• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Arranged Marriages

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
I realise I'm one of the few traditionalists here, and that I will most likely be outnumbered. :) But that's okay. Firstly, I want to explain what a modern arranged marriage looks like.

Firstly both parties decide that they want an arranged marriage in the first place. They're to busy with school, too shy, tried the dating game once and it didn't work, or a few other reasons. Whatever they reason, each party has come to the decision they want their parents, or in some cases, another elder, like an aunt and uncle, to help them out with this decision. They see some wisdom in it. So that's just the first step.

The second step is the parents involvement. They place ads in Indian newspapers, on-line, or speak to other people in their community, often in a different city or region, and in this way find potential candidates. It may be one at a time, or 2 or 3 at once if long distances are to be traveled when it comes time to meet. Usually an astrologer is brought in at this stage, as well as resumes of both parties, almost like a job interview. Often references are given references are checked, and all candidates are given a good look over. There may even be some 'behind the scenes checking going on, like speaking with mutual friends.

The third stage is the meeting. Its like a series of supervised dates, and the proposed couple get to interview each other as well as families. So the girl gets to see how the young man treats his mother, to see if he's a mommy's boy, and all that. The kind of food, lifestyle, expectations, and more are laid out. Ideally, there are few secrets left behind. Even things like previous relationships are brought out. At the end of this a length of mull it over time is agreed to.

The fourth stage is the decision. Either party is free to refuse the proposal. If both parties do agree, then all rejoice because there will be a marriage in the community, and it will happen fairly quickly. If either party refuses, then its a return to Step 1.

An even newer version of this is the internet version, where the parties do more interacting and sorting on line, much like internet match-ups. but more fully knowing its marriage at the end of the process.

I hope this clears up some misconceptions about arranged marriages wthin the Hindu community.
 

Skwim

Veteran Member
Firstly both parties decide that they want an arranged marriage in the first place. They're to busy with school, too shy, tried the dating game once and it didn't work, or a few other reasons. Whatever they reason, each party has come to the decision they want their parents, or in some cases, another elder, like an aunt and uncle, to help them out with this decision. They see some wisdom in it. So that's just the first step.
Does the bride/groom to-be always initiate an arranged marriage?

The second step is the parents involvement. They place ads in Indian newspapers, on-line, or speak to other people in their community, often in a different city or region, and in this way find potential candidates. It may be one at a time, or 2 or 3 at once if long distances are to be traveled when it comes time to meet. Usually an astrologer is brought in at this stage, as well as resumes of both parties, almost like a job interview. Often references are given references are checked, and all candidates are given a good look over. There may even be some 'behind the scenes checking going on, like speaking with mutual friends.
So several people are involved in weeding out the undesirable candidates?

The third stage is the meeting. Its like a series of supervised dates, and the proposed couple get to interview each other as well as families. So the girl gets to see how the young man treats his mother, to see if he's a mommy's boy, and all that. The kind of food, lifestyle, expectations, and more are laid out. Ideally, there are few secrets left behind. Even things like previous relationships are brought out. At the end of this a length of mull it over time is agreed to.

The fourth stage is the decision. Either party is free to refuse the proposal. If both parties do agree, then all rejoice because there will be a marriage in the community, and it will happen fairly quickly. If either party refuses, then its a return to Step 1.
By "party" do you mean just the two individuals? Are the two ever left alone?

What percentage of Hindu marriages are arranged?
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
Does the bride/groom to-be always initiate an arranged marriage?

So several people are involved in weeding out the undesirable candidates?

By "party" do you mean just the two individuals? Are the two ever left alone?

What percentage of Hindu marriages are arranged?

Good questions, and thanks for asking. I am no expert and can only speak from personal experience.

In my experience it is the bride/groom who initiate, by saying "I'm ready." Of course there is pressure from parents sometimes, but that depends from individual to individual.

Yes usually several people are involved, but often there is a 'head negotiator' usually either a Dad or a Mom.

The two might be left alone, but not alone enough for any hanky-panky to happen. It might be a dinner date, or a coffee date. Depends on age. Remember, neither would be likely to be in it just for the hanky-panky.

Here in North America, my guess would be about 20% now. In India, Sri Lanka, Fiji, Guyana, Mauritius, NepaL, etc., its still probably closer to 50% or higher. The internet has changed things substantially.
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
Believe it or not I see my self as in your camp.

Figures. :) But that matters not to me, nor to you, I suspect. I'm not all that extreme. No saffron terrorism here. But I don't like really watered down stuff either. Not because I'm intolerant, but because I have an aversion to witnessing confusion in people. It's sad, like war is sad.
 

