Atheists: What would be evidence of God’s existence?

[Subduction Zone]

It does not really matter how many people believe or disbelieve in God because that has no bearing on whether God exists or not, as I just explained to you on the other thread.

I know that. Which raises the question of why you used an argument ad populum.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I found it.

No, you only found "It convinces me" stories. Do you remember the examples of blue tiles that another poster could not understand at all? There are reliable ways to tell if those tiles are blue or not. We can determine their color in a way that is not opinion. That evidence would be an example of reliable evidence. All you have is "I see red, I don't care what others see". That is not reliable evidence and may even be, as in the case of the tiles. wrong.

 

[Trailblazer]

I know that. Which raises the question of why you used an argument ad populum.

I did not use ad populum. I just stated a fact. Many or post people believe in God because they see evidence that indicates to them that God exists. I did not say that God exists is true because many or most people see evidence for God. That would be ad populum.

 

[ppp]

No all of the 93% believe because they see evidence. Some people believe in God just because it makes sense to them that God exists.

Thank you for correcting your ambiguity.

But people who are religious believe in God because of the evidence, and that evidence is the Messenger of God or Prophet or holy man they believe in.

Those holy men are the claim. Not the evidence of the claim. If a bunch of people write down that Policy is a prophet of God, that is the claim. People reading it and believing are not believing evidence. They don't have access to evidence. They are believing the claim and then claiming that the claim is evidence.
Also, you lack the ability to know why all people who are religious believe. .Don't overreach.

 

[ppp]

No, I always admit when I am wrong and there are many instances of me admitting I am wrong posted on this forum, but when I know I am not wrong I do not admit I am wrong because that is unjust. I will not admit to committing logical fallacies I did not commit just because some people misapply logical fallacies and then they cannot admit they are wrong.

Nuh uh.

 

[Trailblazer]

No, you only found "It convinces me" stories. Do you remember the examples of blue tiles that another poster could not understand at all? There are reliable ways to tell if those tiles are blue or not. We can determine their color in a way that is not opinion. That evidence would be an example of reliable evidence. All you have is "I see red, I don't care what others see". That is not reliable evidence and may even be, as in the case of the tiles. wrong.

Sorry, I am not going to beat this dead horse again.

 

[Trailblazer]

Nuh uh.

If you want some actual proof of me admitting I was wrong I can find it for you.

 

[ppp]

A belief is not a claim unless one is making a claim about their belief.

A claim is a declarative sentence that is presented as being true. Whether you believe ir or do not believe it makes no never mind.

I have a gold bar in my sock drawer.

That is a claim. Whether it is true or not. Whether I believe it or not.

 

[ppp]

93% of people see evidence of what? God? Evidence like, "I know it's true, because I can feel God's love in my heart." Or, "I know it's true, because the Word of God, the Bible, says it's true." How many of us "assumed" there was a God simply because we were told there was a God. Then comes defining who that God is. What is the percentage of people agree on that?

Right! If I were forced to bet my life on why most religious people believe, I would bet that it is because their parents and communities believe.

 

[ppp]

If you want some actual proof of me admitting I was wrong I can find it for you.

 

[Trailblazer]

Those holy men are the claim. Not the evidence of the claim. If a bunch of people write down that Policy is a prophet of God, that is the claim. People reading it and believing are not believing evidence. They don't have access to evidence. They are believing the claim and then claiming that the claim is evidence.

The holy men make claims but they are not the claim. That is not even logical.

The claims of the Messengers are in scriptures that were attributed to them or scriptures that they wrote.
Where else would the claims be, posted on the bulletin board at the corner store?

The Messengers of God make claims and they present evidence that supports their claims.
For example, the claims of Baha’u’llah and the evidence that supports the claims of Baha’u’llah are in this post:

Questions for knowledgeable Bahai / followers of Baha'u'llah

Also, you lack the ability to know why all people who are religious believe. .Don't overreach.

Good point. No, I don't know. I think religious people believe for different reasons since people are all different.

 

[Trailblazer]

Going once, going twice... the offer expires at midnight.

 

[Trailblazer]

A claim is a declarative sentence that is presented as being true. Whether you believe ir or do not believe it makes no never mind.

I have a gold bar in my sock drawer.

That is a claim. Whether it is true or not. Whether I believe it or not.

That won't work.
If I say I believe something is true that is not a claim.
If you say you have a gold bar in your sock drawer that is not a claim.
All these words have different meanings, that is why there are different words.

Say: utter words so as to convey information, an opinion, a feeling or intention, or an instruction.
https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=say+means

Claim: state or assert that something is the case, typically without providing evidence or proof.
https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=claim+means

Claim: to say that something is true or is a fact, although you cannot prove it and other people might not believe it: claim

Belief:
1. an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists.
"his belief in the value of hard work"

2. trust, faith, or confidence in someone or something.
"a belief in democratic politics"
https://www.google.com/search

Belief:
the feeling of being certain that something exists or is true:
His belief in God gave him hope during difficult times.
Recent scandals have shaken many people's belief in (= caused people to have doubts about) politicians.
belief

 

[Subduction Zone]

I did not use ad populum. I just stated a fact. Many or post people believe in God because they see evidence that indicates to them that God exists. I did not say that God exists is true because many or most people see evidence for God. That would be ad populum.

Why do you do this?

 

[Subduction Zone]

The holy men make claims but they are not the claim. That is not even logical.

The claims of the Messengers are in scriptures that were attributed to them or scriptures that they wrote.
Where else would the claims be, posted on the bulletin board at the corner store?

The Messengers of God make claims and they present evidence that supports their claims.
For example, the claims of Baha’u’llah and the evidence that supports the claims of Baha’u’llah are in this post:

Questions for knowledgeable Bahai / followers of Baha'u'llah

Good point. No, I don't know. I think religious people believe for different reasons since people are all different.

To even state that they are "holy men" is a claim that requires substantiation.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Sorry, I am not going to beat this dead horse again.

Then quit.

Just about everybody that has argued with you has pointed out that you do not understand what reliable evidence is.

If you just said "I believe" people would accept that and leave you alone. But when you claim "I have evidence" people are going to demand that you provide it.

 

[ppp]

The holy men make claims but they are not the claim. That is not even logical.

The claim of the men is that they are holy. That "holy" is even a real thing. So yeah, "holy man" is the claim.

 

[ppp]

That won't work.
If I say I believe something is true that is not a claim.

Sure it is. You are claiming that you believe something. If religions had the power that they did 50 years ago, I would be saying that I believe that Baptist Christianity is true. Saying that I believe would be a claim.

If you say you have a gold bar in your sock drawer that is not a claim.

Please explain the mechanism where I can make a verbal claim without "[uttering] words so as to convey information, an opinion, a feeling or intention, or an instruction."''

Please explain the mechanism where I can make a textual claim without "[writing] words so as to convey information, an opinion, a feeling or intention, or an instruction."

 

[Trailblazer]

Why do you do this?

Why do you do this?

 

[Trailblazer]

To even state that they are "holy men" is a claim that requires substantiation.

Of course it does.