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Are soldiers dumb animals?

Discussion in 'General Debates' started by Chisti, May 20, 2012.

  1. Chisti

    Chisti Active Member

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    Henry Kissinger made this statement, so please don't attack me for the thread title. Anyway, what are your thoughts on Kissinger's statement? Why do you think he made that remark?
     
  2. FearGod

    FearGod Freedom Of Mind

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    Somehow yes,specially if fighting without faith,but just ordered to do so.

    in case of protecting homeland,then the soldier is a hero and not a dumb soldier.

    But to fight because he ordered to do so and killing innocent people for fuzzy purposes,
    then IMO the dumb animal is better than him for some reasons.

    if the soldier is a believer,then he commit a big sin without a justified reason by attacking
    people without known reason,and if he died in the war,he will be an offender losing
    lower life and afterlife.

    if he is an atheist and died,then he will lose his own life for nothing,as for war managers will celebrate the spoils of war while having massage in 5 stars hotel.

    Similar thing,please don't attack me for my opinion,because i hate war or killing any innocent soul.

    AND FIGHT in God's cause against those who wage war against you, but do not commit aggression – for, verily, God does not love aggressors. (2:190)
     
  3. Pegg

    Pegg Jehovah our God is One

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    some soldiers defect and regret joining the army...any who do that are living by their own conscience and that would most definitely take them out of the category of a dumb animal.
     
  4. Chisti

    Chisti Active Member

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    Thanks, Pegg, but I am sure Mr. Kissinger meant it in a general way. Yes, there are always exceptions, but that's all they are, exceptions.
     
  5. Chisti

    Chisti Active Member

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    This is interesting. Thanks.
     
  6. adambaum

    adambaum Member

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    The Military is a religious institution that teaches many skills including how to kill. The indoctrination process is similar to any church. They provide a belief system (patriotism), rites (rules of engagement), tools (various weapons) and spiritual guides (superior officers). So are soldiers dumb animals? I say no, just converts to a mentally degrading religion.
     
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  7. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest I have the kavorka
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    I checked around the internet briefly, & couldn't find anything about Kissinger's intent.
    - Was it sarcasm about the waste of life?
    - Was it an insult about the men who fight?
    - Was it something else?

    Now for something completely different......
    [youtube]Wej0nlDjkpo[/youtube]
    Monty Python Henry Kissinger 21 - YouTube
     
  8. Chisti

    Chisti Active Member

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    Excellent point. Everything is essentially a religion, a belief system. For capitalists, money is God, and so on.
     
  9. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest I have the kavorka
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    Close, but no cigar.
    Money is our sacred cow.
     
    #9 Revoltingest, May 20, 2012
    Last edited: May 20, 2012
  10. kai

    kai ragamuffin

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    Do you have a link to this comment to gain some context?
     
  11. averageJOE

    averageJOE zombie

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    Yes. I'm a dumb aninimal.
     
  12. Caladan

    Caladan Agnostic Pantheist

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    Maybe Kissinger was talking about the American forces?
     
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  13. averageJOE

    averageJOE zombie

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    Explain "fighting without faith".
     
  14. 9-10ths_Penguin

    9-10ths_Penguin 1/10 Subway Stalinist
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    Apparently, the exact quote is "Military men are just dumb, stupid animals to be used as pawns for foreign policy." Bob Woodward and Carl Bernstein attributed it to Kissinger in their 1976 book "The Final Days". I can't find anything online with a larger context or saying who it was who is supposed to have actually heard Kissinger say this.

    If the quote's accurate, I'm not sure it would necessarily be talking about soldiers generally - it could be that he was talking about the generals who he would have been interacting with while he was in office.
     
  15. cablescavenger

    cablescavenger Well-Known Member

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    It was Alexander Haig, Chief of Staff who heard him say it. The US was at war with Vietnam at the time.


    It doesn't read well, it would be interesting to see if Kissinger ever defended the comments.
     
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  16. 9-10ths_Penguin

    9-10ths_Penguin 1/10 Subway Stalinist
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    Okay... so it does make Kissinger sound like quite the *********, but it does sound like he was just trying to rile up Haig, not express a sincere opinion.
     
  17. FearGod

    FearGod Freedom Of Mind

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    fighting without faith is killing innocent people.
    if protecting his homeland,then he is a hero and he is fighting and killing
    the aggressors with strong faith that he isn't killing innocents.

    Killing without faith,is killing innocents just because he was ordered to do so,
    in other words he is the aggressor.
     
  18. 9-10ths_Penguin

    9-10ths_Penguin 1/10 Subway Stalinist
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    As a "faithless" person, I find this terminology rather insulting... though I'm open to the idea that you use it because you've had your ideas of virtue taught to you through the lens of religion.
     
  19. cablescavenger

    cablescavenger Well-Known Member

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    It reminds me of the term "Just War".
     
  20. Road Warrior

    Road Warrior Seeking the middle path..

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    An order to kill "innocent people" is an illegal order and no soldier is required to follow it. There are rules of war and every war the US participates in has rules of engagement. Do some soldiers crack and commit atrocities or their own lives? Yes, but the has nothing to do with ordering them to do it.

    Laws of war - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    As for Kissinger, I think is he an elitist jerk who is responsible for the deaths of thousands. While he may not have any actual dirt on his hands, he certainly has a lot of blood on them.
     
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