Atheists what should God do to make you believe in ?

[ChristineM]

Christine. I'm not a question/answer person-take it as is, person. I like to discuss things; it's just my nature. If I'm curious, I'd ask more about it.

I'm not sure what you mean by "I'm not a god... and mythical beast... and all of that."

I have no issues with you Christine. I was just curious with atheists here on this OP about what they are saying about the god they don't believe in, "who" are they blaming, and all of that.

I'm not quite sure why, but most atheists I speak with on RF are very sensitive around the god-topic. I'd say more than christians, to put it honestly. Why is that, I don't know.

To want me to define how a god would reveal themself. Simple, do something that every one accepts as god behaviour. That is something a mortal would not know until said god did the magic trick. You insist that i should know. Thats why i am informing you that i im not a god. Get it now?

As for the blaming god thing, you are confused, atheists are not blaming a god but using the religionists own argument against yhrm

 

[Nakosis]

Christine. I'm not a question/answer person-take it as is, person. I like to discuss things; it's just my nature. If I'm curious, I'd ask more about it.

I'm not sure what you mean by "I'm not a god... and mythical beast... and all of that."

I have no issues with you Christine. I was just curious with atheists here on this OP about what they are saying about the god they don't believe in, "who" are they blaming, and all of that.

I'm not quite sure why, but most atheists I speak with on RF are very sensitive around the god-topic. I'd say more than christians, to put it honestly. Why is that, I don't know.

Sorry to butt in and I'm not trying to defend anyone but to me, as an atheist, the answer to most questions ask are pretty obviously contained in the definition of an atheist.

Similar to asking water if it is wet.

So maybe a little grumpy at having to give the same answer over and over to a question that shouldn't really have to be asked.

Perhaps some feel being an atheist is some weird esoteric idealism. It is all pretty simple in that there really isn't much to it.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

What should God do to make to believe that he really cares and is already trying his level best ?

Now THAT's funny! If God cares -- and is doing "his level best" -- then one has to think that his level best isn't up to much. And if that's the case, what makes him a "god?"

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Atheists what should God do to make you believe in ?

Why assume he should do anything?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Sorry to butt in and I'm not trying to defend anyone but to me, as an atheist, the answer to most questions ask are pretty obviously contained in the definition of an atheist.

Similar to asking water if it is wet.

So maybe a little grumpy at having to give the same answer over and over to a question that shouldn't really have to be asked.

Perhaps some feel being an atheist is some weird esoteric idealism. It is all pretty simple in that there really isn't much to it.

Well, I don't know. I'm an atheist. So, if I answered my own question, since I've never known of a god the closest definition I can get (from others) is an experience or a source of spiritual awakening. At times I think it could be something believers personified. Other times when they say he did this or that, it makes me think of mythological gods especially in scripture in how its written and what the concept of the christian god has done.

So, as an atheist, the closest description I have (therefore ability to discuss it) is the christian god insofar my definition being either an experience or a mythological being. Though, I side for the former only because most people I talk to who believe in god experience him not hear him in an audible voice or see him dance in the stars (or how some say, be pink unicorn or spaghetti monster).

Another example on the opposite side would be if I asked the christian the same thing, his or her concept of god is, well, jesus christ. Jesus christ was human so it's easier for me to give a definition of that particular "god" because I have interacted with humans before.

I do feel the question is logical-how can you, say, blame someone that doesn't exist-but many people have christian upbringing and in my opinion using the god as a scapegoat for how they feel about believers claims of god. However, to ask about god itself, I'm sure they have some sort of concept or they wouldn't be (or couldnt) talk about it.

 

[Twilight Hue]

In which form ?

A convincing one.

 

[Twilight Hue]

how?

 

[Polymath257]

Have you ever saw God calming any definition for himself ? Why are you putting unnecessarily blames ?

And Bigfoot doesn't claim any definition for itself.

But, if someone claims that Bigfoot exists, I want to make sure that I understand what they are claiming. That way, they can't just point to a tree and claim it is Bigfoot.

