Atheists what should God do to make you believe in ?

[Unveiled Artist]

Proper nouns are not c


So back to the old knowing/believing argument.

And again you are thinking for your god, wassup, can't he think for himself? Or us it just coincidence that he thinks exactly what you think?

I am quite happy with the lack of proof having meaning

proper nouns are not c??

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Sure it does.

Sure you do.

No need to be bashful.

You have your heroes of the lecture circus, your celebrities, your Atheistic apologists.

Atheists deny that God exists. Yet for an atheist to make our ranking of the 50 top atheists in the world—given in ascending order—it is not enough merely to deny that God exists. More is required.

Certainty. To make our list, someone has to be very sure of him- or herself. No mere agnostics will do. To make the cut, one has to do more than merely question God’s existence or even deny that knowledge of God’s existence is possible.

Celebrity is another requirement. To make our list, the atheist must have a public identification with atheism and must have made some public impact by challenging religion and/or promoting atheism, either in print or on the Internet. In other words, our ranking is a list of people who are well known because they are atheists, among other things—as opposed to people who are mainly famous for some other reason (like Jodie Foster or Bruce Willis). In a few cases, a person has made the list mainly on the basis of his or her attack on free will and morality—the foundation of the traditional religious view of human beings—so long as the person has also publicly identified as an atheist.

50 Top Atheists in the World Today
​

Peaceful Sabbath.

Isn't that like judging all christians based on what their churches have done to people for the passed thousands years?

That or saying that all christians believe the same thing as television evangelists?

Atheism has nothing to do specifically with the christian god anymore does theist have to do with the christian god. There are many theist of many religions. Atheism and theism are very vague words.

 

[ChristineM]

proper nouns are not c??

My bad, something i started typing then thought forget it but didn't erase it

I was to say proper nouns are not capitalised in some languages. Where i live personal names are but place names, organisation names aren't. There are several other reasons for not capitalising to suite whims and beliefs of others

 

[Dave Watchman]

I'm not sure what you're saying. Are you saying atheists are going through the grieving process towards not believing in god?

Pretty much.

Because they know God is for real, but He's not the God they want.

Or they're doing something that goes against what He (God) wants.

Bill Nye quickly shifts into, "well if there is a God, do we have to do what He tells us to do?

Or, "problems arise when people tell ME I have to do something that their Invisible Man in the sky tells them I have to do.

People love the darkness because there is no light in them

I know people can blame concepts of anything but my point to Christine was that saying "god should do this or that" means nothing if the words and concepts of the sentence and her point cannot be clarified. It's like christians talking about god and assuming every person the speak with (atheist and not) are on the same page just because they use the term god.

Five stages of grief.

• denial.
• anger.
• bargaining.
• depression.
• acceptance.

Denial. The Atheist says in their heart that there is no God.

Anger. If there is a God, I want to know why He lets little kids get leukemia.

Bargaining. Tell ya what, show us proof, and WE will be the deciders if God exists.

Depression. Quiet time, the Atheist goes on a break from posting.

Acceptance. When the Atheist reaches acceptance on a global scale, they will seek to kill God. Satan will gather them for that great battle in the valley that is symbolically called Megiddo. When the world is at war with God. Like it is right now.

But as for them not believing in a god they don't want to, I got another insight awhile back is most people don't know about other gods just the one they are familiar with. So, it's hard to say an atheist doesn't believe in Vishnu, or a pagan god, or so have you because they know nothing about them. It really isn't their fault, I guess you can say. Of course I'm generalizing atheists for sake of making a point, but I'm not sure how it relates to the grieving process.

I see it all the time.

More than just in this thread.

The best is in the Bill Nye video.

Because you can see it in his eyes, his facial expression.

"And this is the verdict: The Light has come into the world, but men loved the darkness rather than the Light because their deeds were evil.​

Peaceful Sabbath.

 

[Heyo]

I usually capitalize Atheist out of simple respect for it being an organized belief system.

I capitalize Agnosticism when talking about the philosophical position (as I do capitalize Atheism when talking about the philosophical position). I don't capitalize when talking about the colloquial meaning of the words.
E.g.: I'm an Agnostic and an atheist.

 

[Dave Watchman]

I actually thought the first question you asked was pretty genuine since I never did caps jesus name (or the autocorrect did it for me), god, and all of that. It has nothing to do with christians and so forth cause I wasn't raised that way. Nor has it to do with RF or any of that nonsense.

That's what Audie said.

