1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Featured Are We In Fact Born In Hell?

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Samantha Rinne, Sep 11, 2019.

?
  1. That's not true, that's impossible!

    11.1%
  2. Maybe?

    55.6%
  3. It's gotten real umm hot lately

    33.3%
  1. Samantha Rinne

    Samantha Rinne Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2018
    Messages:
    742
    Ratings:
    +243
    Religion:
    Follower (and Writer) of the Mune Shinri
    Misfile

    Let's avoid all perceptions of Hell as a fiery place and remember that the only reason we have thar image is because of Gehenna, a burning garbage pit near Jerusalem I think it was. The only reason fire was an analogy is because this was used for ash composting.

    So moving on, the world of Hell is simply a place for trash to end up and entirely could look normal. What we mean by Hell is simply "the real Earth at a lower spiritual vibration." Think of the world on three distinct dimensional tracks. On the top track, we'll call it the Spirit World or Realm of Ascendant Dreams. Basically , to also remove the association with any specific religion, we're gonna banish the image of fluffy clouds or anything like that. Next is Earth, or the Realm of Harmony. And finally, Hell or the Realm of Forms.

    To give you a visual impression, imagine all things as if created by art. Top level is a digital tablet, with the artist able to alter or revert things at a whim. Living beings exist, because they have a sense of self, but they can transform themselves, and manifest/alter anything at a whim. Middle level is something like charcoal or oil/chalk pastels in that there is some flexibility and erasure, though the art does have some things you can do that stick around (you can spray to set). Bottom layer is clay and water color, where once you're finished it's really set in stone.

    So no, I am not talking about quality of life, I am talking about its vibration. Centuries of religion and moral philosophy have made life here pleasant, but it's entirely possible that all of us living here are stuck. So, when we say "going to Hell" what we really mean is getting reincarnated BACK into this particular realm, versus (read the comic above) graduating to Earth.

    You know all of those fantasy books with pixies and gnomes and supernatural creatures? And magical ability? That's Earth, it has them. That we don't, and that there are high rates of breakup and divorce, and that "global warming" (smirk) makes me think this is a possibility. Think about any time you had a dream or ambition that just didn't pan out without a good reason.

    So, the purpose of religion? Or in the secular case, moral philosophy? To raise vibrations to the next realm. Some of them are more or less effective with the most violent of them actually being counterproductive. Control groups tend to lower vibrations, by distracting us from thinking/feeling too much. Yes, our level of consciousness can go both ways.

    Basically, we're within Plato's Cave but we see shadows of a sunlit world. Outside the Cave is a more real world, but this world too like an underwater reflection, with the surface being the real thing.

    And these paragraphs of mine need to be in better order, yes, but you get the concept. Anyway, thoughts? Assuming this is true, what does this mean for life in general? And what can be done about the demons that want to keep us here?
     
    #1 Samantha Rinne, Sep 11, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2019
    • Like Like x 1
    • Useful Useful x 1
  2. Altfish

    Altfish Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2014
    Messages:
    8,039
    Ratings:
    +6,310
    Religion:
    Humanist
    Firstly, I don't believe in the Biblical Hell.
    But if Hell is used as a way of describing the worse places on earth; then yes, some people are born in hell.
     
  3. MikeDwight

    MikeDwight Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2019
    Messages:
    839
    Ratings:
    +63
    Religion:
    Presbyterian
    I just wanted to interject that this is not so far off from a Real Biblical perspective, that no-good forces are in charge of Earth, not necessarily your governments, but Satan may control the world until defeated. In fact the common image 'hell' is simply a fire pit that the demons are thrown into from Revelation, even in Medieval or Renaissance times. I Must assume Dante's inferno or some real recent addition has made up a common image of a permanent area.

    More complicated is that Calvinism has brought the belief 'so above, so below', of bringing God's Kingdom to the Earth actively in a sense, over forgiveness, over wailing. "A City Upon a Hill" on "Christian Charity" promotes like it did in Europe this active attainment.
     
  4. Jayhawker Soule

    Jayhawker Soule <yawn> ignore </yawn>
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2004
    Messages:
    36,767
    Ratings:
    +10,108
    Religion:
    Judaism
    I was "in fact" born in Arizona. But what do facts have to do with a question such as this?
     
    • Funny Funny x 4
    • Like Like x 2
  5. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Greased up & ready for action!
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    150,185
    Ratings:
    +42,271
    Religion:
    Bokononism
    I was thinking along the same lines...I was born in Cincinnati.
    Left that place ASAP.
     
    • Funny Funny x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  6. crossfire

    crossfire Antinomian feminist heretic freak ☿
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2012
    Messages:
    10,310
    Ratings:
    +3,441
    Religion:
    ☿ Mercuræn Buddhist & Ordained Pastafarian
    From a psychological context, the Jungian Shadow is where we toss and repress our psychological garbage.

    As for Gehenna, one could make the arguement that the sensory world can be a burning hell from Buddha's Fire Sermon. The way to escape the burning is to simply become disenchanted with sensory imput.
     