I would like evidence for God that is better than the evidence for Bigfoot.

 

[Earthtank]

Atheists what should God do to make you believe in ?

There is literally nothing that can be done to convince Atheists of a God. I don't know why people are still trying

 

[Unveiled Artist]

To want me to define how a god would reveal themself. Simple, do something that every one accepts as god behaviour. That is something a mortal would not know until said god did the magic trick. You insist that i should know. Thats why i am informing you that i im not a god. Get it now?

As for the blaming god thing, you are confused, atheists are not blaming a god but using the religionists own argument against yhrm

I know what you're saying now, I'm just asking more questions because I like discussion rather than yes/no questions.

So, going a bit more into your comment: If something/someone where to cure the world and had good behavior, like your example above, would that look like a person tapping leukemia children on the head to make them cured. Will there be a poof and everything would be fine.

Maybe another way to phrase this:
If you were god, how would you cure children?
What method would you use?

The blaming comment. From the post I sent Nakosis, it sounds like, in my opinion, using the concept of god as a scapegoat for how some atheist (I do mean more than one) feel about christians and their theology. I'm sure they can part from this bias, but I guess it depends. Years ago, one RF member mentioned it took him or her (can't remember) years before they got out of indoctrination. Others, because of age most likely, christianity back then was no where near as it is now-so conflict generational outlooks. (applying what they know of christianity then to the younger and more liberal christianity today)

 

[stvdv]

Atheists what should God do to make you believe in ?

God, being omnipotent, ONLY needs to change the mindset of the Atheist from "lack of believe in god(s)" into "believe in god(s)"

 

[Polymath257]

There is literally nothing that can be done to convince Atheists of a God. I don't know why people are still trying

That depends on definitions.

For example, some people identify God and the universe. Since I believe in the universe, I believe in God by their definition.

Some people define God as the 'creator of the universe'. I am not convinced that causality applies to the universe as whole, so I would need to have some evidence that the universe is something that *can* be created. And, I would need some idea of what is meant by 'the universe'. But, with appropriate definitions, the concept isn't one that can be excluded for logical reasons. So I would then need actual evidence that some conscious being created the universe.

But, for example, if a race of higher dimensional beings learned how to create universes and ours is one of those that was a high school project and is 'now' forgotten, is that enough to believe those beings are 'Gods'? I suspect many theists would say no. Which shows that being a 'creator of the universe' is not enough.

On the other hand, some define God to be the creator of life on Earth. That is a less difficult thing than showing the whole universe was created, but I would still need some specific evidence for life arising by a conscious creation as opposed to by natural means.

Many people have other definitions of God. For example 'an moved mover' or 'first cause' or something along these lines. This is distinct from the notion of a creator. But, again, I would need to have reason to think there is *only one* uncaused cause (as opposed to many) or that everything really is caused by a single thing (as opposed to many sources of causality). A separate, but important aspect of this is determining if the first cause (if it exists) is conscious in some way. That is another thing that may need to be established.

Others define 'God' to be some sort of 'higher consciousness'. For that definition, I would need some evidence that such a consciousness exists as opposed to being simply an illusion brought on by meditation. Given my understanding of the universe, consciousness is limited to certain biological organisms. That would have to be shown to be wrong before I could accept this concept of God.

 

[Earthtank]

That depends on definitions.

For example, some people identify God and the universe. Since I believe in the universe, I believe in God by their definition.

Some people define God as the 'creator of the universe'. I am not convinced that causality applies to the universe as whole, so I would need to have some evidence that the universe is something that *can* be created. And, I would need some idea of what is meant by 'the universe'. But, with appropriate definitions, the concept isn't one that can be excluded for logical reasons. So I would then need actual evidence that some conscious being created the universe.

But, for example, if a race of higher dimensional beings learned how to create universes and ours is one of those that was a high school project and is 'now' forgotten, is that enough to believe those beings are 'Gods'? I suspect many theists would say no. Which shows that being a 'creator of the universe' is not enough.

