Atheist Myth: “No One Has Ever Killed in the Name of Atheism”

[epronovost]

Marx, Lenin, Stalin, etc.: "I think this..."

Chap on the internet who nominally claims to be rational and makes decisions based on evidence: "Actually, you are all wrong and you all think something completely different that conforms to my ideological prejudices."

Technically, I would say you are both right; you are simply interpreting those facts from two different frame. The goal of marxism and early maxist-leninist was to make a communist revoltion in which the old powers needed to be overthrown to build a socialist utopia. The Church was one of these old powers. Marx critique of religion isn't theological or scientific, it's political. To him, religion is an enemy of humanity because it places God above humans and anything that place somthing above humans will be used to crush and abuse humans once it gains political power. Yes, all major communist thinkers and politcians were convinced atheists and their anti-religious sentiment and politics have political concern at their core.

It would be good to note that most of the people who died and suffered under the USSR or Communist China didn't suffer and die due to their religious convictions, but due to other faillures and wars that have little to do with the place of atheism in communist philosophy.

 

[ChristineM]

If you follow your own research you will find texts like these file:///C:/Users/etien/Downloads/67316-Article%20Text-81201-1-10-20171119%20(1).pdf that make the argument that religion was a factor of stabilisation and mitigation of genocidal violence, not the opposite.

that link was to your hard drive.

My link also has links (pdf) so extracts only
"For three months in 1994, the Christian churches of Rwanda served as the country's killing fields"
"Catholic churches were the sites of many massacres during the genocide. There are countless stories of Church officials who actively participated in the killings .."
"it is argued that the presence of Christianity, more precise-
ly the activities of the Roman Catholic Church, has not only contributed to the possibility of the genocide, but has been at the root of the political con-stellation that led to the genocide, and that during the genocide, Church leaders were actively involved..
"

 

[HonestJoe]

I've heard the argumemt many times that injustices occur often in the name of religion, but I've found it interesting that the same could also be said about Atheism. So what is true about Atheistic ideologies.

I think you're missing the common point in making the statement that nobody has been killed in the name of atheism. The equivalent statement would be that nobody has been killed in the name of theism either.

There are plenty of people killed in the name of (or at least as a direct consequence of) atheistic philosophies or structures just as there have been as a result of theistic philosophies (which are typically religions of some sort). The key point would be that the typical atheist individual living today has no more connection to all of the deaths from atheistic philosophies as the typical theist living today (such as yourself) has with all the deaths from theistic philosophies.

What about those who have died in the name of atheistic philosophies such as:

For all it matters, most of your list aren't specifically atheist. I mean, on this basis, you might as well include all road deaths since cars have nothing to do with gods either. There is only one common theme to all the killing and atrocities throughout history and that is human beings. Human beings who imagine themselves to be above all of that in some way are often to root cause of the problems too.

 

[epronovost]

that link was to your hard drive.

My link also has links (pdf) so extracts only
"For three months in 1994, the Christian churches of Rwanda served as the country's killing fields"
"Catholic churches were the sites of many massacres during the genocide. There are countless stories of Church officials who actively participated in the killings .."
"it is argued that the presence of Christianity, more precise-
ly the activities of the Roman Catholic Church, has not only contributed to the possibility of the genocide, but has been at the root of the political con-stellation that led to the genocide, and that during the genocide, Church leaders were actively involved..
"

The question is then, were they invovled for political reasons or for theological ones. You cannot blame religion for the action of all religious people. That would be committing a category error. Religion itself can only be blame if there is theological backing behind those actions. The Pope didn't order the Rwadan Genocide.

 

[ecco]

...What do you say about the hundreds of millions of deaths from the above? Which come from the source below..?

Atheist Myth: “No One Has Ever Killed in the Name of Atheism”

Well, there ya go folks. The Catholic Register has an article and now we must all accept it as truth. Nah!

Let's look at a couple of the culprits the OP writes about.

Nazism. Ah, the Atheistic German Nazis who killed millions of Poles and Russians and exterminated 6,000,000 Jews in death camps. Those same Atheistic German Nazis whose military officers' belt buckles were inscribed with "Gott Mitt Uns". Those same Atheistic German Nazis whose leader fed them the anti-Semitic ravings of Martin Luther to encourage the killing of those 6,000,000 Jews.

Peter Popoff, Sylvia Browne and other gurus.

This is a joke - right? Do you really think that Peter Popoff is an atheist? Really?

Did you not bother to learn that Sylvia Brown founded a "Gnostic Christian" church in Campbell, California, known as the Society of Novus Spiritus.


I'm out of time right now. But I'll be back with more rebuttals of this nonsense.

 

[ChristineM]

The question is then, were they invovled for political reasons or for theological ones. You cannot blame religion for the action of all religious people. That would be committing a category error. Religion itself can only be blame if there is theological backing behind those actions. The Pope didn't order the Rwadan Genocide.

Who mentioned the pope ordering it?

Sorry but if religious people used churches for killing then religion was involved.

 

[Cooky]

Who mentioned the pope ordering it?

Sorry but if religious people used churches for killing then religion was involved.

Just like the Atheists in the OP killed hundreds of millions?

...I mean, if Atheists are doing the killing and all.

 

[epronovost]

Who mentioned the pope ordering it?

Sorry but if religious people used churches for killing then religion was involved.

