Ask Anything about Me or my Religion (Restored Gospel/Mormonism).

[idea]

Hi,
Forgiving 70x7 is a hyperbol, unlikely to happen in real life. The message is, when a person sins against you and is truly repentant, the Christian thing to do is to forgive.

A forgiving attitude on our part is a basis for God forgiving us.
Obviously should a person sin against us followed by repentance 70x7 times there is something mentally wrong with that person, perhaps therapy is in order, nonetheless the need to forgive is still required.

The Bible does not recommend following elders in all they command, actually the opposite is true. Christians have only one master, Christ.

Turning the other cheek refers to the tradition of slapping someone with a glove to incite a fight.
Since a slave of the Lord does not need to fight, Jesus recommends to "turn the other cheek" in an illustrative manner to reject the taunt. (2 Tim 2:24)

I left the Mormon church after getting involved in an abuse case where a high priest had been abusing their children and other's children for their entire life - it was on the order of 70X7. Untrained Mormon "volunteers" had been counseling this person in "addiction support groups" but had never reported them, thought their support group and his confessing over and over again was enough, and never took care of the problem. After first failed temple marriage - everyone was led to believe his wife had problems, not him. They married him in temple again without telling new bride what happened in previous temple sealing... Everyone raised their hands sustaining him in leadership callings, believe callings are from God - sustaining leaders is following God. All those kids, watched everyone sustain him over and over again, having to sing little primary songs about following their leaders. "I know God called your dad" - I felt the spirit and am so thankful for your father - mom was Relief society president, she was abused by her dad growing up - let it continue with her husband. Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, they all abused kids.

On one hand they say things like - leaders are imperfect - but on the other hand they tell wives they cannot be saved without their husband, and temple covenants require women to submit and view their husbands as their God. I was really brainwashed with it all, can now understand other cult groups and how those people can be so sure that their various leaders are prophets etc. Elevation - different from normal feelings - what many call "the spirit" ← I've experienced that, watch the whole video - it is NOT from God. Humans are herd/social animals, it is some kind of chemical herd-bonding thing, but it is NOT from God. Grooming vs. "sooper kind" - those nice people, it is grooming.

Anyways, hard lessons learned for me, but I and my kids are in a much better place now. Despite the Church of Latter Day Saints Lawyers trying to protect itself - that high priest is now in jail for the rest of their lives.

For anyone else in this mess - and I have now met so many who have experienced the same things - do NOT ask the LDS church for help - they help themselves, NOT you. Use your local detectives and law enforcement, find therapists who are NOT connected in any way to the church - that is where you will find help.

 

[Neuropteron]

I left the Mormon church after getting involved in an abuse case where a high priest had been abusing their children and other's children for their entire life - it was on the order of 70X7. Untrained Mormon "volunteers" had been counseling this person in "addiction support groups" but had never reported them, thought their support group and his confessing over and over again was enough, and never took care of the problem. After first failed temple marriage - everyone was led to believe his wife had problems, not him. They married him in temple again without telling new bride what happened in previous temple sealing... Everyone raised their hands sustaining him in leadership callings, believe callings are from God - sustaining leaders is following God. All those kids, watched everyone sustain him over and over again, having to sing little primary songs about following their leaders. "I know God called your dad" - I felt the spirit and am so thankful for your father - mom was Relief society president, she was abused by her dad growing up - let it continue with her husband. Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, they all abused kids.

On one hand they say things like - leaders are imperfect - but on the other hand they tell wives they cannot be saved without their husband, and temple covenants require women to submit and view their husbands as their God. I was really brainwashed with it all, can now understand other cult groups and how those people can be so sure that their various leaders are prophets etc. Elevation - different from normal feelings - what many call "the spirit" ← I've experienced that, watch the whole video - it is NOT from God. Humans are herd/social animals, it is some kind of chemical herd-bonding thing, but it is NOT from God. Grooming vs. "sooper kind" - those nice people, it is grooming.

