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Featured Being non-religious, what should be done in regards to religious people?

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by osgart, May 15, 2018.

  1. osgart

    osgart Nothing my eye, Something for sure

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    Do you feel the need to eradicate religion? If so , why?

    Are religious people profitable to society or not?

    How are religious people to be judged?

    Is it necessary in todays society to reject religious people?

    We seem to be living in an unique time in history where religious people are constantly under fire moreso then at any time in previous history.

    Is it right to force people to change their religious beliefs and convictions?
     
  2. Augustus

    Augustus the Unreasonable

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    No

    meh

    By a court of law if they commit a crime

    No

    No
     
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  3. Jainarayan

    Jainarayan ॐ नमो भगवते वासुदेवाय
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    • No, I'm fairly religious m'self. Eradicating religion would be kind of shooting myself in the foot.
    • Why not not judging? Or better, maybe by what they judge with.
    • It depends. If someone gets all "you worship false gods but Jesus loves you anyway" I think they should be punc... er I mean rejected.
    • If religious people kept their religion to themselves, except when asked about it maybe they wouldn't be so under fire.
    • It depends. If you try to change mine because you think yours are better or more correct, then we have a problem.
    [​IMG]
     
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  4. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    No.

    And no one should judge another person regardless their religion (etc).
     
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  5. osgart

    osgart Nothing my eye, Something for sure

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    Same goes for any view of reality.
     
  6. Altfish

    Altfish Well-Known Member

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    No, it will die out on its own, it'll take a while though.

    No more than non religious people are. The good think to governments though is that religious people are in the main compliant

    Religious people are not to be judges. The ideas they believe in should be judged and challenged.

    They should not have heightened influence because of their faith

    Knowledge, science, the internet, atheists who can communicate their ideas are all taking their toll. Religion used to get a free ride, unquestioned. Today that is not the case.

    No it is not.
    But you can use persuasion.
     
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  7. WalterTrull

    WalterTrull Godfella

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    (Checking the supplies in the safe room)
     
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  8. ADigitalArtist

    ADigitalArtist Well-Known Member
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    Absolutely not.
    No more or less than anyone else.
    No more or less than anyone else.
    No more or less than anyone else.
    I think it's more that we seem to be living in a unique time in history where non-religious people actually have a voice.
    I don't think forcing people to change beliefs and convictions is possible, religious or not. I think we can prevent people from enacting religious policy where no benefit can be seen outside of one's religious beliefs. I think we can attempt to reason out whether or not some religious convictions have positive or deleterious effects when put into practice. But forcing change of beliefs? No.
     
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  9. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

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    Of course not. There are contentions and concern in some areas where religion has no place being there, like in public educational systems, but as individuals, a person's belief's and views should be respected as an aspect by which people live their life.
     
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  10. viole

    viole Metaphysical Naturalist
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    It depends. In any case, only by reasoning.

    Well, Euler was.

    Judged by whom?

    No. Why? Everybody cab believe any absurdity she chooses to as long as it does not affect my life. Secondly, It is possible that forcing would increase fundamentalism.

    I wonder where in the western world. Today? Well, some Christians confuse laughing to their beliefs with persecution, but I am confident that being laughed at is vastly preferable to being eaten alive by a lion.

    Here in Europe we do not really care what people believe, Zeus, Jesus, the invisible fairy, whatever, as long as they do not use it to influence public policy. Society will be truly secular when nobody is under fire, and whatever superstition or weird stuff people choose to believe in, has no effect whatsoever on the lives of others.

    No. But it is right to try to argue about them and even to make fun of their beliefs. For two reasons.

    First off, it is a bad idea to force things like beliefs. It might even be impossible. Second, in my experience religious people prefer to be considered martyrs rather than inspirers of a good laugh. For some strange reason.

    Ciao

    - viole
     
    #10 viole, May 15, 2018
    Last edited: May 15, 2018
  11. Quintessence

    Quintessence Tale Weaver
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    I seem to recall making a thread around here once asking what on earth "religious people" are. Hmm... *searches* ... yup!



    I still find the phrase befuddling. As far as I'm aware, there are no "people" who are not "religious people" as I understand the term "religious." Thus, the question is basically asking "do you feel the need to eradicate humans?" to me. :sweat:
     
  12. A Vestigial Mote

    A Vestigial Mote Well-Known Member

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    Forcing anything is the wrong way to go. As someone else said, religion (or many of them) will very likely die its own death in time.

    Not any more or less than non-religious people. Except perhaps those employed by religious institutions which don't pay taxes. There's possibly a bit of a loss that is had there to society as a whole - I'm thinking of things like school or police funding dollars. Though if there were no churches, money wouldn't be going to them anyway. People would likely just be buying more things - though that also leads to tax income. Hard to weigh that against the good done by church outreach programs however...