I told her that I liked it that she capitalized God, but she said the auto correct did it for her.

She had to put in the extra effort to UNcapatalize God, or Jesus and Christ.

(See what I mean?)

All the same, she crack me up.

I hope she's not in her depression phase of the five stages of grief:

Denial. The Atheist says in their heart that there is no God.
Anger. If there is a God, I want to know why He lets little kids get leukemia.
Bargaining. Tell ya what, show us proof, and WE will be the deciders if God exists.
Depression. Quiet time, the Atheist goes on a break from posting.
Acceptance. When the Atheist reaches acceptance on a global scale, they will seek to kill God. Satan will gather them for that great battle in the valley that is symbolically called Megiddo. When the world is at war with God. Like it is right now.

Peaceful Sabbath.

 

[Dave Watchman]

I capitalize Agnosticism when talking about the philosophical position (as I do capitalize Atheism when talking about the philosophical position). I don't capitalize when talking about the colloquial meaning of the words.
E.g.: I'm an Agnostic and an atheist.

That sounds correct.

But would you capitalize Heyo?

Or Dave?

Or Jesus, Jesuit and any other proper name?

Why be rude to something not acknowledged to the Atheist as even being real.

Unless they know in their heart that He IS real, but they don't like the idea of it.

Is it not indicative of anger, or angst, or underlying negative emotions?

It appears to me to be emblematic, a part of the Atheist creed, to go out of their way to un capatalize the name of God, or of His Son.

Peaceful Sabbath.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

That's what Audie said.

I told her that I liked it that she capitalized God, but she said the auto correct did it for her.

She had to put in the extra effort to UNcapatalize God, or Jesus and Christ.

(See what I mean?)

All the same, she crack me up.

I hope she's not in her depression phase of the five stages of grief:



Peaceful Sabbath.

Haha. Well, I don't do upcaps for the same reason. It depends on the context of the conversation. Most of the time it's just habit. I'm not christian, so it doesn't bother me as it would someone who believes in god. The only time I really changed was when I was in a christian forum and someone kindly asked me to caps god. So, I did (of course I slipped), but did nonetheless. I really has nothing to do with hating or denying god. You can't deny or hate someone you have never known to exist in any part of your life.

What I see you're getting at is more of a victim-perspective. "Those athiest 'really' do believe in god but they're like children rebutting against their parent" or some other similar point of view. In a way it makes it seem many christians don't want to accept people just don't believe in "their" god--they try to come up with so many justifications and maybes. Other christians give up the whole justification thing and says god eventually saves all.

I know this will sound like it proves your point, but that's not my intention in this question: why do non-believers need to respect your god?

 

[Subduction Zone]

They fail by your standards because you have certain expectations that no prophecies were ever designed to meet, yet the prophecies were indeed fulfilled on the ground, and that is provable by history.

That the prophecies were indeed fulfilled on the ground means that what prophecies say will happen did happen.

No they fail on the exact same standards that Christian prophecies fail on.

Criteria for a true prophecy[edit]
For a statement to be Biblical foreknowledge, it must fit all of the five following criteria:

1. It must be accurate. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if it is not accurate, because knowledge (and thus foreknowledge) excludes inaccurate statements. TLDR: It's true.
2. It must be in the Bible. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if it is not in the Bible, because Biblical by definition foreknowledge can only come from the Bible itself, rather than modern reinterpretations of the text. TLDR: It's in plain words in the Bible.
3. It must be precise and unambiguous. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if meaningless philosophical musings or multiple possible ideas could fulfill the foreknowledge, because ambiguity prevents one from knowing whether the foreknowledge was intentional rather than accidental. TLDR: Vague "predictions" don't count.
4. It must be improbable. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if it reasonably could be the result of a pure guess, because foreknowledge requires a person to actually know something true, while a correct guess doesn't mean that the guesser knows anything. This also excludes contemporary beliefs that happened be true but were believed to be true without solid evidence. TLDR: Lucky guesses don't count.
5. It must have been unknown. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if it reasonably could be the result of an educated guess based off contemporary knowledge, because foreknowledge requires a person to know a statement when it would have been impossible, outside of supernatural power, for that person to know it. TLDR: Ideas of the time don't count.

Just change the word Bible and put in the name of your own holy book. Or perhaps you could explain why this expectations are unreasonable. If one tries to claim that there is any authority to prophecies than certain standards need to be met for them to have any authority.

 

[Polymath257]

Pretty much.