Anyways, hard lessons learned for me, but I and my kids are in a much better place now. Despite the Church of Latter Day Saints Lawyers trying to protect itself - that high priest is now in jail for the rest of their lives.

For anyone else in this mess - and I have now met so many who have experienced the same things - do NOT ask the LDS church for help - they help themselves, NOT you. Use your local detectives and law enforcement, find therapists who are NOT connected in any way to the church - that is where you will find help.

Hi,

My heart aches when I hear of things like that.
Sadly the abuse of power is present in every religion that has a power structure.

Jesus comment about forgiving is not a blanket covering of all types of sin, rather it is linked to strong, honest, heartfelt repentance, shame and feeling of guilt, only then can the principle of forgiveness be applied.

Importantly it is also about transgressions that "can" be forgiven, not about gross sins that causes unmentionable suffering and harm to such an extent that it becomes impossible for a person to extend forgiveness.
Such persons does not deserve forgiveness but should be "removed and handed over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh"(1 Cor 5:5).

We should keep in mind, that the problems does not lie with Jesus or with Bible principles. The problem lies with the fact that we insist on following man made authority structures.
We can learn from the Israelites who insisted on having a visible King to exercise authority over them, instead of being content to obey Jehovah. (they were warned of the consequences).

All of these organised religious bodies "without exception" force unscriptural policies on their members often for the sole purpose of strenghtening their own power base whilst claiming to shepherd the flock.
To these Jesus says "woe to you...because you give the tenth of the mint ... but disregard the justice and love of God! Woe to you, because you are as those graves that are not clearly visible...(Luk 11:39-)

We should keep in mind that there is no ... post-apostolic succession. No human can rightly claim to be authorised (anointed) and permited to lord it over the disciple of Christ and add rules that are not specifically part of Jesus' commands and teachings.
Jesus repeatedly warned: "many will come in my name...do not listen to them!"

Christians have only one master, one teacher, Christ.
John 15:5 "I am the vine, you are the branches" not an earthly organisation are the branches.
John 1014 "I am the good shepherd" the shepherd has a personal relationship with the sheep, and knows him by name.
Matt 10:32 "(be) in union with me" (not an organisation)
1 Tim 2:3 "one mediator..."

The only one that died for us is Jesus Christ, not any elder that demands obedience (...you are all brothers).
What you have experience is an example and result of following man made dictates.
(Do not view this as a critique, many including myself have fallen in the same trap, not to mention those born in it.)

following Christ exclusively gives a firm and confirmable hope that things such as these will be corrected in it's appointed time. "...he will wipe out every tear from their eyes... the former things will pass away"
I strongly believe we can trust that "these words are faithful and true" (Rev 21,22)

I sincerely wish you all the best.

 

[Jane.Doe]

Hi,

My heart aches when I hear of things like that.
Sadly the abuse of power is present in every religion that has a power structure.

Jesus comment about forgiving is not a blanket covering of all types of sin, rather it is linked to strong, honest, heartfelt repentance, shame and feeling of guilt, only then can the principle of forgiveness be applied.

Importantly it is also about transgressions that "can" be forgiven, not about gross sins that causes unmentionable suffering and harm to such an extent that it becomes impossible for a person to extend forgiveness.
Such persons does not deserve forgiveness but should be "removed and handed over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh"(1 Cor 5:5).

We should keep in mind, that the problems does not lie with Jesus or with Bible principles. The problem lies with the fact that we insist on following man made authority structures.
We can learn from the Israelites who insisted on having a visible King to exercise authority over them, instead of being content to obey Jehovah. (they were warned of the consequences).

