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Featured Atheist looking for religious debate. Any religion. Let's see if I can be convinced.

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by infrabenji, Jul 15, 2021.

  1. CG Didymus

    CG Didymus Veteran Member

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    For one thing... As if the story really happened. Why would God ask anyone to kill his son? Better find a nicer God to believe in. Next, who and when did the Bible story get changed? Suddenly, all the Scribes started writing the wrong story? And no one noticed? Even if it was an oral tradition. All the people started telling the wrong story and had Isaac being the one? Then who is more important to the Jews? Ishmael or Isaac? The main part of the Jewish story continues through Isaac. And the NT supports it being Isaac...
    Hebrews 11:17
    By faith, Abraham, being tested, offered up Isaac. Yes, he who had gladly received the promises was offering up his one and only son;
    James 2:21
    Wasn't Abraham our father justified by works, in that he offered up Isaac his son on the altar?​
    So a contradiction or both the Hebrew Bible and the New Testament are wrong?
     
  2. Truthseeker

    Truthseeker Non-debating member when I can help myself

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    Is that all you want to pick on?:p

    The Qur’án consists of over six thousand verses and was revealed by Muḥammad in 23 years. The speed of the revelation of the words of Bahá’u’lláh was about one thousand verses in an hour! For example, the Kitáb-i-Íqán (Book of Certitude), one of the most important of Bahá’u’lláh's works, was revealed in the course of two days and two nights.
    Adib Taherzadeh, "The Child of the Covenant"

    Of course just Adib Taherzadeh saying this doesn't make it verifiable. I'm not saying that. But investigate further various accounts from followers of Baha'u'llah how rapidly Baha'u'llah revealed His verses. You can find them in The Revelation of Baha'u'llah by Adib Taherzadeh volumes 1, 2 3, and 4. Adib Taherzadeh's father knew Baha'u'llah himself, and He got some of his information from his father. There are also written sources he drew from.
     
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  3. CG Didymus

    CG Didymus Veteran Member

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    I think these fit perfect. But besides, reconcile was your word. I would have used something like... Baha'i take contradictions in the other religions and change them up to get them to better fit with what Baha'is believe.

    Then why do Baha'is tell Hindus that Krishna is not an incarnation but a manifestation and that reincarnation, as they define it is not true? Why say that Buddha "originally" taught about God? Why tell Jews about Ishmael instead of Isaac was taken to be sacrificed? Why tell Christians that Jesus did not rise from the dead and is not coming back? By doing all that, those religions end up fitting much better into the Baha'i scheme of things.

    And, although I like the idea of reincarnation, it doesn't mean I believe it. I'm perfectly fine if it all ends up that they were all wrong. But I'm not going around saying how they changed things, made up things, misinterpreted thing or whatever, to get them to fit my beliefs. Baha'is do. And again, I don't believe the Baha'i Faith is correct in what they are saying, but maybe they are.
     
  4. firedragon

    firedragon Veteran Member

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    You know that its not good enough. Adibs father supposedly knowing Bahaullah is all hearsay. And anyway none of that can verify anything.
     
  5. CG Didymus

    CG Didymus Veteran Member

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    It's strange that for this there is evidence? But I guess the way it is being presented, it is evidence that Baha'u'llah is a manifestation? Still, Joseph Smith and his special spectacles and the golden plates? Made up total fiction or the God's honest truth? If fiction, then some great religious movements are based on things that aren't true. Yet, LDS has lots of members and a lot of them are very nice people. So by their fruits shall you know that their religion is true? Or by what they believe? Even if it sounds pretty fishy?
     
  6. Truthseeker

    Truthseeker Non-debating member when I can help myself

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  7. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    Scholars are in agreement that Moses did not write anything that is in the OT. Most Jews do not believe Moses wrote the Torah or that God wrote the 10 commandments.

    Nobody will ever know what happened 3500 years ago, but why does it matter?
     
  8. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    Writers can make any story sound real, but that does not mean it really happened.

    Baha'is do not MAKE it that way, just because Abdu'l-Baha wrote about one possible meaning of the resurrection.
    It does not matter if it is symbolic or not, it only matters if it literally happened or not. If you do not believe Jesus rose from the dead why does it matter so much to you what Abdu'l-Baha said?

    Jesus is dead and gone and not coming back, that is clear from the verses where Jesus says He is not coming back and that His work is finished here.
     
  9. TransmutingSoul

    TransmutingSoul Veteran Member
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    Have a worldwide community worshipping God, who uses to be divided across many Faiths, races nations and gender. That have embraced that message and changed their lives to embrace the Oneness of Humanity, the Oneness of God and the Oneness of all Messengers.

    The same potential many saw eminate from within Baha'u'llah, the Glory of God.

    Who else can achieve that?

    Regards Tony
     
    #1769 TransmutingSoul, Sep 4, 2021
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2021
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  10. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    It is a Christian thing and a Jesus thing. I don't know if all the Manifestations had the power and authority to forgive sins, but God has that power. @Truthseeker9 would probably know, he knows a lot more than me. (Sorry Duane. ;))
     
  11. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    Shoot, now why didn't I think of that? ;) Thanks for showing up. :)
     
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  12. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    But as I recall the story, God never planned for that killing to be carried out.
     
  13. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    You make it sound like a conspiracy, as if Baha'is need those religions to fit what we believe. We don't need that, we just explain what we believe they originally taught. What are we supposed to do, lie and say we agree they taught what others believe they taught?
     
    #1773 Trailblazer, Sep 4, 2021
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2021
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  14. Truthseeker

    Truthseeker Non-debating member when I can help myself

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    Too bad then. You're out of luck.:rolleyes:
     
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  15. Tiberius

    Tiberius Well-Known Member

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    Writing things quickly still doesn't prove that Mr B was sent by God.

    In any case, your claim is incorrect. Mr B wrote about 20,000 works, with a total word count of about 7 million words, according to THIS site. However, according to THIS list of Stephen King's works and their word counts, he has written over 11 million words.

    Also, the site I linked to regarding the works by Mr B show that he did not actually WRITE them all himself. He dictated many of them and they were recorded by an assistant in shorthand. Given that this shorthand could then be written out fully, perhaps with several people working at once on different sections, then that could inflate the word count unfairly.
     
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  16. Tiberius

    Tiberius Well-Known Member

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    If they have different meanings to different people, then I don't see how they could be describing the real world. The real world is not different to different people.
     
  17. Tiberius

    Tiberius Well-Known Member

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    Totally irrelevant. You are concluding there is a connection because they have the same word? That's like concluding that Star Trek is a sequel to Star Wars because they both have the word Star in the title.
     
  18. Tiberius

    Tiberius Well-Known Member

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    Oh come on, there's no way that could be anything but completely legitimate. ;)
     
  19. Tiberius

    Tiberius Well-Known Member

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    Why would Harry Potter be fictional just because fictional stories were written about him?

    I've just shown that you can't disprove Harry Potter.
     
  20. Tiberius

    Tiberius Well-Known Member

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    Lots of religions have done that.
     
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