1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Being non-cis

Discussion in 'Sexuality' started by KAT-KAT, May 19, 2020.

  1. Israel Khan

    Israel Khan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2017
    Messages:
    3,872
    Ratings:
    +2,739
    Religion:
    None
    An illness only matters if it is harmful or fatal. If the person is perfectly fine being transgender then it shouldn''t concern anyone else. If they are harming themselves because of it then they should be treated like any other depressed person.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. Israel Khan

    Israel Khan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2017
    Messages:
    3,872
    Ratings:
    +2,739
    Religion:
    None
    Exactly. How did they even come to the conclusion that it is a mental illness in the first place?
     
    • Like Like x 2
  3. Israel Khan

    Israel Khan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2017
    Messages:
    3,872
    Ratings:
    +2,739
    Religion:
    None
    This is brilliant actually :D
     
  4. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest I have the kavorka
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    189,677
    Ratings:
    +66,336
    Religion:
    Atheist
    If one's mind's gender doesn't match one's body, is that mental or physical?
    Looking at how the malady is addressed medically, it appears to be both.
    But the brain is thing really bothered by it all.
    (It's so often the trouble maker organ, eh.)
    Thus "mental illness" makes sense.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  5. KAT-KAT

    KAT-KAT Veteran Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2019
    Messages:
    11,996
    Ratings:
    +9,038
    Religion:
    Daughter of Shiva
    And since they have no real cure to that illness, the solution is hormones.
     
  6. Israel Khan

    Israel Khan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2017
    Messages:
    3,872
    Ratings:
    +2,739
    Religion:
    None
    I actually never thought of it that way...
     
  7. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest I have the kavorka
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    189,677
    Ratings:
    +66,336
    Religion:
    Atheist
    I hadn't either.
    It's just my speculation about how to classify the problem.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. Maximus

    Maximus the Confessor

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2020
    Messages:
    128
    Ratings:
    +73
    Religion:
    Christianity
    If one feels as if the whole notion of transgenderism is misguided (because the person decides they are in fact a gender opposite as to what their DNA indicates) - whether due to a mental illness or any other reason - and corrosive to traditional Western values and teachings on family and the Created order, then you should not be surprised if you receive pushback against the attempt to normalize the behavior.
     
  9. Maximus

    Maximus the Confessor

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2020
    Messages:
    128
    Ratings:
    +73
    Religion:
    Christianity
    Highlighting the fact that someone has a mental illness does not necessarily imply hostility. It is an observation. Those with any illness deserve our love.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. KAT-KAT

    KAT-KAT Veteran Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2019
    Messages:
    11,996
    Ratings:
    +9,038
    Religion:
    Daughter of Shiva
    All Christians do is push back. They aren't the minority in the US. They aren't the minority at all.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. Israel Khan

    Israel Khan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2017
    Messages:
    3,872
    Ratings:
    +2,739
    Religion:
    None
    As I said, values in society have changed numerous times in the past so I don't see why that in itself is a problem. I also don't understand what you mean by traditional Western values because those values have changed so much over the course of humanity.

    I would also think that teachings on family is separate to being transgender, just like being a man is separate to whether it is OK for two men to play the mother and father roles.

    If you are speaking from your religious perspective on the world, then I understand your position, so I would expect pushback because of that. But as you agree, I wouldn't think that pushback should result in hatred on the Christians part.
     
  12. Israel Khan

    Israel Khan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2017
    Messages:
    3,872
    Ratings:
    +2,739
    Religion:
    None
    By the way, I am not against people genuinely discussing the issue and bringing up their feelings about it. Those feelings should be expressed, and questions should be asked, but they should be done in a respectful way, and people shouldn't be upset about those opinions. Being upset about them would show immaturity.

    The anger expressed towards transgender people is something that is worrying.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  13. Father Heathen

    Father Heathen Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2008
    Messages:
    34,507
    Ratings:
    +19,766
    How exactly are society and "traditional values" harmed by it? And how are children harmed by knowing that transgendered people exist? These assertions are often made but never actually explained. People have the right to hold and voice their beliefs, opinions, etc. regarding the subject, but that doesn't make it okay to impose and intrude in the private lives of others.
    Besides, if it's a mental illness, how is shaming, harassing, etc. supposed to heal them?
     
    • Like Like x 2
  14. Father Heathen

    Father Heathen Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2008
    Messages:
    34,507
    Ratings:
    +19,766
    I knew a girl who was a pseudohermaphrodite. She and her family didn't know she was actually Xy until she was a teenager, yet she continued living as a female. How does that fit into the whole "traditional values" thing?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  15. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Rival's Wife

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2005
    Messages:
    75,322
    Ratings:
    +30,276
    Religion:
    God is in the Rain
    How are we defining ill?
     
  16. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Rival's Wife

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2005
    Messages:
    75,322
    Ratings:
    +30,276
    Religion:
    God is in the Rain
    Mental health does not really acknowledge being trans itself an illness. What is considered an illness is the depession of our own lives, but the mountain of **** people dump on us. That is considered, clinically speaking, the biggest issue. Not with us being trans but woth the way others treat us.
     
  17. Father Heathen

    Father Heathen Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2008
    Messages:
    34,507
    Ratings:
    +19,766
    I know. I'm just saying either way it doesn't justify mistreatment.
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  18. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Rival's Wife

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2005
    Messages:
    75,322
    Ratings:
    +30,276
    Religion:
    God is in the Rain
    I felt it necessary for that info to be here, especially with comments of ill communities of suspicious context and intent (I'm paranoid about certain things. Sue me.). You provided a point to build on.
     
  19. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2011
    Messages:
    17,828
    Ratings:
    +8,255
    Religion:
    Atheist Libertarian
    I figured the bi-sexual folks were the more sane among us. My male gender identity just happens to be a mental illness that doesn't cause me any problems.
     
  20. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Rival's Wife

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2005
    Messages:
    75,322
    Ratings:
    +30,276
    Religion:
    God is in the Rain
    How this is explained, clinically, is that being trans isn't an illness (especially in eegards to how nature isn't "perfect" and thus we have to explain why outside of the norm is ill). However, the social stigmas, prejudice, etc., are frequently highlighted as problems that are the primary source of mental illness.
    There is also a boon for patients in gender dysphoria, as with a diagnosis the doors amd avenues for medical treatments, legal protections, and insirance coverage for treatment are opened up.
    So, even if clinicians will often say being trans is, in and of itself not a mental illness, they will often cling to the diagnoses as it does help clients/patients, and stress it's largely everyone else causing the mental illnessss.
     
Loading...