Are some beliefs more crucial than others.

[Muffled]

For Christians there is a saying that a person shouldn't major on minors. A belief that a church carpet shouldn't be black seems pretty minor.

Sometimes it seems like debate over the Trinity means that it is the most important belief one can have but the truth is that even though Jesus doesn't like it when people don't believe in the Trinity, it won't keep a person from being saved.

The same is true for Homosexuality. It is debated a lot but the reality is that it is just a sin like so many others that can plague people. Probably the difference is that it is a sin that some people believe in fanatically.

I believe Jesus says anything can be forgiven accept blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.

I believe a belief in sin is very bad because the world suffers because of it. So it would seem to me that a belief in salvation from sin is important.

Considering that Jesus brought a gospel of the kingdom, I believe that message is important.

 

[Jainarayan]

The same is true for Homosexuality. It is debated a lot but the reality is that it is just a sin like so many others that can plague people.

Probably a typo, so I’m sure you meant “The same is true for Homosexuality. It is debated a lot but the reality is that a lot of people believe it is just a sin like so many others that can plague people.”

 

[Muffled]

Probably a typo, so I’m sure you meant “The same is true for Homosexuality. It is debated a lot but the reality is that a lot of people believe it is just a sin like so many others that can plague people.”

I don't know how I missed that. I believe certainly I was expressing a belief.

 

[icehorse]

I believe the Golden Rule is almost always the thing we should believe first. Whenever a different belief is in conflict with the Golden Rule, our first thought should be to be skeptical of the other belief. So for example (remember I'm an atheist), I think that believing in blasphemy is nonsense, as it often runs in conflict with the Golden Rule.

So I'd argue that all of these ideas (often with religious motivations) run counter to the Golden Rule:

- misogyny
- homophobia
- anti-semitism
- blasphemy
- pillaging the planet
- anti-intellectualism

And so on

 

[Unveiled Artist]

For Christians there is a saying that a person shouldn't major on minors. A belief that a church carpet shouldn't be black seems pretty minor.

Sometimes it seems like debate over the Trinity means that it is the most important belief one can have but the truth is that even though Jesus doesn't like it when people don't believe in the Trinity, it won't keep a person from being saved.

The same is true for Homosexuality. It is debated a lot but the reality is that it is just a sin like so many others that can plague people. Probably the difference is that it is a sin that some people believe in fanatically.

I believe Jesus says anything can be forgiven accept blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.

I believe a belief in sin is very bad because the world suffers because of it. So it would seem to me that a belief in salvation from sin is important.

Considering that Jesus brought a gospel of the kingdom, I believe that message is important.

I honestly never understood inherently or objectively how homosexuality is a sin. For example,

1. Not believing in one god is a sin. That's understandable because if you don't believe in god, your creator, than you don't have the advantages that your creator provides such as everlasting life and salvation. So, if you don't accept a gift, how are you going to benefit from what's inside the box.

2. Don't have idols makes sense. If my parent was to give me a gift and I thank another parent for the gift my parent gave me, I'd assume my parent would be hurt.

3. I understand not to take a life. If god created people and want us to continue to create, it would be counterproductive to not create.

4. I understand marriage being between male and female. If marriage is only to have children, then it is logical that two people who can only have children be together in matrimony.

However, if you disregard these things (and lying, and converting, and...) and just focused on people as people, then it makes me wonder.

If you have two people who love each other, committed to each other, are intimate, and has the same heart, mind, and body as their peer beside them, what makes their relationship and commitment a sin while another is not?​

Think about it. Once you plug "male/penis and female/vagina" into the equation, it is bias. It no longer applies to the person's heart Who people are but applies to the physical nature What people are. So you define people by their sex not by who they are created by god (or so have you).

But read it again, I didn't put in gender, nor sex, nor orientation.

It is your belief not objective. Why would the above be a sin when homosexuality and heterosexuality (to make it simple please) is not just about one's sex and gender but how one is spiritually, morally, and/or physically connected with the person they are with?

Once you answer the question from your belief, the "I believe; some people believe" would be more appropriate. It doesn't sound like a fact especially online.

 

[Jeremiah Ames]

For Christians there is a saying that a person shouldn't major on minors. A belief that a church carpet shouldn't be black seems pretty minor.

Sometimes it seems like debate over the Trinity means that it is the most important belief one can have but the truth is that even though Jesus doesn't like it when people don't believe in the Trinity, it won't keep a person from being saved.

The same is true for Homosexuality. It is debated a lot but the reality is that it is just a sin like so many others that can plague people. Probably the difference is that it is a sin that some people believe in fanatically.

I believe Jesus says anything can be forgiven accept blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.

I believe a belief in sin is very bad because the world suffers because of it. So it would seem to me that a belief in salvation from sin is important.