All of these organised religious bodies "without exception" force unscriptural policies on their members often for the sole purpose of strenghtening their own power base whilst claiming to shepherd the flock.
To these Jesus says "woe to you...because you give the tenth of the mint ... but disregard the justice and love of God! Woe to you, because you are as those graves that are not clearly visible...(Luk 11:39-)

We should keep in mind that there is no ... post-apostolic succession. No human can rightly claim to be authorised (anointed) and permited to lord it over the disciple of Christ and add rules that are not specifically part of Jesus' commands and teachings.
Jesus repeatedly warned: "many will come in my name...do not listen to them!"

Christians have only one master, one teacher, Christ.
John 15:5 "I am the vine, you are the branches" not an earthly organisation are the branches.
John 1014 "I am the good shepherd" the shepherd has a personal relationship with the sheep, and knows him by name.
Matt 10:32 "(be) in union with me" (not an organisation)
1 Tim 2:3 "one mediator..."

The only one that died for us is Jesus Christ, not any elder that demands obedience (...you are all brothers).
What you have experience is an example and result of following man made dictates.
(Do not view this as a critique, many including myself have fallen in the same trap, not to mention those born in it.)

following Christ exclusively gives a firm and confirmable hope that things such as these will be corrected in it's appointed time. "...he will wipe out every tear from their eyes... the former things will pass away"
I strongly believe we can trust that "these words are faithful and true" (Rev 21,22)

I sincerely wish you all the best.

My heart too has aches for idea's & her family's tragic situation. They suffered horribly at this sinner's hands. As somebody who also got admitted in the terrible #MeToo camp at a young age I heart does weep. My monster was met through child care.

* slightly switching gears here *
Yes, LDS Christians do believe in that same 12 apostle structure that Christ established still being His way today. But that does NOT mean these men are perfect -- all men are wretched sinners. Christ is the master and the lamb without blemish.

 

[Watchmen]

* slightly switching gears here *
Yes, LDS Christians do believe in that same 12 apostle structure that Christ established still being His way today. But that does NOT mean these men are perfect -- all men are wretched sinners. Christ is the master and the lamb without blemish.

Some more wretched than others.

 

[idea]

We all agree on a few things. For me, spiritually, the lesson has been no relying on any arms of flesh, no religious authority figures - the lesson of Judas - apostles could not walk on water, apostles cannot heal, cannot stay awake even one hour - it was an apostle who killed Jesus in the end. ... No borrowed light, no prophets or apostles, no middlemen, no polygamous child brides, none of it.

You find your own two feet, your own wings, your own authority - no need to be blessed or have ordinaces or anything from anyone else. Your own mind, your own beliefs. All religious groups are imperfect to allow us the individual walk by the end.

 

[YoursTrue]

We all agree on a few things. For me, spiritually, the lesson has been no relying on any arms of flesh, no religious authority figures - the lesson of Judas - apostles could not walk on water, apostles cannot heal, cannot stay awake even one hour - it was an apostle who killed Jesus in the end. ... No borrowed light, no prophets or apostles, no middlemen, no polygamous child brides, none of it.

You find your own two feet, your own wings, your own authority - no need to be blessed or have ordinaces or anything from anyone else. Your own mind, your own beliefs. All religious groups are imperfect to allow us the individual walk by the end.

Unless...something else factors into the equation. Every human on this earth now is imperfect. Therefore every group of imperfect individuals is not 'perfect.' I will say, however, I believe some groups are better than others. Naturally others will disagree. I suppose. But! the Bible says something noteworthy, I believe, at Ezekiel 34:31 - "You are my sheep, the sheep of my pasture, and I am your God, declares the Sovereign LORD.’” So -- certain ones were called God's sheep, of his pasture.

 

[idea]

Unless...something else factors into the equation. Every human on this earth now is imperfect. Therefore every group of imperfect individuals is not 'perfect.' I will say, however, I believe some groups are better than others. Naturally others will disagree. I suppose. But! the Bible says something noteworthy, I believe, at Ezekiel 34:31 - "You are my sheep, the sheep of my pasture, and I am your God, declares the Sovereign LORD.’” So -- certain ones were called God's sheep, of his pasture.

