Are Muslims today the same as Christians were in the Middle Ages????

[Bird123]

Are Muslims today the same as Christians were in the Middle Ages?

In the Middle Ages, Christianity held great power. They were ruling countries. Isn't that what is happening in the Muslim world today?

In the Middle Ages, how many were killed for not agreeing with the church? Even Galileo was almost burned at the stake. Let's not forget how many people were killed for being witches or for blasphemy. Are Muslims today killing others for the very same reasons?

In the Middle Ages, there were Holy Wars. Aren't Muslims in Holy Wars or Jihad today?

I read a story about a priest in the Middle Ages who took a baby from parents who were not Christian. His thoughts were that the child would be better off knowing God than being with the parents. Do you think such things could go on in the Muslim world today?

As I see it, religion is a catalyst which brings so many of mankind's problems to the surface so they can be dealt with. Couple that with this multilevel classroom and it's easy to see that there are many different levels of Understanding.

So what lessons can be learned? Perhaps, it's the lessons around freedom. If we look at God's actions, God grants everyone total freedom of choice. Isn't it mankind who constantly attempts the control of others? If God does not force people, why does mankind?

As I see it, God gave us all the choice of our actions. Our actions and choices not only define who we are, but set the lessons we need to learn in motion.

I think we are all supposed to interact and point each other in the right direction, however, just like God, we should allow the intelligence of others to make the right choice rather than forcing the issues.

What do you think, everyone?

 

[sovietchild]

In the Middle Ages, there were Holy Wars. Aren't Muslims in Holy Wars or Jihad today?

How is it not an oil war?

 

[Lyndon]

Maybe you should take a visit to a Muslim country like Dubai, and tell me if you think they are living like Christians in the middle ages????

 

[Polymath257]

Are Muslims today the same as Christians were in the Middle Ages?

In the Middle Ages, Christianity held great power. They were ruling countries. Isn't that what is happening in the Muslim world today?

In the Middle Ages, how many were killed for not agreeing with the church? Even Galileo was almost burned at the stake. Let's not forget how many people were killed for being witches or for blasphemy. Are Muslims today killing others for the very same reasons?

In the Middle Ages, there were Holy Wars. Aren't Muslims in Holy Wars or Jihad today?

I read a story about a priest in the Middle Ages who took a baby from parents who were not Christian. His thoughts were that the child would be better off knowing God than being with the parents. Do you think such things could go on in the Muslim world today?

As I see it, religion is a catalyst which brings so many of mankind's problems to the surface so they can be dealt with. Couple that with this multilevel classroom and it's easy to see that there are many different levels of Understanding.

So what lessons can be learned? Perhaps, it's the lessons around freedom. If we look at God's actions, God grants everyone total freedom of choice. Isn't it mankind who constantly attempts the control of others? If God does not force people, why does mankind?

As I see it, God gave us all the choice of our actions. Our actions and choices not only define who we are, but set the lessons we need to learn in motion.

I think we are all supposed to interact and point each other in the right direction, however, just like God, we should allow the intelligence of others to make the right choice rather than forcing the issues.

What do you think, everyone?

You seem to have the Middle ages and the Reformation confused. Galileo and the witch hunts were part of the Reformation and not part of what is traditionally labeled the Middle Ages. Blasphemy laws were also much more severe during the Reformation because religious disputes were much more on everyone's mind. It was the wars between the Catholics and the Protestants that drove much of the fear of witches, the strengthening of blasphemy laws, and the persecution of Galileo and others.

The Holy Wars (by which I think you mean the Crusades) were part of the Middle Ages.

One huge difference between modern Islam and Christianity of either the Middle Ages or the Reformation is the lack of any real Islamic philosophy or anything leading up to the Enlightenment. The whole idea of philosophy was denigrated by al-Ghazali a thousand years ago and while there have been periods of deep thinking in spite of that, the attitudes tend to be that such ideas are un-Islamic. In contrast, the church in the Middle Ages attempted to merge the classical Greek ideas with Christianity. This lead to a much more productive and deeper investigation into the natural world than what we see in Islamic societies today.

