old.

True or Not?

My Master declared that age has to do with breath. So if you control breath and breathe once a minute instead of 15 times then you can immensely extend life. Makes also sense to me, considering age/breath of animals [don't know yet of exceptions, but I'm sure some will be so friendly to provide it]

If true then it's possible. Once I did an breath exercise and did not breath for ca 21 minutes. I was amazed that this is possible even. Not running. Just laying down.

If normal age is 100 years then probably you have to go down to once a minute. I tried out walking and slow breathing and could only manage 4 breath a minute while walking not too fast. If I did this my whole life I could manage like 400 years. But I very much doubt this is possible, takes a lot of control.

So I find it highly unlikely to believe these high age numbers. Also taking into account that in these years the average age was about 33 years or so. And medical care was not of the same standard as nowadays. And plenty of diseases we have got rid of now.

All the above facts make me believe that 1000 years is not a correct fact. Would be cool though

Now how to understand why this error came into existence?



Scenario A):
In the old times they were using month instead of years. Then 1000 month would give ca 80 years. That was very old, remembering the average was 33 years. So that seems to make sense.

Scenario B):
Jesus took fishermen along with him. In Holland we have the saying "fisherman's latin". They tend to exaggerate a lot. I met fisherman who allegedly caught fish being 1 meter, but when going into detail it maybe was 45 cm. Also they have the fisherman joke. They know they should not lie, so they spread their arms wide "this big a fish it was (1,5m)", and in the mean time spread also their hands "meaning 20 cm only.

After all they were all human. And human just have a tendency to exaggerate. So I think that might as well be the case. Kid asking grandfather "how old are you". Oh kid, I am 1000 years old, not kiddin'. And kids are gullible. Grandfather dies, never able to correct this error.

Or just to make the Bible story more special, nice. 1000 years gives some flavor to it [I liked it]

Just a few scenarios that came into my mind this morning. Before I always accepted "Okay, if Bible says so, why not? I can't check it anymore, so why question it?". Also a good viewpoint. Question all weird scenarios is time consuming. But today I had some spare time.

Not an error... if you examine the ages after Noah they drop in some exponential like fashion to what they are today... as God told Noah part of the flood judgement was to limit the age of man as a restraint on evil

but it also points to something bigger

Hebrew English
Adam Man
Seth Appointed
Enosh Mortal
Kenan Sorrow;
Mahalalel The Blessed God
Jared Shall come down
Enoch Teaching
Methuselah His death shall bring
Lamech The Despairing
Noah Rest, or comfort.

Man (is) appointed mortal sorrow; (but) the Blessed God shall come down teaching (that) His death shall bring (the) despairing rest.

and Jesus did just that

 

[whirlingmerc]

Not.

I disagree

And the ages are telling
Abraham would have died a few decades before Noah
Methusalem died the year of the flood if you add it up
The drop in ages suggests a curve of adaption of man to new environment with reduced age that would be unknown and anticipated by the authors which leans toward the bible as true

 

[shunyadragon]

It is not possible with today's DNA and environment doesn't mean it was not originally possible

The historical and fossil paleontological evidence of humanity for the past 100,000 years at least says no,

 

[shunyadragon]

I disagree

And the ages are telling
Abraham would have died a few decades before Noah
Methusalem died the year of the flood if you add it up
The drop in ages suggests a curve of adaption of man to new environment with reduced age that would be unknown and anticipated by the authors which leans toward the bible as true

It is possibly that the ages refer to ages of influence and reigns of descendants, but the above is very unrealistic scenario.

More than likely the attribution of old age is a legendary way to attribute greatness to their ancestors.

 

[`mud]

If anyone believes Whirl's graph....
I have a bible you can buy cheap !

 

[whirlingmerc]

It is possibly that the ages refer to ages of influence and reigns of descendants, but the above is very unrealistic scenario.

unrealistic? or are you assuming your conclusion

 

[whirlingmerc]

If anyone believes Whirl's graph....
I have a bible you can buy cheap !

If you have a Bible, feel free to point out the error?

 

[stvdv]

It is not possible with today's DNA and environment doesn't mean it was not originally possible

This morning I believed it was possible 1000 years, because I never thought about it.
But now thinking about it, I doubt it as explained in the OP. Here in Holland no tigers and lions walking around, so we have chances to get like 150 years old. But back in those days you would be snatched away by a lion long before age 150. Natural environment nowadays is much more safe.

Of course it is possible. Because with God all is possible.

 

[whirlingmerc]

The historical and fossil paleontological evidence of humanity for the past 100,000 years at least says no,

Fossils don't actually say anything. They are interpreted according to assumptions and you may be just seeing the assumptions made prior reflected in the your assessment of data. Under other assumptions I would say not.