The special ones in my life have all been unaffiliated - I guess that is one of the reasons that is where 'homes is for me now too.

Spiritual but not affiliated, none, and everything.

You are only free when you realize you belong no place - you belong every place - no place at all. The price is high. The reward is great.
Maya Angelou

The "nones", the nomads, the humble who do not see themselves as more special, are open to listening to all beliefs, who do not control, or judge, but love everyone as they are - these are my people. They lift me up, they help me stand, they give me hope.

They are also the fastest growing group out there, we will soon fill the Earth. . Be the change

 

[YoursTrue]

The special ones in my life have all been unaffiliated - I guess that is one of the reasons that is where 'homes is for me now too.

Spiritual but not affiliated, none, and everything.

You are only free when you realize you belong no place - you belong every place - no place at all. The price is high. The reward is great.
Maya Angelou

The "nones", the nomads, the humble who do not see themselves as more special, are open to listening to all beliefs, who do not control, or judge, but love everyone as they are - these are my people. They lift me up, they help me stand, they give me hope.

They are also the fastest growing group out there, we will soon fill the Earth. . Be the change

I don't think I belong in every place.

 

[YoursTrue]

The special ones in my life have all been unaffiliated - I guess that is one of the reasons that is where 'homes is for me now too.

Spiritual but not affiliated, none, and everything.

You are only free when you realize you belong no place - you belong every place - no place at all. The price is high. The reward is great.
Maya Angelou

The "nones", the nomads, the humble who do not see themselves as more special, are open to listening to all beliefs, who do not control, or judge, but love everyone as they are - these are my people. They lift me up, they help me stand, they give me hope.

They are also the fastest growing group out there, we will soon fill the Earth. . Be the change

Just a question - do you have any guidelines as to behavior, yours and what you think your friends should be applying? I mean would you have a real good close friend who steals for a living? That's just one thing. Of course there are other behaviors, but again -- do you draw the line with anything insofar as being friends with someone? Belonging to a group of thieves, let's use that as an example. just wondering because of your all-encompassing love everyone belong to everyone and no one type explanation.

 

[idea]

Just a question - do you have any guidelines as to behavior, yours and what you think your friends should be applying? I mean would you have a real good close friend who steals for a living? That's just one thing. Of course there are other behaviors, but again -- do you draw the line with anything insofar as being friends with someone? Belonging to a group of thieves, let's use that as an example. just wondering because of your all-encompassing love everyone belong to everyone and no one type explanation.

"The selection for social utility, must be accomplished by some social institution if mankind is not to be ruined by domestication into degeneracy." - Lorenz?

Are you suggesting that without church - without some social institution, there are no morals? Look up who Lorenz is if you do not recognize the horror of the above quote. To follow another authority figure is to give up personal responsibility for yourself. One of the beautiful ideas of America - religious freedom, no middle-man, by the people, ruled directly by God - you have to take ownership of yourself for that.

I teach an ethics unit

Are you familiar with
James W. Fowler - Wikipedia
and other stages of faith? Midlife awakening leads for many to a universal non-denominational faith

When does someone reject leaders like Hitler? They reject them when they become confident in following their own conscience. Every person is flawed, no one should be fully followed - even one's own personal opinions should be flexible and up to change when new information is learned.

William G. Perry - Wikipedia
↑ from relying on other authority figures, to:

Believe own values, respect others, be ready to learn e.g. "I know what I believe in and what I think is valid, others may think differently and I'm prepared to reconsider my views"

↑ taking responsibility for yourself, not relying on any single arm of flesh, learning from all sources, thinking for yourself and creating your own flexible views which change as new information becomes available.

You know, I actually do love the NT apostles and stories of prophets in the Bible - I would not follow every word they commanded, I do not hold them as being perfect and infallible, how they handled their mistakes and constant humiliation of being corrected over and over and over again is what makes them lovable. Real apostles apologize, show by example what repentance is, do not require anyone to follow them - it's not good to be commanded in all things Imperfect leaders = personal testimony and finding one's own personal authority. I do not believe anyone has authority over anyone else, we are all imperfect, and we all need to be as self-reliant as possible. I think that is what God was aiming for with all the different religious groups out there - imperfect groups which leave room for personal individual beliefs.