 

[Lorgar-Aurelian]

Are Muslims today the same as Christians were in the Middle Ages?

In the Middle Ages, Christianity held great power. They were ruling countries. Isn't that what is happening in the Muslim world today?

In the Middle Ages, how many were killed for not agreeing with the church? Even Galileo was almost burned at the stake. Let's not forget how many people were killed for being witches or for blasphemy. Are Muslims today killing others for the very same reasons?

In the Middle Ages, there were Holy Wars. Aren't Muslims in Holy Wars or Jihad today?

I read a story about a priest in the Middle Ages who took a baby from parents who were not Christian. His thoughts were that the child would be better off knowing God than being with the parents. Do you think such things could go on in the Muslim world today?

As I see it, religion is a catalyst which brings so many of mankind's problems to the surface so they can be dealt with. Couple that with this multilevel classroom and it's easy to see that there are many different levels of Understanding.

So what lessons can be learned? Perhaps, it's the lessons around freedom. If we look at God's actions, God grants everyone total freedom of choice. Isn't it mankind who constantly attempts the control of others? If God does not force people, why does mankind?

As I see it, God gave us all the choice of our actions. Our actions and choices not only define who we are, but set the lessons we need to learn in motion.

I think we are all supposed to interact and point each other in the right direction, however, just like God, we should allow the intelligence of others to make the right choice rather than forcing the issues.

What do you think, everyone?

You do realize islam once held a rather large amount of power over the people who followed it and still does right? We're talking about a religion who punishes you with death for leaving. In most of the Islamic world it is a crime often punishable by death to leave islam. That Is not even to mention the whole gay thing.

Muslims also have treated non muslims like slaves for generations upon generations. Read about the dhimis and what various empires of the Islamic world would do to them. Hell read about the modern Libyan slave trade. Read about people forcing girls out of school in certain parts of the Islamic world ect ect.

Read about what so many of these migrants are doing in Europe. Sure Christianity might be a problem in places like Uganda and Jamaica for the treatment of homosexuals but by and large this is no where near the same scale as modern or medieval islam. Christianity is pretty much tame right now.

 

[Bird123]

You seem to have the Middle ages and the Reformation confused. Galileo and the witch hunts were part of the Reformation and not part of what is traditionally labeled the Middle Ages. Blasphemy laws were also much more severe during the Reformation because religious disputes were much more on everyone's mind. It was the wars between the Catholics and the Protestants that drove much of the fear of witches, the strengthening of blasphemy laws, and the persecution of Galileo and others.

The Holy Wars (by which I think you mean the Crusades) were part of the Middle Ages.

One huge difference between modern Islam and Christianity of either the Middle Ages or the Reformation is the lack of any real Islamic philosophy or anything leading up to the Enlightenment. The whole idea of philosophy was denigrated by al-Ghazali a thousand years ago and while there have been periods of deep thinking in spite of that, the attitudes tend to be that such ideas are un-Islamic. In contrast, the church in the Middle Ages attempted to merge the classical Greek ideas with Christianity. This lead to a much more productive and deeper investigation into the natural world than what we see in Islamic societies today.

Thanks for the history lesson. I did come up a bit lacking. On the other hand, I see, in time, Muslims will learn and advance beyond many of the same problems Christianity was facing back then. Just like Christianity, change will come through their own people. When one really understands, many choices are no longer viable for the intelligent person.

 

[Bird123]

How is it not an oil war?

Is it really all about oil?? Perhaps oil is an excuse to get certain parties involved with the influence. What better way to learn about freedoms than from people who strive for it.

 

[Bird123]

Maybe you should take a visit to a Muslim country like Dubai, and tell me if you think they are living like Christians in the middle ages????

There are exceptions to everything. There were Great People in the Middle Ages too. Diversity will supply enough views so that the learning will move forward. As I see it, there are many people today far advanced above anything religion teaches today.

 

[Rival]

Well the Muslim calender still is only in their 15th century.

 

[sun rise]

If you look at the history of Islamic Spain Cities of Light: The Rise and Fall of Islamic Spain for example, there was a stream of Islam that was moderate for much of its history but then invited in the fanatics toward the end.