    Judged for what? Anything and everything? Then I'd say like anyone else. Or did you mean specifically for the beliefs/opinions they hold? If the latter, I would say that in places that judgment must remain secular, they be judged using the secular ideals upheld in those arenas. On a person-to-person basis, I suppose judgment can be whatever one is willing to try and support. Isn't that the way things go now anyway? Aren't religious people often very judgmental themselves? Sorry... not really sure where this question was going.

    Reject them? Not at all. Question (or even challenge) them? Why not?

    Contemporary access to information and differing views/opinions does seem to be quickly eroding religion's hold. Can anyone make the judgment call that this is inherently a "bad" thing?

    As stated before, forcing anything is the absolute wrong way to go. However, how "wrong" is it to try to get someone to finally think over something they have heretofore simply accepted on the word of others and preached mostly because they were being obstinate? How many things can we point to that would have been stifled if the proponents of those things simply "gave up" in the face of complaints and opposition of religious parties who were most outspoken against them? For example, we'd still be teaching that the Earth is flat. We'd still be teaching that the Earth was the center of the universe. Slavery might still be a supported activity.

    Point being... if someone is being dumb and trying to get the world to remain adherent to completely out-dated, contemporarily immoral, or simply outlandish/implausible ideas... then yes, there WILL be push back. That some of those people feel that such is a personal attack is not truly a "real" problem.
     
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  13. osgart

    osgart Nothing my eye, Something for sure

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    Im not religious in a traditional sense, but i have convictions that are certainly not secular.

    Maybe its my paranoia but Orwell's 1984 left an impression on me. The thought that everybody must comply to a specific way of thinking, reasoning, and logic. I know some religions pack that kind of pressure. However i wonder if there are secular people who want to go down the road of rightspeak, and so forth.

    My major hope is that mind programmers are in the minority.

    Who needs a religious or secular class of people pontificating to the masses? YouTube has their fair share of these folks on all sides.
     
  14. David1967

    David1967 Well-Known Member
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    No. Why would I?

    Same answer as non-religious folks. Some are. Some are not.

    Same as anyone else. Either they are good people , or they are not.

    Of course not.

    Are you sure? I'm not.

    No. It has been tried and is being tried. From the Catholic inquisition to modern Islamic Extremism. It doesn't work, it only leads to death and destruction.
     
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  15. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon Well-Known Member
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    The definition of religion and religious is often misused to scapegoat name calling of people who believe differently. Even among churches and religions that believe in God often accuse other churches and religions as religions, or religious, and of course, they are not, because they are the Truth.. For example Jehovah Witnesses. Different sources use 'religion' in different ways, and also describe beliefs that do not include God in the religion.

    I believe religion and religious are simple descriptive of attributes of belief and non-belief of human nature in general whether organized, disorganized, sanforized, digitized, denied, or categorized.
     
    #15 shunyadragon, May 15, 2018
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  16. Jumi

    Jumi Well-Known Member

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    Religious folk deserve the same as everybody else. No less and no more.
     
  17. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon Well-Known Member
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    Everybody deserve the same as everybody else, no less no more regardless of what they believe nor not believe.
     
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  18. osgart

    osgart Nothing my eye, Something for sure

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    Ultimately people in positions of authority have to make judgment calls on what serves the public interest and what does not. A persons convictions, religious or secular, might have to be taken into account. Will the religious person serve the interest of secular freedom, or merely their own religious bias.

    If you feel that religious people carry an unfair bias, you might have to make a judgment call, on where they should credibly stand.

    There may come a time when people are considered justifiably religious, or unjustifiably religious.

    Certainly people in popular science make much of where religious people should or shouldnt stand. And in one instance they are right, you wouldnt want a religious person doing evolutionary biology when their convictions are contrary to the accepted standards they have for their field. However many religious people do great scientific contributions in other areas.

    Perhaps on issues like biology, religious people may want to break off and start their own scientific programs without the threat of being shut down provided they meet safety standards and practices.

    It seems that at some time one group of people will want to officiate what other people do. That is not very democratic though.

    Its interesting, there is always a democratic answer, but many people will instead choose a power mongering authoritarian answer instead.
     
  19. Sunstone

    Sunstone De Diablo Del Fora
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    Nope.

    I don't see religion as net profitable to society. I see it as more of a wash. But religious people? Essential to society.

    Why judge them?

    Absolutely not.

    Really? Holier than Thou and "churchy" people have always been sharply criticized. Besides, I think you're confusing "religious people" with "religions". Religions are under fire more broadly than before, although not more sharply.

    No, but it's right to demand that they don't act on them if and when acting on them would mean unjustly injuring others.
     
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  20. Polymath257

    Polymath257 Think & Care
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    No. Hopefully it will fade away over time as people gain more understanding.

    I have a problem with their tax-exempt status when they are essentially running a coffee house or bookstore. other than that, I'm sure it varies widely.

    As people. Are they compassionate and thoughtful or are they bigoted and cruel?

    No. Why would it be?

    You have to be kidding. Religioure all around and hold most of the power.

    No. People have every right to be as silly or ignorant as they want.[/QUOTE]
     
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