Back to the topic:
Mormons - how closely do you follow church authority figures?
Example - an older brother once shared with me they were instructed not to teach black people while on a mission. They knew in their heart this was wrong, but they stayed silent and did as they were told. → do you agree with this? Would you have (or did you) engage in racist practices prior to 1978?

 

[YoursTrue]

"The selection for social utility, must be accomplished by some social institution if mankind is not to be ruined by domestication into degeneracy." - Lorenz?

Are you suggesting that without church - without some social institution, there are no morals? Look up who Lorenz is if you do not recognize the horror of the above quote. To follow another authority figure is to give up personal responsibility for yourself. One of the beautiful ideas of America - religious freedom, no middle-man, by the people, ruled directly by God - you have to take ownership of yourself for that.

I teach an ethics unit

Are you familiar with
James W. Fowler - Wikipedia
and other stages of faith? Midlife awakening leads for many to a universal non-denominational faith

When does someone reject leaders like Hitler? They reject them when they become confident in following their own conscience. Every person is flawed, no one should be fully followed - even one's own personal opinions should be flexible and up to change when new information is learned.

William G. Perry - Wikipedia
↑ from relying on other authority figures, to:

Believe own values, respect others, be ready to learn e.g. "I know what I believe in and what I think is valid, others may think differently and I'm prepared to reconsider my views"

↑ taking responsibility for yourself, not relying on any single arm of flesh, learning from all sources, thinking for yourself and creating your own flexible views which change as new information becomes available.

You know, I actually do love the NT apostles and stories of prophets in the Bible - I would not follow every word they commanded, I do not hold them as being perfect and infallible, how they handled their mistakes and constant humiliation of being corrected over and over and over again is what makes them lovable. Real apostles apologize, show by example what repentance is, do not require anyone to follow them - it's not good to be commanded in all things Imperfect leaders = personal testimony and finding one's own personal authority. I do not believe anyone has authority over anyone else, we are all imperfect, and we all need to be as self-reliant as possible. I think that is what God was aiming for with all the different religious groups out there - imperfect groups which leave room for personal individual beliefs.

Back to the topic:
Mormons - how closely do you follow church authority figures?
Example - an older brother once shared with me they were instructed not to teach black people while on a mission. They knew in their heart this was wrong, but they stayed silent and did as they were told. → do you agree with this? Would you have (or did you) engage in racist practices prior to 1978?

I'm saying the world is in terrible shape. I'm saying that if one reaches out to God, it's possible he can be found. I'm also saying that man's laws are not like God's laws.

 

[idea]

I'm saying the world is in terrible shape. I'm saying that if one reaches out to God, it's possible he can be found. I'm also saying that man's laws are not like God's laws.

So what arms of flesh have you decided to lean on to tell you what God's laws are?

 

[YoursTrue]

So what arms of flesh have you decided to lean on to tell you what God's laws are?

I believe what the Bible says. God is the only one who can give you the gift of faith and understanding.

 

[Jacob Samuelson]

Hi @Jacob Samuelson


The restorational movement :
I love the concept of the restorational movement and it's attempt to return to the earliest version of Christian worldviews on base doctrines, whether that attempt is made through revelation or through historical discovery by historians.


An example : Pre-existence and conditions there :
The early Judeo-Christian literature confirms the early Judeo-Christian belief in an existence of spirits before the creation of the earth; the concept of God creating a plan for these spirits; a choosing of a messiah/Christ as part of his plan; the entry of spirits into mortality through birth; etc.