Churches are pulic buildings where many people will seek refuge in times of danger and distress. They are "conveniant" to find your "prey" or as a rallying point for bands of killers in such a context.

 

[Cooky]

A bit obsessed with atheists lately, ain'tcha?

Well, Atheism causes so much death and destruction in the world, it's important to keep tabs on it.

 

[Cooky]

Well, there ya go folks. The Catholic Register has an article and now we must all accept it as truth. Nah!

Let's look at a couple of the culprits the OP writes about.

Nazism. Ah, the Atheistic German Nazis who killed millions of Poles and Russians and exterminated 6,000,000 Jews in death camps. Those same Atheistic German Nazis whose military officers' belt buckles were inscribed with "Gott Mitt Uns". Those same Atheistic German Nazis whose leader fed them the anti-Semitic ravings of Martin Luther to encourage the killing of those 6,000,000 Jews.

Peter Popoff, Sylvia Browne and other gurus.

This is a joke - right? Do you really think that Peter Popoff is an atheist? Really?

Did you not bother to learn that Sylvia Brown founded a "Gnostic Christian" church in Campbell, California, known as the Society of Novus Spiritus.


I'm out of time right now. But I'll be back with more rebuttals of this nonsense.

Odd... I never see you criticize all the links by The Friendly Atheist. The bias is clear as day.

 

[Tambourine]

If nationalism is an "atheist ideology", then how come that so many American nationalists are outspoken Christians?

 

[Tambourine]

The question is then, were they invovled for political reasons or for theological ones. You cannot blame religion for the action of all religious people. That would be committing a category error. Religion itself can only be blame if there is theological backing behind those actions. The Pope didn't order the Rwadan Genocide.

Does that argument only work in defense of religion, or does it also work in defense of atheism?

Can we even extract politics from religion when both have been intertwined since before the days of Constantine?

 

[epronovost]

If nationalism is an "atheist ideology", then how come that so many American nationalists are outspoken Christians?

Because Landon Caeli has a "bigorty attack" and doesn't think straight at the moment. Note that this is also the answer to your last post.

 

[Cooky]

He has a downer on Atheism at the moment. Maybe one trod on his toe at work

Do you have a problem with it?

 

[SomeRandom]

Well, Atheism causes so much death and destruction in the world, it's important to keep tabs on it.

Dude at least half your list weren’t even explicit Atheists lol. Anyone who claims the Nazis of all people were atheists needs to read a history book. I mean Hitler might have been in private, I’m not sure. But he rather famously used religious justification.
And De Sade started the Libertine artistic movement, he only killed people in his fiction. Like wtf are you talking about? The worse De Sade did is sexual assault but he was also a rich nobleman living in like the 1700s. I wouldn’t go to such a person for moral advice lmao

 

[Tambourine]

Because Landon Caeli has a "bigorty attack" and doesn't think straight at the moment. Note that this is also the answer to your last post.

It seems to be the case, but I would still like to see him try to justify his arguments somehow.

 

[epronovost]

It seems to be the case, but I would still like to see him try to justify his arguments somehow.

I think it would be better if he took a step back, thought a little bit about his own emotion and gain back control of his feelings before trying to think and express himself rationaly again.

 

[Tambourine]

The belief that there is no god was certainly a key point in Marxist ideology, and one which was explicitly utilised to justify the disregard for human life in pursuit of the 'greater good'.

Marxism as penned by Marx is actually a deeply humanist philosophy that seeks the betterment of all of mankind.

One could just as easily argue that the expectation of rewards in the afterlife caused Christians to disregard human life when they turned on each other in the European wars of religion, or the gruesome purges of the Inquisition, or the mass psychosis that were the Witch Hunts.

 

[Cooky]

It seems to be the case, but I would still like to see him try to justify his arguments somehow.

I'll just continue making more ad nauseum. Just like the Atheists do to the religious. @Skwim hardly ever defends his threads, he often just posts them and pops in once in a while. I can do that too.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

I've heard the argumemt many times that injustices occur often in the name of religion, but I've found it interesting that the same could also be said about Atheism. So what is true about Atheistic ideologies.

What about those who have died in the name of atheistic philosophies such as:

"marxism, socialism, communism, maoism, Nazism, fascism, totalitarianism, libertarianism, monopolistic capitalism, robber barronism, industrialization, secularism, jingoism, anarchism, social darwinism, eugenics, malthusianism, messianic scientism, nihilism, anti-humanist terrorism, individualism, narcissism, physicalism, materialism, consumerism, modernism, postmodernism, nietzscheism, Marquis de Sade's sadism, (i.e., sadistic murders) moral relativism, hedonism, radical feminism, (i.e., abortions, infanticide, suicide, false claims of rape) radical environmentalism, (i.e., ecological terrorism) Anton LaVey's satanism, (i.e., ritual murders) and the "Law of Attraction." (i.e., the deaths, including suicides, caused by Peter Popoff, Sylvia Browne and other gurus") All of these atheistic philosophies have resulted in the deaths of countless hundreds of millions of human beings. In comparison, the deaths caused by religion seem almost quaint and insignificant."

...What do you say about the hundreds of millions of deaths from the above? Which come from the source below..?

Atheist Myth: “No One Has Ever Killed in the Name of Atheism”

No one has killed in the name of atheism. Equally, no one has killed in the name of theism.
It's the further, more specific political, cultural and religious beliefs that have led to killing.