Considering that Jesus brought a gospel of the kingdom, I believe that message is important.

Your comments show you to be a nearly perfect Christian, maybe even perfect.
Perhaps you should now try to get to know Jesus a bit better.

 

[idav]

I think your right @Muffled about comparing belief in trinity to same sex marriage, there is nothing to justify that anything like that is crucial in the final hour. I am much more concerned about what's in people hearts. Calling wrong belief in trinity does seem so arbitrary, like we get a final exam in heaven and you better not get the abortion question wrong. Am I right?

 

[Father Heathen]

It is interesting how a lot of Christians obsess over one particular sin while downplaying all of the other ones, and they tend to be far more concerned about what sins other people are committing rather than about what sins they themselves are committing.

 

[idav]

It is interesting how a lot of Christians obsess over one particular sin while downplaying all of the other ones, and they tend to be far more concerned about what sins other people are committing rather than about what sins they themselves are committing.

Wrong belief was big time when Arians were getting exiled and witches were getting burnt at the stake. It's always astonished me how much persecution can come from Christ like religions.

 

[Muffled]

I believe the Golden Rule is almost always the thing we should believe first. Whenever a different belief is in conflict with the Golden Rule, our first thought should be to be skeptical of the other belief. So for example (remember I'm an atheist), I think that believing in blasphemy is nonsense, as it often runs in conflict with the Golden Rule.

So I'd argue that all of these ideas (often with religious motivations) run counter to the Golden Rule:

- misogyny
- homophobia
- anti-semitism
- blasphemy
- pillaging the planet
- anti-intellectualism

And so on

I believe that was the concept of the rich young ruler but then Jesus was offering eternal life and that was a new thing. The thing he was lacking was following Jesus. The bottom line is that a person can keep the ten commandments and still miss out on eternal life if he does not accept Jesus.

I do believe you will find it is number one on the list and more than likely because it is the most important.

I believe the contrary is true. It fits in with seeking the well being of ones neighbor summed up by Jesus as love thy neighbor.

I believe this is #1: Love thy God with all thy heart, mind and soul.

 

[Muffled]

I honestly never understood inherently or objectively how homosexuality is a sin. For example,

1. Not believing in one god is a sin. That's understandable because if you don't believe in god, your creator, than you don't have the advantages that your creator provides such as everlasting life and salvation. So, if you don't accept a gift, how are you going to benefit from what's inside the box.

2. Don't have idols makes sense. If my parent was to give me a gift and I thank another parent for the gift my parent gave me, I'd assume my parent would be hurt.

3. I understand not to take a life. If god created people and want us to continue to create, it would be counterproductive to not create.

4. I understand marriage being between male and female. If marriage is only to have children, then it is logical that two people who can only have children be together in matrimony.

However, if you disregard these things (and lying, and converting, and...) and just focused on people as people, then it makes me wonder.

If you have two people who love each other, committed to each other, are intimate, and has the same heart, mind, and body as their peer beside them, what makes their relationship and commitment a sin while another is not?​

Think about it. Once you plug "male/penis and female/vagina" into the equation, it is bias. It no longer applies to the person's heart Who people are but applies to the physical nature What people are. So you define people by their sex not by who they are created by god (or so have you).

But read it again, I didn't put in gender, nor sex, nor orientation.

It is your belief not objective. Why would the above be a sin when homosexuality and heterosexuality (to make it simple please) is not just about one's sex and gender but how one is spiritually, morally, and/or physically connected with the person they are with?

Once you answer the question from your belief, the "I believe; some people believe" would be more appropriate. It doesn't sound like a fact especially online.

I believe not believing what God says about is tantamount to not believing in God which is the first and foremost commandment.

I believe I can't figure out what you are saying here.

I believe the bottom line is because God says it is a sin. I could speculate on the reasons and sometimes do but there is no guarantee that my speculation is correct.

I believe I fail to see how you could reason that way. It just seems like a bias on your part.

I believe God made it very plain that He created males and females.

I believe if it were just my belief I could toss it but it is not it is what God says so I must heed what He says.

I believe the position of RF management is that there are no facts but only beliefs. So when I say I believe something then I mean that I believe it is factual.

 

[Muffled]

Your comments show you to be a nearly perfect Christian, maybe even perfect.
Perhaps you should now try to get to know Jesus a bit better.

I believe Jesus is in me. It just doesn't get any better than that.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I believe not believing what God says about is tantamount to not believing in God which is the first and foremost commandment.

I believe I can't figure out what you are saying here.

I believe the bottom line is because God says it is a sin. I could speculate on the reasons and sometimes do but there is no guarantee that my speculation is correct.

I believe I fail to see how you could reason that way. It just seems like a bias on your part.

I believe God made it very plain that He created males and females.