All of these beliefs exist in the early historical literature and are certainly quite friendly in support of restorational base doctrines the LDS believe in and the LDS claim that these were the more original doctrines.. (If you need some examples, I certainly will provide them)


Why do LDS not use the early Judeo-historical literature? :
The LDS could certainly use such early Judeo-Christian literature in their Classes without any doctrinal discontent or disharmony with their doctrines while non-restorationists cannot do this.
This seems to offer such a great advantage to the LDS and their claims.

Is there some reason why the LDS do not seem to use such early historical literature (more than they seem to) in order to demonstrate their base doctrines are a version of the earliest Judeo-Christian doctrines since the literature itself is friendly to their claims?

Thanks for any additional insight Jacob.

Clear
τωειφιφυω

Interesting thing you mentioned this, because as I was browsing through YouTube a while back and found the video below that I think did a better job at describing the LDS interpretation of the events in the Garden of Eden than I could even though it is done by a Jewish Rabbi. I am of the opinion, that we use any vantage point we can to solidify our claim of having the fulness of the Gospel. For example, One of our Apostles in the 70's Elder James Talmadge was commissioned to write an 800 page book revolving around the historical and cultural environment of Jesus Christ's life using the perspectives of the Bible, Book of Mormon, and even some Apocryphal writings that gave in depth light to our beliefs in relation to real events in those religious and historical writings. His book is called Jesus the Christ and is still the go to source for most of LDS doctrinal origins. You can read it on lds.org I think the Church of Jesus Christ of Latterday Saints has even more friendly doctrines that most people want to admit. The issue, I think, is media and the negative nature of the internet tend to only highlight the controversy and intrigue and in effect cause the doctrinal points and teachings to be buried by mountains of rumor and gossip that I believe needs to be cleaned up. I feel most information on the web and youtube if you type anything in will tend to say more about what others say about the Restored Church rather than what is actually being practiced and believed by the members today. As far as our website, lds.org. it is very soft on everything for a reason. Most people do not want to get overwhelmed by the mountain of information that might attract some people on certain issues, but disregard others, It is ultimately more important and safer that people know the basics of who Christ is first and then as they become experts get to explore the depths of the Gospel afterwards without a lens of hostility.

 

[Jacob Samuelson]

Hi,

My heart aches when I hear of things like that.
Sadly the abuse of power is present in every religion that has a power structure.

Jesus comment about forgiving is not a blanket covering of all types of sin, rather it is linked to strong, honest, heartfelt repentance, shame and feeling of guilt, only then can the principle of forgiveness be applied.

Importantly it is also about transgressions that "can" be forgiven, not about gross sins that causes unmentionable suffering and harm to such an extent that it becomes impossible for a person to extend forgiveness.
Such persons does not deserve forgiveness but should be "removed and handed over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh"(1 Cor 5:5).

We should keep in mind, that the problems does not lie with Jesus or with Bible principles. The problem lies with the fact that we insist on following man made authority structures.
We can learn from the Israelites who insisted on having a visible King to exercise authority over them, instead of being content to obey Jehovah. (they were warned of the consequences).

All of these organised religious bodies "without exception" force unscriptural policies on their members often for the sole purpose of strenghtening their own power base whilst claiming to shepherd the flock.
To these Jesus says "woe to you...because you give the tenth of the mint ... but disregard the justice and love of God! Woe to you, because you are as those graves that are not clearly visible...(Luk 11:39-)

We should keep in mind that there is no ... post-apostolic succession. No human can rightly claim to be authorised (anointed) and permited to lord it over the disciple of Christ and add rules that are not specifically part of Jesus' commands and teachings.
Jesus repeatedly warned: "many will come in my name...do not listen to them!"

Christians have only one master, one teacher, Christ.
John 15:5 "I am the vine, you are the branches" not an earthly organisation are the branches.
John 1014 "I am the good shepherd" the shepherd has a personal relationship with the sheep, and knows him by name.
Matt 10:32 "(be) in union with me" (not an organisation)
1 Tim 2:3 "one mediator..."