Madhuri

RF Goddess
Staff member
Premium Member
I am neither for nor against arranged marriage. I think it is a good option for those who haven't found love and are ready to settle down.
The only time I would be against it is if a person is being forced into a marriage.
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
The only time I would be against it is if a person is being forced into a marriage.

Yes, unfortunately that happens. But I'm really not sure how prevalent it is. I've personally never seen it. It does make the news, and its part of the "Those guys" group that includes Islam, Sikh, and Hindu. Other religions too, within a cultural context. I just want to counteract the sweeping generalisations of 'bad' that is prevalent in the west. The fact is that it can work incredibly well. I know at least 4 or 5 very happy young couples who used it to successfully to find spouses. Two of my own children used the internet to find suitable matches. Although that left me out of it, it has several commonalities to arranged marriages, not the least of which is 'Take a good look before you leap."
 
When done right, I actually do agree with arranged marriages. I do not see them as problematic if the woman has allowance for decision making and choice. :)
 

apophenia

Well-Known Member
Looking back over my own life, and also just observing my culture, I can clearly see the pitfalls of 'falling in love' as a means of finding a marriage partner. The notion that a transient bloodrush of hormones is a good basis for such a serious lifetime decision is certainly open to question - and I think such decisions not so uncommon.

What happens when arranged marriages are very unhappy ? Is divorce an option, culturally speaking, in communities where arranged marriages occur ? What are the usual processes if it really isn't working out ?
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
What happens when arranged marriages are very unhappy ? Is divorce an option, culturally speaking, in communities where arranged marriages occur ? What are the usual processes if it really isn't working out ?

Usually there would be a trial separation, then divorce using the laws of the country you're in.

For sure, I've seen a much unhappier rate in love marriages, and divorce rate too. But my experience is very limited. I know maybe 100 couples, almost all from the Tanil community.

I can only speak for that community I'm involved in. What happens up in UP, Rajasthan, or Bengal may be another matter altogether. Divorce is certainly an option. I know a couple of divorcees who have remarried, via another arranged marriage. I know 3 quite unhappy arranged marriages, (out of about 50) both over 40 years together. Neither will get divorced, because of the social pressures of that generation. But that was 40 years ago. The youth I see getting married today have seen that, seen the unhappy 'uncle' and 'auntie', and tread with more caution.

In each of the unhappy marriages, the man changed into something he wasn't at the beginning.
 

atanu

Member
Premium Member
I realise I'm one of the few traditionalists here, and that I will most likely be outnumbered. :) But that's okay. Firstly, I want to explain what a modern arranged marriage looks like.

Firstly both parties decide that they want an arranged marriage in the first place. They're to busy with school, too shy, tried the dating game once and it didn't work, or a few other reasons. Whatever they reason, each party has come to the decision they want their parents, or in some cases, another elder, like an aunt and uncle, to help them out with this decision. They see some wisdom in it. So that's just the first step.

The second step is the parents involvement. They place ads in Indian newspapers, on-line, or speak to other people in their community, often in a different city or region, and in this way find potential candidates. It may be one at a time, or 2 or 3 at once if long distances are to be traveled when it comes time to meet. Usually an astrologer is brought in at this stage, as well as resumes of both parties, almost like a job interview. Often references are given references are checked, and all candidates are given a good look over. There may even be some 'behind the scenes checking going on, like speaking with mutual friends.

The third stage is the meeting. Its like a series of supervised dates, and the proposed couple get to interview each other as well as families. So the girl gets to see how the young man treats his mother, to see if he's a mommy's boy, and all that. The kind of food, lifestyle, expectations, and more are laid out. Ideally, there are few secrets left behind. Even things like previous relationships are brought out. At the end of this a length of mull it over time is agreed to.

The fourth stage is the decision. Either party is free to refuse the proposal. If both parties do agree, then all rejoice because there will be a marriage in the community, and it will happen fairly quickly. If either party refuses, then its a return to Step 1.

An even newer version of this is the internet version, where the parties do more interacting and sorting on line, much like internet match-ups. but more fully knowing its marriage at the end of the process.

I hope this clears up some misconceptions about arranged marriages wthin the Hindu community.

Usually there is a very important part that astrology plays. There are some techniques by which compatibility between the prospective bride and groom is checked. I have experienced that these methods are fairly good.

There is also 'love marriage' concept called Gandharva Vivaha. Eight types of marriages that have been documented are explained in the link below.