On the other hand, some define God to be the creator of life on Earth. That is a less difficult thing than showing the whole universe was created, but I would still need some specific evidence for life arising by a conscious creation as opposed to by natural means.

Many people have other definitions of God. For example 'an moved mover' or 'first cause' or something along these lines. This is distinct from the notion of a creator. But, again, I would need to have reason to think there is *only one* uncaused cause (as opposed to many) or that everything really is caused by a single thing (as opposed to many sources of causality). A separate, but important aspect of this is determining if the first cause (if it exists) is conscious in some way. That is another thing that may need to be established.

Others define 'God' to be some sort of 'higher consciousness'. For that definition, I would need some evidence that such a consciousness exists as opposed to being simply an illusion brought on by meditation. Given my understanding of the universe, consciousness is limited to certain biological organisms. That would have to be shown to be wrong before I could accept this concept of God.

Thank you for your reply. How do YOU define God? Please provide your definition and the evidence it would take to convince YOU of your pre defined God

 

[Polymath257]

Thank you for your reply. How do YOU define God? Please provide your definition and the evidence it would take to convince YOU of your pre defined God

That's the thing. I don't. The concept of God isn't necessary in my mind. I don't find it to be a particularly interesting collection of ideas. So I let others define it how they want and deal with that.

It's kind of like everyone around me is talking about zlortids. They talk about whether zlortids exist and how much believing in zlortids makes their lives meaningful. Then, when I ask what they mean by the word 'zlortid', they say I should define it myself however I want. That makes no sense to me. I really don't have a notion of zlortids.

But I'm willing to use whatever definition the person I'm talking to is using.

 

[Earthtank]

That's the thing. I don't. The concept of God isn't necessary in my mind. I don't find it to be a particularly interesting collection of ideas. So I let others define it how they want and deal with that.

so then would you agree that there is nothing that can be done to make you believe in God? Please confirm or deny as I do not wish to speak for you or misrepresent you

 

[Polymath257]

so then would you agree that there is nothing that can be done to make you believe in God? Please confirm or deny as I do not wish to speak for you or misrepresent you

Yes, there is: define what you mean by the term and then give evidence for such a thing. I don't define the notion: I'll let you do it.

Like I said, if you define God to be the universe, then I believe in God.

Also: I edited my last post: see what you think of the last paragraph.

 

[Earthtank]

It's kind of like everyone around me is talking about zlortids. They talk about whether zlortids exist and how much believing in zlortids makes their lives meaningful. Then, when I ask what they mean by the word 'zlortid', they say I should define it myself however I want. That makes no sense to me. I really don't have a notion of zlortids.

I had to google "zlortids" to realize it's something you made up lol. Anyway, I think you might be missing my point, more on this on the reply to the comment below.

Yes, there is: define what you mean by the term and then give evidence for such a thing. I don't define the notion: I'll let you do it.

The whole point of my question, which was "How do YOU define God? Please provide your definition and the evidence it would take to convince YOU of your pre defined God" was to see if you have any idea or concept of God. Forget what every person and religion has ever said about God or what they believe God is. The point of my question and the capitalized "YOU" was for, you, Polymath, to define what you think God is and then provide what it would take for YOU to believe in "your" God.

 

[Subduction Zone]

There is literally nothing that can be done to convince Atheists of a God. I don't know why people are still trying

Oh my! You just said that there is no God.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I had to google "zlortids" to realize it's something you made up lol. Anyway, I think you might be missing my point, more on this on the reply to the comment below.



The whole point of my question, which was "How do YOU define God? Please provide your definition and the evidence it would take to convince YOU of your pre defined God" was to see if you have any idea or concept of God. Forget what every person and religion has ever said about God or what they believe God is. The point of my question and the capitalized "YOU" was for, you, Polymath, to define what you think God is and then provide what it would take for YOU to believe in "your" God.

You do not seem to understand. We don't believe in any gods, it is not up to atheists to define him. It is not possible to define something that one lacks a belief in.

 

[Earthtank]

Oh my! You just said that there is no God.

????