Because they know God is for real, but He's not the God they want.

Why would you think that? I am neither grieving in my disbelief nor do I know any God is real. I simply have not found any evidence for such a being.

If you actually *have* evidence, please present it. Now, to *be* evidence, it has to be able to tell the difference between a universe with natural laws and no God from a universe with natural laws *and* a God.

Do you have such evidence?

Or they're doing something that goes against what He (God) wants.

Bill Nye quickly shifts into, "well if there is a God, do we have to do what He tells us to do?

Or, "problems arise when people tell ME I have to do something that their Invisible Man in the sky tells them I have to do.

People love the darkness because there is no light in them

The question of whether to follow a God is different than the question of whether a God exists.

So, a God like Baal, even if it exists, would not be worthy of being followed. The same could be said of Yahweh.

But before the question of following such a God becomes relevant, the existence has to first be shown.

Five stages of grief.

• denial.
• anger.
• bargaining.
• depression.
• acceptance.

Denial. The Atheist says in their heart that there is no God.

Anger. If there is a God, I want to know why He lets little kids get leukemia.

Bargaining. Tell ya what, show us proof, and WE will be the deciders if God exists.

Depression. Quiet time, the Atheist goes on a break from posting.

Acceptance. When the Atheist reaches acceptance on a global scale, they will seek to kill God. Satan will gather them for that great battle in the valley that is symbolically called Megiddo. When the world is at war with God. Like it is right now.

Yawn. Your misunderstandings of atheism are very large.

 

[Dave Watchman]

So...no actual evidence, just a promise of evidence in the future? OK, I can wait for the actual evidence.

The beautiful thing is that it's from the past.

It happened already one time.

The three wise men knew it as a peculiar time fulfilled.

Numerology isn't impressive.

It is when it happens twice.

The fingerprint is unmistakable.

Don't worry, I won't say it here today.

The sebils of the Old City cannot tell a lie.

Peaceful Sabbath.

 

[Polymath257]

The beautiful thing is that it's from the past.

It happened already one time.

The three wise men knew it as a peculiar time fulfilled.

Do you really want to get into all the contradictions and symbolism of that story? Do you have *any* evidence it actually happened?

 

[Dave Watchman]

Do you have such evidence?

Yes!

It's the second half of what Isaac Newton was talking about in the middle 18th century.

He could see the first part in his time.

He knew that the secondary application had to be expected in our time now.

Yawn. Your misunderstandings of atheism are very large.

Well then enjoy your rest.

And so shall I.

Peaceful Sabbath to you.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Why would you think that? I am neither grieving in my disbelief nor do I know any God is real. I simply have not found any evidence for such a being.

If you actually *have* evidence, please present it. Now, to *be* evidence, it has to be able to tell the difference between a universe with natural laws and no God from a universe with natural laws *and* a God.
...

So you know, that there is no God?

 

[Dave Watchman]

Do you really want to get into all the contradictions and symbolism of that story?

Not really.

Not today.

Not here.

If I'm not supposed to cast my pearls down before the swine, dropping my gold pressed latinum here before the Ferengi Alliance, notice I capitalized their organization, would be inappropriate, to say the least.

Do you have *any* evidence it actually happened?

Yes.

Both in the first century, and right now.

There were two times, two applications of the time periods.

Both are confirmed by God's faithful witness, the moon, the lesser light that rules the night.

Jesus ate the Passover with His disciples following an identifiable conjunction.

A conjunction that specifically occurred in the middle of a heptad which happened 69 weeks after the Artaxerxes decree of 457 BC.

The ones we have now are even more accurate, to the actual month itself.

I can set my watch to it.

Peaceful Sabbath.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Atheism and the grieving process is a good article to write about.

Pretty much.

Because they know God is for real, but He's not the God they want.

Or they're doing something that goes against what He (God) wants.

Bill Nye quickly shifts into, "well if there is a God, do we have to do what He tells us to do?

Or, "problems arise when people tell ME I have to do something that their Invisible Man in the sky tells them I have to do.

People love the darkness because there is no light in them

I'd say some not they online because there are billions of people on earth, so we can't help but generalize though not quite accurate thing to do in critical opinions.

What about if someone just doesn't believe god exists?

Very clear cut and simple. No background. No indoctrination issues. Nothing. The concept of any
type of creator regardless the religion is absent-how would you justify their disbelief in your god?