The only one that died for us is Jesus Christ, not any elder that demands obedience (...you are all brothers).
What you have experience is an example and result of following man made dictates.
(Do not view this as a critique, many including myself have fallen in the same trap, not to mention those born in it.)

following Christ exclusively gives a firm and confirmable hope that things such as these will be corrected in it's appointed time. "...he will wipe out every tear from their eyes... the former things will pass away"
I strongly believe we can trust that "these words are faithful and true" (Rev 21,22)

I sincerely wish you all the best.

You of course are entitled to your opinion and I will not argue that. I just want to make clear that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latterday Saints true to its name believes The Christ is the leader of the Church not man, though he has appointed Russell M. Nelson to preside as Senior Apostle of the Church the same as Peter was granted during Christs life. While there are wolves in sheeps clothing within Christ's fold, it doesn't mean the whole fold is not of Christ. As much as media tries to portray, we are not defined by the minority of cases of evil in the world but by the doctrine that supports the good we hope for in the world. The Church does take care of its own, if there is anything in this world that is going to change a person its a Church not a prison cell. there is nothing wrong with trying to help our members even don't want to help themselves at times. It is the Christian thing to do. Also it does reach out to help those in need. Abusive relationships are a people problem that I hope to resolve through a knowledge of Christ's teachings.

 

[Neuropteron]

You of course are entitled to your opinion and I will not argue that. I just want to make clear that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latterday Saints true to its name believes The Christ is the leader of the Church not man, though he has appointed Russell M. Nelson to preside as Senior Apostle of the Church the same as Peter was granted during Christs life. While there are wolves in sheeps clothing within Christ's fold, it doesn't mean the whole fold is not of Christ. As much as media tries to portray, we are not defined by the minority of cases of evil in the world but by the doctrine that supports the good we hope for in the world. The Church does take care of its own, if there is anything in this world that is going to change a person its a Church not a prison cell. there is nothing wrong with trying to help our members even don't want to help themselves at times. It is the Christian thing to do. Also it does reach out to help those in need. Abusive relationships are a people problem that I hope to resolve through a knowledge of Christ's teachings.

Hi,
Thanks for your reply, I certainly agree that it is incumbent on us to respect each other beliefs.

To put my reply in context, my post was made following a comment on Mormonism,
it touched on two issues:
First on scriptural exceptions regarding the need to forgive.
Secondly, about the right of an "elite"to impose on others their policies and to call themselves Leaders.

I know very little about the LDS, however, according to what you explained Russell M. Nelson is an Apostle the same as Peter was.

With respect, here I have a serious problem.
I know who appointed the Apostles, but who appointed Russell M. Nelson to be a "leader" and Apostle over the flock of Christ?
Did he anoint himself? or does he owe his appointment to another self promoted Apostle?
The fact is, there is no post-apostolic sucession mentioned in the Bible.
Quite the opposite is true, Jesus said that there is only one leader, one teacher... Christ.

Resolving problems through knowledge of Jesus's teachings is something I wholeheartedly agree with, that is what the Apostles did.
Leaders in today's Christian denominations would do well to remember that to serve others is what makes a Christian great, not lording it over others and making rules, policies and regulation to "control" the sheep of Christ.

 

[Jane.Doe]

Hi,
Thanks for your reply, I certainly agree that it is incumbent on us to respect each other beliefs.

To put my reply in context, my post was made following a comment on Mormonism,
it touched on two issues:
First on scriptural exceptions regarding the need to forgive.
Secondly, about the right of an "elite"to impose on others their policies and to call themselves Leaders.

I know very little about the LDS, however, according to what you explained Russell M. Nelson is an Apostle the same as Peter was.

With respect, here I have a serious problem.
I know who appointed the Apostles, but who appointed Russell M. Nelson to be a "leader" and Apostle over the flock of Christ?
Did he anoint himself? or does he owe his appointment to another self promoted Apostle?
The fact is, there is no post-apostolic sucession mentioned in the Bible.
Quite the opposite is true, Jesus said that there is only one leader, one teacher... Christ.