I believe if it were just my belief I could toss it but it is not it is what God says so I must heed what He says.

I believe the position of RF management is that there are no facts but only beliefs. So when I say I believe something then I mean that I believe it is factual.

Aye yie yie. The colors and bold hurt my eyes

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I believe not believing what God says about is tantamount to not believing in God which is the first and foremost commandment.

I believe I can't figure out what you are saying here.

Couple X: If you have two people who love each other, committed to each other, are intimate, and has the same heart, mind, and body as their peer beside them, what makes their relationship and commitment a sin while another is not?

Couple Y: If you have two people who love each other, committed to each other, are intimate, and has the same heart, mind, and body as their peer beside them, what makes their relationship and commitment a sin while another is not?

What makes couple X a sin and couple Y not just by going off this information?

I believe the bottom line is because God says it is a sin. I could speculate on the reasons and sometimes do but there is no guarantee that my speculation is correct.

Think outside the box for a minute. I'm not asking you to change your beliefs. I find it does not make sense based on the question I asked above.

I believe I fail to see how you could reason that way. It just seems like a bias on your part.

We both have bias. I like to talk about it. Makes for an interesting conversation.

I believe God made it very plain that He created males and females.

Okay...

I believe if it were just my belief I could toss it but it is not it is what God says so I must heed what He says.

It is your belief. Saying it is anyone else's is not only bias but very rude. Everyone has their own beliefs. No one has a right to say they are facts to someone else unless it is their opinion.

I believe the position of RF management is that there are no facts but only beliefs. So when I say I believe something then I mean that I believe it is factual.

It is appropriate to say "my opinion" so we know what you believe is factual without imposing that what you believe is a fact for other people.

1. I believe if it were just my belief I could toss it but it is not it is what God says so I must heed what He says

2. So when I say I believe something then I mean that I believe it is factual

If what you believe is factual, say it is your opinion. It is appropriate because it tells the person you're speaking with that you know it is a fact without imposing what you know is a fact on the person you speak with.

Also when you say "when I say I believe I mean that [what] I believe is factual" and then say "if it were just my belief I would toss it out" is very confusing.

If what you believe is factual, it is your opinion. If it were a fact, we would all know this regardless of our religions, morals, and outlook. It would be universal.

It is not. So it is your opinion.

 

[icehorse]

I believe that was the concept of the rich young ruler but then Jesus was offering eternal life and that was a new thing. The thing he was lacking was following Jesus. The bottom line is that a person can keep the ten commandments and still miss out on eternal life if he does not accept Jesus.

I do believe you will find it is number one on the list and more than likely because it is the most important.

I believe the contrary is true. It fits in with seeking the well being of ones neighbor summed up by Jesus as love thy neighbor.

I believe this is #1: Love thy God with all thy heart, mind and soul.

This could just be semantics, but I think Jesus would hope that we follow the Golden Rule before he'd be worrying about whether we're fawning over him.

 

[Muffled]

This could just be semantics, but I think Jesus would hope that we follow the Golden Rule before he'd be worrying about whether we're fawning over him.

I believe you can call it fawning if you like but the truth is that it becomes more difficult to accept the golden rule if you don't accept the authority of the person giving you the golden rule. At any rate it is still true that the golden rule will not give you eternal life.

 

[Fool]

For Christians there is a saying that a person shouldn't major on minors. A belief that a church carpet shouldn't be black seems pretty minor.

Sometimes it seems like debate over the Trinity means that it is the most important belief one can have but the truth is that even though Jesus doesn't like it when people don't believe in the Trinity, it won't keep a person from being saved.

The same is true for Homosexuality. It is debated a lot but the reality is that it is just a sin like so many others that can plague people. Probably the difference is that it is a sin that some people believe in fanatically.

I believe Jesus says anything can be forgiven accept blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.

I believe a belief in sin is very bad because the world suffers because of it. So it would seem to me that a belief in salvation from sin is important.

Considering that Jesus brought a gospel of the kingdom, I believe that message is important.

when you love someone, it's never a sin. the kingdom of Love is possible for anyone and everyone. by the fruits of love are they known because they serve love continually.

Proverbs 4:23
Above all else, guard your heart, for everything you do flows from it.

Proverbs 16:6
Through love and faithfulness sin is atoned for; through the fear of the Lord evil is avoided.

 

[icehorse]

I believe you can call it fawning if you like but the truth is that it becomes more difficult to accept the golden rule if you don't accept the authority of the person giving you the golden rule. At any rate it is still true that the golden rule will not give you eternal life.

I disagree. As an atheist, it strikes me that I'm much more willing to trust a person who follows the Golden Rule because it's simply the morally right thing to do, than to trust a person who follows the Golden Rule because they're afraid of punishment from their god.