We were all born in the dark. The problem is people see the light (to flip the analogy) thinking it makes them see when it just blinds them to the reality of the world: pain, suffering, life, and death. It reminds me of the Myth of the Cave https://web.stanford.edu/class/ihum40/cave.pdf (I couldn't find a good link with the actual dialogue)

Summary: Three or four prisoners (humanity) had been in a dark cave all their lives. The only reality they know are the shadows on the walls because of the fire behind them. They are shackled by neck, arms, and feet so they can't turn around. The reality they knew was in the shadows. One day, someone breaks free and goes out of the cave and is blinded by the light. He tries to go down to tell the people the "truth" but no one would listen.

So, now instead of looking at the people as his peers, he sees them as lost, blinded, in denial, or rejecting the truth. His confirmation of spiritual-ego has been puffed up because he turned enemy to his friends (and in my friend's experience, her friend even disowned her entirely because her light was different than my friends).

It's not that they're going against what god wants. They didn't walk into the cave by themselves, they were born and raised there --believers too--. It's the fact and opposition that believers see them as lost and feel they have some sort of mission whether door to door or "talking" about christ (reinventing the wheel) to save the world.

In my opinion, it sounds more some christians are in denial that there are people who just. don't believe there is any such thing as a creator. The christian god not God (intentional) is not special in these regards.

Five stages of grief.

• denial.
• anger.
• bargaining.
• depression.
• acceptance.

Denial. The Atheist says in their heart that there is no God.

Anger. If there is a God, I want to know why He lets little kids get leukemia.

Bargaining. Tell ya what, show us proof, and WE will be the deciders if God exists.

Depression. Quiet time, the Atheist goes on a break from posting.

Acceptance. When the Atheist reaches acceptance on a global scale, they will seek to kill God. Satan will gather them for that great battle in the valley that is symbolically called Megiddo. When the world is at war with God. Like it is right now.

Wow! That one threw me for a loop.

Some atheist may follow that line of thinking. I would see it as more (from my observations)

Belief: My father and mother told me god exist. They said he'd answer my prayers. They said if I don't believe, god will punish me. THEY told me what god should mean

Experience: So, I prayed to "their" god... nothing. I read the bible front and back. Even as an atheist when to bible school and studied the bible. Then as an adult I realized a couple of things.

1. Denial: Most likely because they are in conflict with what they are taught and what they believe
2. Anger: Using god as a scapegoat of how they feel about christians who indoctrinated them society laws, upbringing, so have you. or God should be blamed for letting children die etc.
3. Bargaining: But if I said god was the universe, intelligence, cosmos, and so forth then I can still
believe that, or agnostic position.
4. Depression: All of this time I've known god to exist but now being an adult, I have to be true to myself and in doing so, I can't think like my peers, my society, my parents, and my biases. I have to reshape the new me
5. Acceptance: I accept that I never believed in god.

Then a christian comes up to them and says "but you don't know who you are... you believe in god still, but..."

What you are really doing is devaluing the atheist's experience based on generalizing a whole population that says they don't believe god exist (per strict definition of the term).

Can you see where the backlash comes from? Not because they have gone through indoctrination withdrawals but christians just cant get it into their head that they have spiritually awakened that god does not exist, they don't need a creator, and they live their life as is. Most atheist probably don't care since spiritual awakening (to god or from him) is a long process.

I see it all the time.

More than just in this thread.

The best is in the Bill Nye video.

Because you can see it in his eyes, his facial expression.

"And this is the verdict: The Light has come into the world, but men loved the darkness rather than the Light because their deeds were evil.
Peaceful Sabbath.

Outside of the war against god, demons, and all of that odd ball stuff, I see where you're coming from but like many atheist, many christians do tend to generalize too much. Just I find it makes more sense to overly generalize christianity since you guys have so many different beliefs but atheism-there's no subset, no doctrine, no theology-so it's all on the christian and his or her biases.

 

[Trailblazer]

So how do you know, that God exists?

Because Baha'u'llah was a Manifestation of God, God has to exist.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Because Baha'u'llah was a Manifestation of God, God has to exist.

How do you know that?

 

[Trailblazer]

And again you are thinking for your god, wassup, can't he think for himself? Or us it just coincidence that he thinks exactly what you think?

I do not think for God, I just pass along what Baha'u'llah revealed about God.
God thinks and then reveals His thoughts to His Messengers.

 

[Trailblazer]

How do you know that?

Because of all the evidence.

Questions for knowledgeable Bahai / followers of Baha'u'llah