  7. Amanaki

    Amanaki Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2018
    Messages:
    4,792
    Ratings:
    +2,612
    Religion:
    Cultivator of Buddha Dhamma
    According to Buddhist teaching human realm is just 3 realm above what you call Hell. But it is different then the Christian Hell
     

    Attached Files:

  8. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2011
    Messages:
    12,612
    Ratings:
    +4,732
    Religion:
    Atheist Libertarian
    Sure, but in my experience this could be heaven, this could be hell. Kind of up to you to choose heaven over hell. If you find life to be hell, maybe you are making the wrong choices.
     
  9. MonkeyFire

    MonkeyFire Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2014
    Messages:
    1,170
    Ratings:
    +168
    Religion:
    Faithful Jesus believer
    I believe the universe were living in is the remains of heaven and one day it will rise out of it's own ashes like a great Phoenix and ever after will begin.
     
    #9 MonkeyFire, Sep 11, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2019
  10. Terry Sampson

    Terry Sampson ζει

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2019
    Messages:
    1,006
    Ratings:
    +690
    Religion:
    Creedalist Christian
    According to the current gospel of Terry, everyone goes to Heaven when they die because Heaven is all there is; unless, of course, a person doesn't want to be there, in which case: that person is in hell.
     
  11. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2017
    Messages:
    14,852
    Ratings:
    +10,382
    Religion:
    None
    The concept of hell is far older than Christianity, various places, mouths if volcanoes, deep caves were know as the gates of hell in pre christian antiquity. I have been and looked around a couple of them but can't say i was born there.

    The christian idea of hell gets more from Hieronymus Bosch and Dante Alighieri. Good to know the threats i get for not worshipping the christian version of god are based on art and comedy.
     
  12. 1213

    1213 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2017
    Messages:
    1,167
    Ratings:
    +173
    Religion:
    Disciple of Jesus
    Sorry, I believe what the Bible tells and according to it I would say, this “life” is the first death that is thrown to hell, in the end. Also, hell is a place where soul and body are destroyed, which is why I think this is not the hell.

    Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. If anyone was not found written in the book of life, he was cast into the lake of fire.
    Revelation 20:12-15

    And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
    Matt. 10:28
     
  13. Mindmaster

    Mindmaster Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2010
    Messages:
    5,098
    Ratings:
    +2,628
    Religion:
    Theistic Satanist
    The threat of Hell is simply the whip to keep Christians subservient to their religion -- mind you the ridiculousness of the concept, but in addition all the the despicable acts all of the church authorities of various denominations are involved in. If there was a Hell, at least by their definition, they're the ones going.

    If your religion cannot lead with the carrot rather than the stick it's already failed as far as I am concerned. Time to call it out for what it is -- a mind control cult full of pedophiles and other degenerates.

    The demons are simply other cultures gods and goddesses, and generally historically are not malignant beings. But, you gotta follow "our God" or you burn.... PFFT. By their logic anyone that's not a Christian goes to hell -- including people like Malcolm X, Gandi, and Buddha... Does that make any sense at all? Doesn't to me... Anyway, found it amusing even when I was a small child.
     
    #13 Mindmaster, Sep 11, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2019
  14. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    15,422
    Ratings:
    +935
    Religion:
    Christian
    I believe some people don't understand that it was used as a metaphor for the lake of fire. Otherwise we would be weeping and gnashing our teeth over the ones we have cremated.

    I believe that is absolutely counter to what Jesus teaches. He teaches that when one loses his life, he gains it. Avoiding sense may save one from pain but the person loses his life in the process. I believe that Jesus came to bring us life and that more abundantly.
     
  15. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    15,422
    Ratings:
    +935
    Religion:
    Christian
    I believe I am not familiar with that teaching. However I perceive the Buddha as a philosopher not a prophet.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2009
    Messages:
    23,377
    Ratings:
    +8,677
    Religion:
    Zen Buddhism
    I regard them as hell realms for sure.
     
  17. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    15,422
    Ratings:
    +935
    Religion:
    Christian
    I can relate to heaven being all there is but I believe Heaven is where nothing is.

    I believe such a person does not choose to go there but is sent there after the last judgement. So where then do people go? I believe they go into a new life that God chooses for them now but may have just stayed with the body in the past because a new life wan't available right away.
     
  18. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    15,422
    Ratings:
    +935
    Religion:
    Christian
    I don't see how that is possible since the last judgement doesn't occur until after Jesus has reigned 1,000 years and this life of mine will be over and I will be on tho the next one. (Not that I am going there anyway because I am in the book of life)
     
  19. Epic Beard Man

    Epic Beard Man Bearded Philosopher

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2013
    Messages:
    7,446
    Ratings:
    +3,454
    Religion:
    Agnostic-Monotheist
    Tucson during the summer time is quite Hellish indeed.
     
  20. susanblange

    susanblange Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2019
    Messages:
    295
    Ratings:
    +64
    Religion:
    Jewish/New Age
    There is no fire in Hell, the fire is going to be on earth. The Hebrew word for "Angel" is seraphim and it means "burning ones". In the book of Daniel, Daniel and his two friends were thrown into a fiery furnace but they were not burned. It was their natural habitat.
     
Loading...