syo
Well-Known Member
It does matter.
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Arguments against polytheism against the people of that time and place in Quran (various types).
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Some people, its what if their claims were true, would be Angels who were daughters or sons of God if their claims are true.
Others, earth, sun, moon, and other things are "gods".
There is all sorts of beliefs. Some of the gods are very irrational behaved beings in the myths and are very flawed. So it all depends.
The one thing common to make it polytheism, is that highest word of reverence and honoring we have, is used for more then one being.
Some people have hard polytheism model with no Creator ultimate being on top. Other soft polytheism with God on top and other mini gods.
The first is addressed with saying corruption would be the state of universe and no order be in truth established nor guidance nor a path to be guided to by.
The latter, is a semantic issue, and why God needs to be exalted above "mini gods", is explained.
To me, the Ultimate being is far above all things. If God would take sons and daughters, Ahlulbayt would be it. If he wanted us to exalt them in the same level as him with same word, they would be gods.
But God is at a whole different level. There is no equating with him. We have to have a word for him if we truly believe in his greatness. He is Unique and nothing is on par with him to be called a god with Him.
Aside from the semantic issue, with regards to who would be gods, the exalted ones also require proof from God.
Its not good enough to make claims about unseen and path with no proof. Per Quran, even following human leaders that lead astray, the hidden intention is worshiping them when we do not follow guidance from God and do not seek to be guided and only attribute God truth.
So aside from semantic issue, there is the fact, that not following God's guidance, amounts to loving and holding others as important as God and that is the intention of running from God towards others.
The exalted ones if any would be gods would be them, are a means to God, but require proof from God to know them and follow them. Not just making it up as that intention would be to equate them and others with God in terms of importance, love and respect.
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syo
Well-Known Member
syo
Well-Known Member
Deism. No worship. And, most importantly, pantheism.
syo
Well-Known Member
It does. The river is different than the mountain. We need one River God and one Mountain God, pantheism.
syo
Well-Known Member
Because spirits are maya too. If we have rivers (maya)+spirit(maya)=destruction of the cosmos. It can't be maya according maya.
syo
Well-Known Member
Ah! Well, as long as we don't call them Maya, we could call them something beyond maya.
syo
Well-Known Member
Is this God pantheist?
Yes. But specifically for me Panentheism which means Pantheism + Transcendence of God from creation.
God's Life, beauty, greatness, and honor = God's Life, beauty, greatness and honor + creation life, beauty, greatness and honor.
God's Life, beauty, greatness and honor > creation life, beauty, greatness and honor.
These two equations means Panentheism.
syo
Well-Known Member
I see. Nice!
Salam
Soft polytheism is a semantic issue. This is why Quran says "If God were to take a son/daughter, he would have taken is from who he has chosen from who he has created" and said to Mohammad (s) "Say: If God took a son, then it is me who is the foremost of the worshipers", meaning it would be Mohammad (s) himself, but how can Mohammad (s) worship God and be equated with God? It's a paradox. It's about holding a word unique for God out of respect for God's exalted nature above all exalted ones.
Hard polytheism, is a theological issue. This is where Quran says "If there was god with God, the two (heaven and earth) would be corrupted and all that is in it". This you have to see what the universe and creation and morality would be without an absolute being. And said "Are there any of your associates who guide to the truth, God guides to the truth...", meaning, Prophets and Messengers get their guidance from God, without God there is no guidance to others, and if the world was without an absolute being, there is no truth nor guidance to it or by it. This would mean there is no light path to ascend by and no absolute being to go towards, hence no direction is right nor a path wrong, all equally meaningless. And it means for soft polytheism, the exalted ones don't guide to God by their own, but are guided by God and guide and intercede upon the path and help souls by God's permission and that their light and power and guiding sustenance all emanates from the source (God), the guide guides by God and God is the True Guide in the guidance.
And also, soft polytheism, has other arguments. Even if they were not gonna call them gods, exalting beings without proof of their intermediation and intercession from God, is hidden intention of polytheism. Thus exalted ones need proof of their stations and titles and realities from God. They require proofs in form of scripture or legacy of knowledge and in reality, both, though one suffices.
Soft polytheism is a semantic issue. This is why Quran says "If God were to take a son/daughter, he would have taken is from who he has chosen from who he has created" and said to Mohammad (s) "Say: If God took a son, then it is me who is the foremost of the worshipers", meaning it would be Mohammad (s) himself, but how can Mohammad (s) worship God and be equated with God? It's a paradox. It's about holding a word unique for God out of respect for God's exalted nature above all exalted ones.
Hard polytheism, is a theological issue. This is where Quran says "If there was god with God, the two (heaven and earth) would be corrupted and all that is in it". This you have to see what the universe and creation and morality would be without an absolute being. And said "Are there any of your associates who guide to the truth, God guides to the truth...", meaning, Prophets and Messengers get their guidance from God, without God there is no guidance to others, and if the world was without an absolute being, there is no truth nor guidance to it or by it. This would mean there is no light path to ascend by and no absolute being to go towards, hence no direction is right nor a path wrong, all equally meaningless. And it means for soft polytheism, the exalted ones don't guide to God by their own, but are guided by God and guide and intercede upon the path and help souls by God's permission and that their light and power and guiding sustenance all emanates from the source (God), the guide guides by God and God is the True Guide in the guidance.
And also, soft polytheism, has other arguments. Even if they were not gonna call them gods, exalting beings without proof of their intermediation and intercession from God, is hidden intention of polytheism. Thus exalted ones need proof of their stations and titles and realities from God. They require proofs in form of scripture or legacy of knowledge and in reality, both, though one suffices.
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