So, yes, the streams of moderate and fanatical Islam have been in existence for many centuries. Thus today's struggle in Islam should be looked at from the historical context.

 

[Bird123]

You do realize islam once held a rather large amount of power over the people who followed it and still does right? We're talking about a religion who punishes you with death for leaving. In most of the Islamic world it is a crime often punishable by death to leave islam. That Is not even to mention the whole gay thing.

Muslims also have treated non muslims like slaves for generations upon generations. Read about the dhimis and what various empires of the Islamic world would do to them. Hell read about the modern Libyan slave trade. Read about people forcing girls out of school in certain parts of the Islamic world ect ect.

Read about what so many of these migrants are doing in Europe. Sure Christianity might be a problem in places like Uganda and Jamaica for the treatment of homosexuals but by and large this is no where near the same scale as modern or medieval islam. Christianity is pretty much tame right now.

Yes, Christianity is tame right now. They have learned many lessons Muslims have not. On the other hand, in the past I see that Christianity did act much like Muslims today. Muslims will also advance to be tame in the future once the lessons are learned.

 

[Bird123]

Well the Muslim calender still is only in their 15th century.

Yes, learning does take time.

 

[LuisDantas]

There are similarities, but I think they are overstated. There are several very significant contrasts between the two situations.

Islaam is considerably more closed a system than Christianity, and it includes specific claims that Christianity did not feel the need to make.

Christianity did not really have much of a precursor where to learn from, and it does not define itself in terms of another belief anywhere near to the extent that Islaam does.

 

[Bird123]

If you look at the history of Islamic Spain Cities of Light: The Rise and Fall of Islamic Spain for example, there was a stream of Islam that was moderate for much of its history but then invited in the fanatics toward the end.

So, yes, the streams of moderate and fanatical Islam have been in existence for many centuries. Thus today's struggle in Islam should be looked at from the historical context.

Carry on wayward children. There will be Peace when you are done. I think you are right. The Darkness will pass in time to make way for a new dawn. They are just not through learning yet.

 

[LuisDantas]

Yes, Christianity is tame right now. They have learned many lessons Muslims have not. On the other hand, in the past I see that Christianity did act much like Muslims today. Muslims will also advance to be tame in the future once the lessons are learned.

Except that there seems to be a clear pattern that when that happens they decide to no longer be Muslims - thereby making targets of themselves.

 

[Bird123]

There are similarities, but I think they are overstated. There are several very significant contrasts between the two situations.

Islaam is considerably more closed a system than Christianity, and it includes specific claims that Christianity did not feel the need to make.

Christianity did not really have much of a precursor where to learn from, and it does not define itself in terms of another belief anywhere near to the extent that Islaam does.

Will the human desire for freedom along with the advancement in knowledge and education unravel the bonds of control over people? At what point does the intelligent man say no more? Isn't much of this what lead Christianity out of the ruling and controlling business?

 

[Bird123]

Except that there seems to be a clear pattern that when that happens they decide to no longer be Muslims - thereby making targets of themselves.

Does this not invite revolt? As I see it, it's just a matter of time.

 

[LuisDantas]

Does this not invite revolt? As I see it, it's just a matter of time.

Yes, it does and it did.

 

[Lorgar-Aurelian]

If you look at the history of Islamic Spain Cities of Light: The Rise and Fall of Islamic Spain for example, there was a stream of Islam that was moderate for much of its history but then invited in the fanatics toward the end.

So, yes, the streams of moderate and fanatical Islam have been in existence for many centuries. Thus today's struggle in Islam should be looked at from the historical context.

I would suggest you do a bit more research on Islamic spain, it was not a paradise of tolerance by any means. Books like the myth of Andalusian paradise show how this is pretty much pure fiction. Then again it seems people are more inclined to believe pretty lies than hard truths.

 

[sun rise]

I would suggest you do a bit more research on Islamic spain, it was not a paradise of tolerance by any means. Books like the myth of Andalusian paradise show how this is pretty much pure fiction. Then again it seems people are more inclined to believe pretty lies than hard truths.

You assume I did not do such research. And where did I use the word "paradise"?