Resolving problems through knowledge of Jesus's teachings is something I wholeheartedly agree with, that is what the Apostles did.
Leaders in today's Christian denominations would do well to remember that to serve others is what makes a Christian great, not lording it over others and making rules, policies and regulation to "control" the sheep of Christ.

Just to clarify things here:
If Saint Peter himself was here-- the very same one that Christ Himself appointed while on the Earth-- and Peter told you to do something, should you do it because Peter told you to? NO!!! You are not Peter's disciple, you are Christ's disciple. Before you pay any attention to Peter, you yourself ask Christ Himself "hey, is the Peter man your servant?" and then you listen to Christ's answer. And even after Christ Himself vouches for Peter, you still double check Peter's guidance with Christ. Christ is the head.

Likewise in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints: Christ is the head. I check everything with Him. It's not about follow man.

 

[idea]

You of course are entitled to your opinion and I will not argue that. I just want to make clear that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latterday Saints true to its name believes The Christ is the leader of the Church not man, though he has appointed Russell M. Nelson to preside as Senior Apostle of the Church the same as Peter was granted during Christs life. While there are wolves in sheeps clothing within Christ's fold, it doesn't mean the whole fold is not of Christ. As much as media tries to portray, we are not defined by the minority of cases of evil in the world but by the doctrine that supports the good we hope for in the world. The Church does take care of its own, if there is anything in this world that is going to change a person its a Church not a prison cell. there is nothing wrong with trying to help our members even don't want to help themselves at times. It is the Christian thing to do. Also it does reach out to help those in need. Abusive relationships are a people problem that I hope to resolve through a knowledge of Christ's teachings.

Do you believe callings come from God? How do you explain everyone in the congregation raising their hands to sustain pedophiles? It's not just a few wolves in sheep's clothing. If you have raised your hand to sustain leaders, you too have sustained pedophiles.

 

[idea]

Just to clarify things here:
If Saint Peter himself was here-- the very same one that Christ Himself appointed while on the Earth-- and Peter told you to do something, should you do it because Peter told you to? NO!!! You are not Peter's disciple, you are Christ's disciple. Before you pay any attention to Peter, you yourself ask Christ Himself "hey, is the Peter man your servant?" and then you listen to Christ's answer. And even after Christ Himself vouches for Peter, you still double check Peter's guidance with Christ. Christ is the head.

Likewise in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints: Christ is the head. I check everything with Him. It's not about follow man.

So... everyone should have rejected racist policies, should have asked- what would Jesus do? Can you name an example where members followed Christ rather than imperfect leaders?

 

[Neuropteron]

Just to clarify things here:
If Saint Peter himself was here-- the very same one that Christ Himself appointed while on the Earth-- and Peter told you to do something, should you do it because Peter told you to? NO!!! You are not Peter's disciple, you are Christ's disciple. Before you pay any attention to Peter, you yourself ask Christ Himself "hey, is the Peter man your servant?" and then you listen to Christ's answer. And even after Christ Himself vouches for Peter, you still double check Peter's guidance with Christ. Christ is the head.

Likewise in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints: Christ is the head. I check everything with Him. It's not about follow man.

Hi,

As I mentioned I have very little knowldge of the Church of latter Day Saints, a quick search is supplying me with some positive information, such as being part of a network of like minded individuals, all have the power to do good to everybody, Christ is the head of the congregation and many other similar praiseworthy beliefs.

Nonetheless I did find some beliefs that are not supported by the inspired scriptures. Am I correct in assuming that an "ordained" or Apostle of the LDS Church has added these aprocryphal concepts to your belief ?

We do not need to go into these alleged differences, the simple fact that there are difference begs the answer to my unanswered question, "who ordained these men to be Apostles and leaders" ?

"make sure of the more impotant things..."Phil 1