Eight Forms of Marriage from the Chapter "Marriage", in Hindu Dharma : kamakoti.org:
 

atanu

Member
Premium Member
Looking back over my own life, and also just observing my culture, I can clearly see the pitfalls of 'falling in love' as a means of finding a marriage partner. The notion that a transient bloodrush of hormones is a good basis for such a serious lifetime decision is certainly open to question - and I think such decisions not so uncommon.

What happens when arranged marriages are very unhappy ? Is divorce an option, culturally speaking, in communities where arranged marriages occur ? What are the usual processes if it really isn't working out ?

Interesting. Many Hindus believe that for passionate love affairs the nodes of moon, namely Rahu and Ketu, are responsible. Usually there will be pleasure and pain separated by time in such unions.:)
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
Usually there is a very important part that astrology plays.

I forget the number of 'matching things' that the astrologer checks. Something about 25 comes up, but I really do forget. But I do remember a few times when couples would share their results. "We got 17 out of 25." Stuff like that. Even the Hindu love marriages generally go check out with the astrologer, despite the fact they are unlikely to change their minds if they get a 'bad' report. But often it leads to something, or some trait in themselves of the spouse where there is potential conflict. This knowledge in itself can be quite useful, provided the person is sincere about sustaining a happy marriage.
 

atanu

Member
Premium Member
I forget the number of 'matching things' that the astrologer checks. Something about 25 comes up, but I really do forget. But I do remember a few times when couples would share their results. "We got 17 out of 25." Stuff like that. Even the Hindu love marriages generally go check out with the astrologer, despite the fact they are unlikely to change their minds if they get a 'bad' report. But often it leads to something, or some trait in themselves of the spouse where there is potential conflict. This knowledge in itself can be quite useful, provided the person is sincere about sustaining a happy marriage.

In north India, it is ashtkoot matching. 8 aspects of natal moon placement in bride and grooms horoscopes are matched. It will generate a score of maximum of 36. If a pair gets less than 18, the marriage is usually a no go. But love marriages will still take place. In south India, 10 aspects are checked.

I have checked with many failed marriages where the ashtkoot score was really low.
 

Breathe

Hostis humani generis
When done right, I actually do agree with arranged marriages. I do not see them as problematic if the woman has allowance for decision making and choice. :)
Yeah, I agree. :)

I'm actually cool with arranged (non-forced) marriages. I think they can work quite well. I've seen happy individuals who've been married for years and years. :)
 

atanu

Member
Premium Member
Another aspect that is usually misunderstood and maligned is that a Brahmin will not, if not forced by other things, go for a non-Brahmin, in case of arranged marriage. It is an understanding that the general temperaments of teachers, soldiers, business men, and artisans do not gel. Again, this may not be a constraint in case of love marriages. And also, in modern India, these constraints are slowly giving way to a more relaxed rules.
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
Another aspect that is usually misunderstood and maligned is that a Brahmin will not, if not forced by other things, go for a non-Brahmin, in case of arranged marriage. It is an understanding that the general temperaments of teachers, soldiers, business men, and artisans do not gel. Again, this may not be a constraint in case of love marriages. And also, in modern India, these constraints are slowly giving way to a more relaxed rules.

In the matrimonial ads, the caste is usually just a given, maybe right up there with age. It makes sense in so many ways. Not because of caste per se, but because of shared interests. And its not just Brahmins, but also similar ideas exist along linguistic or sectarian lines. Usually all that is listed out in the advertisement.

We've never had our own marriage compatibility chart done. We were sort of arranged, and I guess 37 years of her tolerating me says something. Maybe I should go get it done though. It might give her a good excuse to leave me in a ditch somewhere to fend for myself.
 
How common is arranged marriage in India vs. in the Indian diaspora?

What about "semi-arranged" marriages? From what I've heard, this is the new way to go in India, to give their children some say, but to make sure that they just don't go and marry "anyone".

I knew an Indian girl who had what was kind of an arranged marriage in that her parents introduced them and if they didn't get along they could split up. They actually hit it off pretty well and got married a year later.
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
How common is arranged marriage in India vs. in the Indian diaspora?

What about "semi-arranged" marriages? From what I've heard, this is the new way to go in India, to give their children some say, but to make sure that they just don't go and marry "anyone".

I knew an Indian girl who had what was kind of an arranged marriage in that her parents introduced them and if they didn't get along they could split up. They actually hit it off pretty well and got married a year later.

I believe its substantially more common in India and other countries with large established Hindu populations.

I do not know what you mean by semi-arranged. Did you read the original post? It's either arranged or it isn't. Atanu's link to 8 kinds of marriages might be useful too.
 
Top